Survivability onion applies even to war thunder.
Armour is never your primary form of defense against a threat.
Armour fails the moment an enemy is able to penetrate it (which everyone at top tier can) and when the enemy knows your weakpoints (which everyone should)
Also peaking someone holding an angle is always a bad idea lol. This guy think that justifies russian bias in some sort when youre the person in the wrong for pushing someone on the point without a teammate or the proper angle.
Anyone holding an angle is at a advantage, and leo2A7V with smaller weakpoints anyway than the abrams or abrams itself with a 5 second reload are absolute killer on holding points too
To be fair, ego peeking is just too much fun, especially if you win.
Proved my point: Russia tanks not weak ,They do not have the CAS and SPAA of the OP to maintain their advantage(PS: I don’t have to compare the Russian tanks with the Leopard 2 or the M1. Please stop repeating the statement “The Leopard 2M1 is definitely better”. I know the skill of the Leopard 2 and the M1 better than you do)
I mean the kh38 are objectively better than the spice 250s, that begin said, with some luck and proper positioning the spice can kill a ton of players in a single run.
They aren’t weak, just middle of the pack/nothing special.
Tanks like the Leo 2s and Abrams are still better by quite a bit depending on which T-series you compare them to.
Yeah, but you get more SPICE 250s on an infinitely better airframe.
So whole you have some disadvantages you also gain elsewhere.
Can’t forget that you get brimstones too
TSS and APEX match mode with RB different .They provide some references, but they still cannot be “=”.
They’re better than every T-series that’s at the same br.
Hell, clickbait is probably better than T-80BVM as well
The Russian tanks are fantastic at top tier because they have the most unforgiving armor since era cant bounce rounds it will just eat them instead as opposed to like an Abrams where I can slightly mess up my shot and it will just bounce in anyways.
Russia tanks also have a much smaller profile with smaller weak points making it harder for you to get your guns on target before one of them, the post penn survivability of Russian tanks is good because of the cramped interior not letting spall spread out before hitting something and basically everything in a Russian tank acts as a spall liner in the fact they eat spall without producing any which just means most shots wont deal heavy damage to the tank, not to mention the autoloaders are just a safety net for the ammo at this point.
And honestly people love to gripe about the reverse gear but with the vast majority of maps at this pointing be straight pushes into each other what does it matter you’re never really in a scenario where you really need to reverse same thing with depression all the maps where made for low tier vehicles for the most part and as such you don’t really require you to have depression you can perfectly fine play low depression tanks on every map.
I’m not going to say that the Russian mbts are the best in the game, as the leo’s exist and they do basically everything better, but they are still on the better end of vehicles in the game.
But on terms of the topic russia’s top tier as a whole is the best lineup in the game. You have the best spaa in the game and the only one that is effective against both helicopters and planes as well as munitions. You have the best helicopter in the game due to lmurs being insane as well as dricm on any helicopter being good. Then you get the best cas aircraft in the game as the kh-38s are insane and are actively the best munition in game, not to mention said aircraft for cas is also the best air to air vehicle in game and can bring a full anti air and cas loadout at once. Like if you need the proof russia’s winrate is like hitting the 60’s right now and anytime you queue in game russia easily clears the next highest amount of players in a country by like forty people
That is until u go into a city map
Not really. They are solid, but stuff like the Type 10/Leclerc/Merkava Mk.4/Abrams are still much much better for experienced players.
And that armor comes with a lot of downsides/limitations, which makes them worse to play for a lot of good players.
You pretty much say that for Russian MBTs to be good they have to rely on the enemy player being bad, which is a bit contradicting isn’t it?
Using good armor means you hope that the enemy player you are gunning for is bad, which means leaving it up to something out of your control. Meanwhile I can use mobility and gun angles to their fullest potential while staying in control for the whole situation.
Ah yes, because 4 km/h reverse T-series sure do well in city maps lol.
There are no tanks I avoid cities in harder than the T-72/90s.
Experienced player will do well in any tank and even then it is far easier to a t series tank than a type 10, ect as they have specific playstyles that only excel in certain maps.
How does your armor eating rounds it shouldnt be able to stop have downsides/ limitations especially in a game that currently has none of the counters to said armor type.
My entire point in that paragraph is that map design basically makes the negative points of the Russian mbts nonexistent in the majority of maps, and my point with having the good profile and armor is that its harder for any player of any skill to get guns on target first? I mean if you have an ariete or a type ten you can just vaguely look at the thing and shoot where as both of those tanks have to actually aim on the t series which will then be more forgiving on what damage it takes once it gets penned. Also using mobility and gun angles is also just relying on the enemy to play into your hand and not countering things you do so once again what is your point?
True, but they will do better in certain tanks than in others.
Again, that depends on the player and their skill level/set.
I’m not an overly skilled player imo, butI absolutely despise the T-90M. My performance in the Leclerc/Type 10/Merk Mk.4/Abrams is far better with far less effort put in.
Let’s take the T-90M from the above as an example:
Advantage = Strong armor + spall liners
disadvantage = garbage mobility + mediocre firepower
So that is an extremely limiting tank to play.
Which is short sighted, because tanks like the Abrams and Merkava Mk.4 can be incredible brawlers/frontal fighters if used with at least 2 braincells. Despite their lacking armor.
Armor alone doesn’t make up for the other flaws, that is why armor at top tier is only really good when combined with good firepower, good mobility or both (see 2A7s/122s).
Partially agreed, partially disagreed. I expect at least some basic crosshair placement from good players.
You have to peek/expose yourself to use your armor, so if the enemy has 2 braincells you are dead before you even have your gun on target. That means the worth of your armor is directly linked to/indirectly controlled by the enemy player.
Armor is a single purpose tool while mobility can be used for a lot of different purposes, which is why mobility almost always gets picked over armor by skilled players. I can go flanking, brawling etc without ever depending on the enemies skill level. If the Brawling doesn’t work for example I can instantly retreat and repurpose my mobility advantage into flanking.
Clickbait has superior mobility and reload, which are more important for cqc.
Why do you think esports players priorities western MBTs in tournaments? One of the main maps is Advance to the Rhein which is a cqc hellhole.
Type 10 is a terrible tank anyways.
The mobility is abysmal when turning, paper armour and the rounds are terrible too iirc.
You have to rely on the enemy skill level being lower than yours to use flanking brawling whatever with mobility as a experienced player will just cut you off, and all your arguments really just seem to come down to your experience or player skill level. You can use armor to force engagements in your favor as well in fact its probably the best thing for forcing an engagement that’s in your favor. Generally speaking the t series tanks are all around good tanks and better to use on everymap than most tanks barring the leopards as they are the best tanks in game. Like regardless of skill or map or whatever the tanks are just good tanks they will play well for anyone.
Good mobility the first thing that improves your survivability.
It takes precedence over armour.
The same can apply to gun depression angles.
Mobility + good gun angles allow you to position yourself much better with more freedom.
They allow you to minimize how much of your tank is exposed much better than just having a lower profile helps as you’re able to leave cover, take a shot and retreat significantly faster.
Armour isn’t and should never be your primary form of defense, relying on it too much increases your chances of being penetrated a lot.
Sure, it’s more forgiving, but that doesn’t make the vehicle better.
The cramped interior of Russian tanks is also a big downside, any penetrating hit means you’re bound to damage something important.
You can’t.
The person who wins the engagement 90% of the time is the one who can shoot faster, move faster and deal more damage.
Abrams/leopard have better firepower (deal more damage), Abrams shoots faster and both have superior mobility
Superior mobility and depression angles allow them to also position better, which is a pretty good advantage too
