Sepv3

quartas121 · October 14, 2025, 11:33pm

Of course it was inevitable. But there were better counterparts that could’ve been added

quartas121 · October 14, 2025, 11:34pm

That alone proves me right, everyone knows the Super Hornet is a sidegrade to the Hornet and at best a slight upgrade

SPANISH_AVENGER · October 14, 2025, 11:34pm

I’m sorry to say this, but… that’s not exactly an Abrams issue.

The Abrams is, factually, one of the most easily one-hit killed tanks in Top Tier.

And even when they “survive”… this is their “survivability”: being mission-killed and crippled to be finished off in one shot. Unable to drive, unable to move, unable to shoot, unable to traverse. You are as good as dead right there and then.

quartas121 · October 14, 2025, 11:36pm

If you do survive 9/10 times your crippled to the point where it just adds maybe 10 seconds to your guaranteed death

SPANISH_AVENGER · October 14, 2025, 11:36pm

I was just adding that to the post, hahah.

Morvran · October 14, 2025, 11:36pm

id personally disagree.

My general experience is that its usually 2 hit kill tank.

Though that is with one of the weakest shells at top tier.

Even still though, its firepower and mobility combo still make it the second strongest tank in the game

Morvran · October 14, 2025, 11:37pm

This is the same for everyone.

Though Ive had a number of Abrams still able to reverse after such a hit, but ive yet to achieve the same in the CR2.

heck. I once got one shotted by a single piece of shrapnel from an artillery shell landing nearby

SPANISH_AVENGER · October 14, 2025, 11:39pm

Nearly every tank in Top Tier has mobility and firepower. Even Ariete AMV.

What truly makes the difference in Top Tier is armor protection and survivability- none of which the Abrams has.

Sure, if you sweat your butt off and play in such a way that you are never spotted or hit, you are invincible- but that goes for ANY tank, from an Ariete to a Leopard 2A7HU.

The difference is- what will happen when you are inevitably shot at?

llSolitairell-psn · October 14, 2025, 11:40pm

Abrams survivability is a bit of a meme

it’s technically true it’s the most survivable with 4 crew, fuel behind bulkheads and blowout panels, in practice it’s not much harder to kill than any other top tier

Morvran · October 14, 2025, 11:40pm

and even in that showdown.

I generally find the Abrams coming out on top. The number of times ive fired L27A1 and its made the breach go yellow or penned the LFP and only killed the driver.

Meanwhile the Abrams has fired at me and its gone straight through and hit the ammo rack and all the crew.

SPANISH_AVENGER · October 14, 2025, 11:41pm

Since we are talking about personal experiences… I hate to bring this up, but… have you got first-hand experience with the Abrams tanks, if I may ask?

Because when I check your player profile, the only Top Tier tanks I see are British ones. I am not sure that allows a player to have a full picture regarding other vehicles.

Morvran · October 14, 2025, 11:42pm

Only fighting them. CBA to grind any other TT ever again. If they increased the RP by 10x I might consider doing it and even if I did. It would not be the US TT.

But everything else, even the BVM, is generally easier to one shot. Only things that I struggle to do meaningful damage to is the M1A2s and Leopard 2s. leclercs, Type10, Ariete, T-80/T-90s. Usually fairly easy to kill

I gave up aiming for the turret ring that supposedly one shot the Abrams, because I generally found that the worst place to aim because I just got non-pen, went back to aiming for the UFP or gunbreach, though neither shot would actually be a one shot in my experience. protection analysis would support that

Gunbreach from the front would only knock out the gun breach. Doesnt look like it would damage any crew.

UFP shot would knock out the turret right and maybe 0-2 crew depending on exactly where I aim. I wouldnt hit any ammo racks and I see no reliable shot that would kill 3 crew

quartas121 · October 14, 2025, 11:44pm

I don’t have good stats with the Abrams but it means I have a lot of firsthand experience with its survivability

SPANISH_AVENGER · October 14, 2025, 11:47pm

Well, this is what I meant above.

If one is to fully understand and grasp the full picture regarding every side of a topic, first-hand experience is a must, in my opinion. Else, the view may be stained or held back by the lack of proper perspective.

That’s why I grinded every nation in the game; because I came to realise how limited my vision was on topics regarding balance, biases, etc.

Nowadays, when I make my statements, I am not only talking about my experience facing a vehicle; but also playing with it. I see the conflict from both sides, and many more;

I have faced every tank with every Abrams, and I have faced every Abrams with every other tank. I believe this gives me a comprehensive view on the matter, more than if I only had experience with a single nation.

Not like there’s anything wrong with focusing on a single nation; grinding is hard and not everyone is as sick as I am to be willing to spend so much time and money grinding trees, hahahah. And don’t misunderstand me; I am not trying to pull off an authority fallacy here either.

But that’s why I think my extensive experience in Top Tier across every nation should be taken into account on these matters.

Morvran · October 14, 2025, 11:52pm

Perhaps.

But to

A) fixate on the age of tank as proof its underperforming compared to other MBTs in game or a “bad” top tier MBT

or

B) dismiss its clear strengths over its contempories

as a clear act to justify direct and major buffs (as was the person I originally responded too was)

Is doom to failure.

M1A2 would have been fine with M829A1 shell or with 6 second reload M829A2. there is certainly no need for the A3 or A4 shells at this time and whilst I guess the Sep V3 will come eventually. It would not be this god tier vehicle US mains think it will be and I seriously doubt it will have anything stronger than A2. (im guessing Sep V2 with APS and thats about it)

If it does. If it came with M829A4 and was unpennable by anything else in game. Then Leopard 2A8 and Challenger 3 with Dm83 would not be far behind and we’d back to square one. Them asking for another new top tier MBT.

SPANISH_AVENGER · October 15, 2025, 12:01am

I really don’t like to do this, but…

In total, on Rank VII and VIII, I have:

4,218 battles in Leopard 2 MBTs.
3,863 battles in 120mm Abrams MBTs.
2,821 battles in Type 90/10 MBTs.
2,095 battles in Challenger 2 MBTs.
1,683 battles in Strv 122 MBTs.
1,266 battles in Leclerc MBTs.
964 battles in Merkava Mk.4 MBTs.
722 battles in Chinese MBTs.

Again, I do NOT like to pull off this argument. But all I’m saying is… I may have learnt a thing or two over these 17,632 battles in Top Tier.

Not because I’m an extraordinary player, which I am not; but because I have been able to experience every single corner of Top Tier first-hand; both facing it AND playing with it.

I am not fueled by any biases; neither for nor against any vehicle or nation. I only hold opinions based on my observations and experiences over this not-insignificant amount of time.

Morvran · October 15, 2025, 12:02am

and how would you order those tanks?

From best to worst?

SPANISH_AVENGER · October 15, 2025, 12:08am

I will only include 11.7-12.0s for convenience; Premiums not included.

1- Leopard 2A7HU
2- Leopard 2A7V
3- Strv 122B+
4- Strv 122B PLSS
5- Strv 122A
6- TKX
7- Type 10
8- Leopard 2A6
9- Leopard 2A6 (fn)
10- Leopard 2A6 (nl)
11- Leopard 2PSO
12- Leopard 2A5
13- Merkava Mk.4M
14- Merkava Mk.4 LIC
15- Merkava Mk.4B
16- M1A2 SEP
17- M1A1 AIM
18- M1A2
19- M1A2 SEPv2
20- M1A1 HC
21- T-80BVM
22- Leclerc S.XXI
23- Leclerc AZUR
24- Leclerc S.2
25- Leclerc S.1
26- Challenger 2E
27- Black Night
28- WZ1001(E) LCT
29- ZTZ-99A
30- TKX (P)
31- Type 90 (B)
32- Type 90
33- T-90M
34- OPLOT
35- T-80U
36- VT-4A1
37- Challenger 3 (TD)
38- Challenger 2
39- Challenger 2 (2F)
40- Challenger 2 TES
41- T-72B3
42- T-72B3A

As you can see, just because I don’t think that the Abrams is “the second best tank”, neither am I one of those who claim that “it’s the worst tank”.

I think it’s just… mid. Average. Far from the best, far from the worst. Not great, not terrible.

I didn’t add Ariete AMV because the Arietes are the only MBT family I have no first-hand experience with; but if I were to guess, I would probably place it right below Challenger 2E.