And that’s a much more reasonable position than treating it like a fully proven combat vehicle. I completely agree it’s plausible the conversion functioned — Germany successfully rebored Soviet guns and adapted captured equipment many times. My issue is just with the certainty some people give it.
Because at the end of the day, almost every argument for the T-34-88/K20 being operational comes down to inference:
- ‘the engineers probably made it work,’
- ‘it likely fought,’
- ‘documents were probably lost,’
- ‘it was probably sent out because it worked.’
And those are all possible, but they’re still speculation, not hard evidence.
The SU-88 comparison also isn’t perfect because we actually know far more about German/Soviet field gun conversions in general than we do about the K20 specifically. The existence of successful conversions elsewhere does not automatically prove this exact vehicle was fully combat-ready.
So I’m not arguing it was fake or impossible. I’m arguing that the historical confidence level people give it is way higher than the evidence really supports.
True evidence that gajin was looking at adding it.
Because that’s all there is lmao I’d love to find a document saying it worked but nothing like that exists it worked after the Soviet capture and it’s unlikely they’d waste money on refurbishing a broken tank WITH ALSO THE WRONG BARREL
Not but it has battle damage it was penetrated frontally where something really wouldn’t of happen by Germans it points towards it fought the Soviets at some point and clearly lost
The Soviets refurbishing it doesn’t automatically prove it was a successful German combat conversion beforehand. The USSR tested, recovered and rebuilt tons of enemy equipment purely for evaluation, intelligence, engineering analysis or experimentation. The Maus is a perfect example: the Soviets rebuilt one from two damaged prototypes after the war for testing purposes, despite it never being an operational combat vehicle. Same with many captured German prototypes and partial vehicles.
So the fact the Soviets considered the K20 interesting enough to inspect or refurbish only proves it existed and had value as a technical object — not necessarily that it was a reliable frontline tank in German service. And only a very few Tiger-1 have survived the war, so to test the short 88, they probably had to rely on other sources of 88, such as this one.
And as for the barrel, we have no idea how they used it. It might have blown up with a compression test, which could be logic to have experimental informations about a very theorical domain; we don’t just blow barrel to try those, even in the past. All that just to say it might have been tested to shoot 5 shells, then barrel exploded, then they just threw it.
Not their own equipment tho lmao what would their to learn from it conversions? It was anything special compared to the towed anti tank guns
Well they only mounted the turret and chassis for propaganda purposes they didn’t actually test or trial it lmao just kinda show it off
What the Soviets captured quite a few of lmao there was well documented tests for thoses same with panthers and tigers 2s they didn’t need the 8.8 t34 that’s why it was pretty much instantly sent to refurbishment in 46.
The Soviets fully tested and evaluated tigers in mid 43
As we see here there was actually 2 captured in the same day. The Soviet military kept and trialed the tigers and panthers until they fully broke down
Tiger 1s were actually used in combat with the Red Army.
Didn’t know that part but makes my point even better they didn’t need to fix the t34 88 If it was broken and out of commission. Would of been useless for them to fix it
That’s why it’s such an obscure vehicle. We don’t know much about it. Not saying you’re wrong.
All we really have are Soviet documents confirming it was a real vehicle and the images ofc.
We’ll imo at least it makes 0 sense for them to fix it let’s say if the engine was broken it just doesn’t line up with what we know they repaired normally it was only running vehicles to keep everything simple and running smooth
And ofc the German eye witnesses although that’s still eye witness there were some German documents too confirming some of it but Soviets made it concrete
But that’s exactly my point: the Soviets didn’t need the T-34-88 as a practical combat vehicle to still find it interesting. A German attempt to mount a KwK 36-derived 88 mm system into a T-34 chassis is already unusual enough from an engineering standpoint to inspect, especially postwar when everyone was studying everyone else’s solutions.
And the Maus absolutely was tested beyond pure propaganda. The Soviets recovered the V1 hull and V2 turret, assembled a complete vehicle from both, and conducted mobility and firing evaluations at Kubinka. Same thing happened with Panthers, Tigers, Jagdtigers, etc. Captured vehicles were constantly rebuilt or restored for analysis, not because they were proven frontline successes.
Also, the fact the USSR already had extensive experience with German 88s, they were probably interested in the integration itself — recoil handling, turret fitment, ammunition storage, transmission strain, crew ergonomics, reliability, etc. They could have changed things to make it fit better; and maybe a key point of by example the recoil handling.
For the captured ones: There was the Tiger n°100, captured in Leningrad, and I think a couple near Kursk (from the picture ?), and those are the only more or less ‘fonctional’ one’s; other were abandoned after being hit, or as instructed to Tiger 1 crew, put explosive inside before leaving; the crew of the 131 forgot that or it didn’t worked, giving the only perfect state of the Tiger 1. Germany actually bombed the next day the position to try to destroy it.
The first Tiger taken by the russian forces (n°100) was the one that permitted russian troups to finally understand the weakspots on the Tiger I; only at the end of '43.
PS:
The pic you gave is from the n°100;
Here is the same.
The n°100 at the test range, in Kubinka (near Moscow).
Edit: the n°100 wasn’t alone; the number 121 was tested for the armor, and the 100 was still in a single piece in the pictures because it was used to test the barrel against russian tanks.
poor guy
Just blatant lies here lmao maybe they tested its mobility but the guns were functional lmao the turret housing was damaged
Not really when it comes to the tigers and panthers in particular they are ran until they broke and not repair after that while some tanks like panzer 4s were repaired the heavier tanks weren’t
Girl no it wasn’t that’s fake it was a possible idea to fit the 100mm gun to a tiger it wasn’t worked on it was never made
Ballistic test if you prefer, i was thinking about shooting on it.
That actually supports my point more than yours. The Soviets already knew Tigers and Panthers were valuable combat vehicles from direct battlefield experience, so they tested and ran them extensively because they were proven enemy heavy tanks.
The T-34-88/K20 is completely different: there’s no comparable combat record attached to it. No reports, no confirmed engagements, no operational history. So if the Soviets refurbished or inspected it, that doesn’t automatically mean they viewed it as some successful frontline machine — it could simply have been an unusual engineering conversion worth examining.
And even with Tigers and Panthers, the Soviets still constantly recovered, repaired and evaluated vehicles for technical intelligence purposes. That’s literally how Kubinka (the shooting range) built up its collection. The fact a vehicle was studied or rebuilt is not proof it was combat-proven or even reliable.
As for the T-IV-100, my bad, I missed my shot; it was the Tiger 100 that was exposed, and the T-IV-100 was the plan of putting a 100mm inside; it was more than worked on, even accepted by high command. But when the green flag was given, it’s armor was already obsolete.
And please stop using words as “blantant lies” or “girl”. I’m not trying to ‘lie’ as you say (the only one here who said the VT-4 was never used by Thaïland is you, or that we have proof the K20 was fully operational and saw fights because “it was logic”), and I’m not your girl. It’s pretty boring. I’m just here to give my POV on the K20, and respond to your ‘wrong’ allegations.
I believe Leo2A6EX ment there was no proof of it about to be added ingame, not the existence of the Thai VT-4
this is so gonna be either an event vehicle or a paid-for battle pass vehicle
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It is said by a CM in a Q&A, last september.
My bad, I let that one slip in.
They also had nothing close of their own for another year
Shouldn’t be added for the Soviet at all 🤷♀️
Never said they didn’t use vt4 recheck what I said and for what we know it was operational
