Im referring to the upgrade of the F-22s radar @quartas121 mentioned
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It definitely is. They upgraded already the strongest air-to-air radar in US inventory with modern F-35 radar tech. It might not be better than F-35 radar in all aspects of its functionality but its 100% better for A2A role.
the F-35 did have the best avionics when it was designed, but the F-22 being upgraded in the 2020s very likely do have better avionics now.
They are doing that right now.
Arguably Japan doesn’t have a significant enough export market to be competition, but Lockheed still got desperate enough to offer an F/B-22 derivative (that was rejected for ground up shared development of GCAP with Britain and Italy)
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The only information I can find about upgrading the F-22s radar was a concept given to the USAF about possibly doing it in the future due to delays of the NGAD
Raytheon won a contract to upgrade the F-22s
Yes but they are upgrading to incorperate better ECM, Data Link, and HMD as what is currently known
F-22s are currently being modernized under MLU program. IRST addition, HMD integration, better engine thrust profile, AIM-260 integration and changes/tweaks to existing avionics.
The issue with upgrading the F-22 is the fact that unlike the F-15 it is very hard to just slap new tech into it. Which is why it has taken them until the 2020s to even begin upgrading it with technology that some of our 4th gen aircraft have.
Again I cannot find anything regarding an upgraded radar unless you are referring to the An/APG-77(V)1 from 2007 which has been incorporated on all F-22 lot 5 and beyond.
That’s why I asked for sources because I cannot find a radar upgrade post-2007.
The AN/APG-77(1) already gives the F-22 basically all of the radar functionality of the F-35 as it was an upgrade specifically based on the improvements made for the AN/APG-81 giving among other things, ground mapping and ground moving target tracking as well as improved A2A functionality
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https://www.forecastinternational.com/archive/disp_pdf.cfm?DACH_RECNO=944
mentions new software enhancing a2a ability, and “It improves the radar’s ability to carry out
search and targeting missions.”
https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/systems/an-apg-77.htm
says upgrade had new SAR capabilities. likely came from developments of an/apg-81 but maybe not newer T/R modules? possible that F-35 and F-22 have same kind of T/R module from start.
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The F-22s AN/APG-71(V)1 uses technology from the earliest versions of the AN/APG-81 before it had finished devopment also we are planning on fitting a new radar the AN/APG-85 into lot 17 F-35s and onwards.
This is more than likely referring to the incoperation of the Link 16 DL system.
Which I will admit automatically puts the F-22 miles ahead of what it was before (and puts it event further beyond what our advisories have) but I still believe the F-35 is better in most roles except as a dedicated intercepter
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Yes
so i was kinda right then?
i wonder if production APG-81 uses same T/R modules as APG-77
prototype APG-81 probably used T/R module from APG-77 though i have no evidence to back that up with
It would stand to reason that one of the F-22 upgrades would be improvements to the radar to bring it up to the standard of the AN/APG-85 as the radars of the F-22 and F-35 have been continuously used to improve each other over time, it’s no coincidence that in 2007 with the early manufacture of the F-35 that the F-22 got upgraded and now that the F-35 is getting a new upgraded radar the F-22 is also getting an improved sensor upgrade program
I cant look at the actual devopment chart but it was kinda like the Prototype AN/APG-81 caused the AN/APG-71(V)1 which then caused the production AN/APG-81 to be a decent amount better than it was before
but wouldnt bigger antenna + more power, with the ground mode and software upgrades, make it more effective in a2g modes? only place it lacks is a2g payload capacity but it seems 77v1 is the superior radar as far I know
Imo, Su-30SM would be appropriate. Other than about 400kg’s of weight, minor control surface differences, and TVC. They’re basically the same plane.
The gaijin’d version of the Su-33 I think we’re getting is going to have a Bars radar, so all the Su-30SM will add to the lineup versus the Su-33 we’re likely to get is TVC basically.
The TVC probably isn’t a big deal either tbh. There’s more thrust coming out of the AL-31F-M1 vs the AL-31FP, and the FP only adds “extra turn performance at near zero speeds”. If you’re near zero speeds, and you aren’t 1v1 versus someone, you’re toast. Given you start near the deck to begin with (thanks SPAMRAAM), and the Flanker family still doesn’t have it’s auto recovery mode turned on (likely never will), you’ll get the advantage in that specific situation and likely crash if not careful and may even crash after you splash the target.
For US, that’s a US mains question, but I’m sure there’s another block for the F-16’s that’s possible, I think there’s an AESA upgrade for the F-15C that’s possible, and F-14D. After that I guess the Super Hornet, the new upgraded F-15E’s (pre EX), and that’s kind of it.
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