The lower plate is not a weakspot in terms of armor. The main composite module reaches to the crews feet. And theres the APS as well.
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And where are the sources? Because i love when the sources are sources
What do you find contentious about it? If you wanna know about Relikt go to Nii Stali´s website. If you wanna know about base armor, any of the specialized reputable blogs will do.
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nah you can send me the sources for the specific armor values cuz i havent seen a single source claiming 800 or 850, you cant just dodge the question by saying you got it from websites without linking or at least showing me some bits of proof
No, I´m saying you can stop being lazy because these have been shared hundreds of times in these very forums through the years and its what Gaijin is running with in the end.
Again, I don´t know what do you find contentious about the values I just mentioned (which is just 550-600mm for base armor substracted from T-72B plus 250mm for Relikt).
Now just for the Relikt stuff because some people might find it difficult googling stuff.
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its not laziness im just asking for something fair, someone backing up their arguments with sources, and i asked you and it seems like if i was in the wrong for asking you sources idk what’s wrong with that + that website seems absolutely unreliable as a source, do You have any official document of tests or anything regarding where that websites got the info from?
We dont know the thickness of the plate or armour array. In game every tank can be penetrated through the lower plate by its contemporaries.
APS is another one, it is rumoured to have a Kinetic projectile kill system for darts and anti radar/IR/laser masking for missiles.
The additional weight will make it sluggish compared to the T series it replaces. The fire power from the 152mm gun is an upgrade (why add it with the 125mm) rate of fire with the new loader is rumoured to be an upgrade over the carousel loader. 152mm penetration will be great but again maps are tiny being able to hit targets 6km away is irrelevant.
I still think its a flawed concept and will never enter service as it currently is.
Maus never entered service
Still in game
For maps when it is added with AbramsX and so on there will likely be even larger maps
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I mean the real world vehicle, of course you can put it in game.
I see massive lessons learned from Western designed tanks (Leopard 2A6/M1) have been captured and studied intensively
We are at a point now where we should/could have larger maps and we dont.
That is if it have same horespower per tone.
Not to mention is does have (in comparison) reverse, so at least in one aspect it already superior to T-72/T-90 and T-80
IIRC there’s at least more info about 125mm version than 152. If anything it can be just folded, right?
We are way past the point were we get declassified test derived documents. More and more top tier tanks have armor values just made up even to the point they make no sense (Merkava IV says hi).
But the source above is from Nii Stali´s website, the main institution that develops and produces ERA in former USSR and modern day Russia. It doesn´t get more primary than that.
We know the dimensions of the front armor array as precisely as we can without anyone ending up in some Russian prison. The base armor is as thick as turret armor modules on late T-80s and T-90s (about 650mm). Late soviet and early RU armors already perform as 600mm KE out of these 600-650mm thick modules only that on T-14 they have an extra 2 decades of development and use new materials (theres some kind of ceramics being used) and given the overall design for the tank, the front armor module can afford to be extremely weight inneficient (but very volume efficient in return).
What does this mean? That T-14 base armor will perform as no less than 600mm KE, and thats being extremely conservative. Guesstimations of 700mm KE or more are completly reasonable as well.
On top of this theres the new dynamic armor, Monolit. Under no circumstance it will be worse than Relikt (250mm). So the tank´s front will have a combined protection of no less than 850mm at the super absolute minimum. If Monolit represents a jump in effectiveness as significant as Relikt is in relation to Kontakt V (100 percent), then its not out of the question that it provides up to about 500mm KE of extra protection, bringing T-14 frontal protection levels well over 1000mm KE. In fact if one looks at claims by Rheinmetall regarding the 130mm FGS gun energy and performance, it appears they got to the same conclusion regarding Armata armor.
And theres the active systems the tank uses, soft and hard kill. Regarding the latter, its been claimed (not just rumored) that it can defeat APFSDS flying at velocities of up to 1700 m/s, and that was years ago. Given the lack of extensive data, Gaijin will be able to play a lot with parameters and effective distance/reaction time of the system, likely rendering it innefective in the close range engagements which are the most common ingame.
Most likely ingame performance of the tank will be so that with engagements below 1km T-14 will have a hard time, because of its lightly protected turret and APS minimum activation range. The best gameplay tactic will be avoiding close range engagements, pop smoke and retreat to strong firing positions above 1km. The tank will have the mobility to do that, with 27 hp/t and max speed of 80-85 km/h both forwards and reverse. Above 1km engagement range, T-14 will be extremely good in game. Its plethora of active systems and sensors (which might include radar integration into FCS) will give the player superior situational awareness to avoid enemy fire, intercept incoming shells or protecting the crew in case everything else fails. Hiding the hull behind cover will be the best tactic, leaving the APS to deal with the projectiles fired at the exposed turret. The western-like gun depression levels (from pictures it looks like -8 or even -10 degrees) will enable these kind of tactics.
And finally, regarding the upgunning of the tank to 152mm. As far as it is publicly know, theres no T-14 tank equipped with it. I believe that sometime in the future it will definetly appear but not in the short term and it may require some important changes to the hull and even a completly different turret module. Regarding mobility, even if the tank reaches 60 tons with these modifications it will still have an excellent hp/t of 25.
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Alright i Will search into it
K something feels off, i went to the page and there is nothing about their ERA tried copying your link and it still dosent work saying it dosent exists and now the values of relikt changing according to a post from a company cuz if i’m not wrong there has been documentation stating armor protection values of relikt, yeah the more i look into it the weirder it gets,do you mind linking that page?
Because my screen cap is pre war. Most of Rostec´s military related companies got their websites taken down or restricted their access.
Still, you can try the following
.. (catalog to various AFV protection systems including T-14 stuff)
https://www.niistali.ru/nauka/protection/dynamic_protection/
https://www.niistali.ru/nauka/protection/dynamic_protection/relikt/
Relikt page got modified, most of the data was taken down but the most important claims are still there.
K ty
Yeah sorry dude suddenly info being taken down dosent help your case, it feels like i’m being lied to honestly cuz looking back on the wayback machine dosent show anything either, your claims of armor and the lack of proof in said page really dosent help
Someone has helped me to find info and the info seems to be a claim of what they Guess M829A3 can penetrate, they have never tested nor gotten any info on M829A3 for the looks of it, this is more a way of promoting their ERA it probably protects against 800 only on very specific shells
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Well there you go. Though its not that Relikt provides 800mm of KE protection but rather it gets T-72/90 platforms (that is, together with their base armor) to that level. Since those platforms have 550-600mm KE of base armor, then you do the math and get to the 250mm I claimed for Relikt. Theres a second way to get to that level and it is simply by doubling K5 effectiveness since Relikt has twice the amount of steel on flyer plates.
Needless to say, there are other estimates that put Relikt effectiveness even higher. For example this old Ukrainian table (used to promote Nizh and Duplet) rates Relikt effectiveness at 50% KE (as opposed to the 1.4/40% claimed by Nii Stali which translates to 240/250mm KE) which would translate as 300mm KE.
and as for the base armor most i’ve heard its 400 to 450 not 550 to 600 base even with angled its excessive, again the claims for the higher armor values are still debatable due to claims of protecting 800 mm wich its not only impressive but also a bit excessive so either they are using aproximates or did a standard projectile to test this wich its most probable since they have done this before, and remember than shells like M829A3 have better effectivity against certain type of armors and ERA even if its just some percent against Relikt, also the supossed 800 mm of penetration isnt 800 the lenght its 770 mm and it uses a 100 mm long ERA tip so yeah its closer to 690 mm of pen