yes. stop lying about how russ suffers because it is not true.
In fairness, LMUR is more lethal due to its higher loft and use of a HE warhead (which consequently has reliable overpressure, unlike HEAT). The numbers definitely make a difference in effectiveness against AA though.
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You can look at their individual performance. Those tanks excel over bvm.
Winrates are affected by other factors such as amount of respawns, cas, spaa etc. Ofc ussr winrate will be better due to mi28nm wiping out 8 players with instagib missiles and sm sv being iron dome mobile. Also bmpts which are obv broken rn. You can look at how winrate changes since jan26. 49 → 50 → 54. Thats period when sm sv and bmpts were added. Bvm contributed nothing to those changes.
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I agree, but its’ not like it’s a safe kill everytime. I had countless of LMURS hitting and doing almost nothing.
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You mean hit the other tank’s weakspots ?
Which, in NATO MBTs, are everywhere ??
They shoot both at the same time, the russian MBT has objectively more chance to damage the NATO MBT than the opposit (for Russia it’s simple : it’s point and click → NATO MBT is dead)
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Again, there are other factors at play. Armor is the least important of them. Hitting the enemy is the most important one. the BVM (and 90M especially) aren’t very good at that
Sorry that the truth hurts.
False, armor is one of the first advantages to disappear in a fight between 2 skilled players, since skilled players should have weakness knowledge and crosshair placement. So that leaves the Abrams with all the advantages.
If you would have done the same comparison with 2 unskilled players you would hsve a point.
Yeah of course I’m not talking about those, because we were talking about a direct comparison between Russian and NATO MBTs.
Moving the goalpost seems to be a clear indicator that you are losing no?
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The issue is that tanks basically never shoot at the same time. They shoot at different times due to the time it takes them to get into a position, their maneuverability, their gun handling, their reload, their sights…
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People still have no idea how spalling is determined…
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People are thinking about this stuff way to much instead of just learning where to shoot.
I have no idea how spalling is calculated and im doing fine.
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Nothing new considering this is thread where people think t80bvm is good in hulldown
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Prob because its easier to “oh its n nation tank hence why spall didnt spawn”
I must have missed that nato is exclusively using the Bushmaster.
You as French main should now how amazing the Jaguar is for example.
Ok so beside the Jaguar + sweedish IFVs (which don’t have IRST, so they have useless proxy he shells btw), VBCI 1 + that italian rapid fire rate IFV, which NATO IFVs have a good autocannon ? None. Again, not even talking about the spikes/MMPs which are crap, and add an unecessary +1 BR to all NATO IFVs which have them. Not even talking about the fact that some russian IFVs have 2 CANNONS (1 main, 1 autocannon. Or even 2 autocannons with BMPT).
Not having a tank destroyer is Bias now ?
Yes ? It’s called shadow buffing ?
Like NATO MBTs have baskets and fcs modeled, while russian MBTs don’t ? It’s called shadow buffing. You add a nerf for NATO, so it’s a buff for Russia, and the opposit.
You should be glad about it, since it doesn’t get the scouting ability this way.
Nobody gives a f about scouting. Big time, you can scout, meaning you can exactly see where the completely op russian biased vehicle is, when it’s coming for you.
I don’t care about scouting, what I want for NATO is proper competitive vehicles against Russia.
And (almost) every one else get’s their f&f missile carrier with even more missiles, so what.
And again, AH-64E JAGMs are so bad you need 2-4 missiles to destroy russian MBTs/SPAAs/BMPTs, so it’s basically as it had, IN FACT, 8 working missiles (even less, if it takes you all the time 3 or 4 missiles to destroy those vehicles).
Also, once again :
- french tiger helicopters have only 8 spike missiles, with only 8km range. The EC-665 Tiger HAC doesn’t even have a 20-30mm main cannon. Tiger helicopters climb less than Mis and AHs. They’re now all at 12.7, which isn’t enough because you still face Mi-28nm at this BR due to the poor matchmaking process ;
- german tiger helicopter only got 4 additionnal PARS very recently, with ONLY 7km range for this ones. Also doesn’t have a main 20-30mm cannon.
- italian AH-129D helicopter also has only 8 spikes missiles
- Sweeden doesn’t even have 12.7-13.0 helicopter (shadow buff for Russia with this one)
- chinese Z-10ME has 25 KM RANGE IR missiles (yes as I stated before, the bias is not only russian, but eastern generally speaking) vs 16km for AH-64E JAGMs.
ALSO, very important : Mi-28nm LMURs TNT explosive mass : 19.2 kg. Z-10ME missile TNT explosive mass : 7.7kg/6.3kg. AH-64E JAGMs TNT explosive mass : 4.8 kg. Tiger helicopters Spike TNT explosive mass : 3.3kg. German PARS TNT explosive mass : 3.7kg. => russian and chinese helicopters advantaged once again.
Mi28nms can carry 16 anti air missiles. AH-64E only 4. Tigers only 4 as well. Italian AH-129D only 8. Chinese Z-10ME can carry 16. => russian and chinese helicopters advantaged once again.
Not even talking about laser guided missiles Mi-28nm has A LOT compared to NATO helicopters.
It is total crap. They artificially buff russian and chinese helicopters, on purpose.
I have much experience in top tir match.
I can tell you BVM and T90M sure>a half of top tank
But other half > t80bvm so its mid at best
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Yes but you need consider numbers .for example Germany and Italy only have 1 A7
And NATO in fact 2 years do not get any new top MBT, but Russia at 2025 join 3 new top power tank(B3A BMPT BMPT72) BMPT is cannot be ignored factor , many times BMPT is more eff than any MBT
No way is the T-72B3A considered a proper top tier MBT, that thing is actually trash.
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At least they do, rather than like in Germany, 6 months <45 win rate and only get boxer
tbh the IFVs for top tier on russia are kinda eh. Dont get me wrong, shit like 2S38 and BMP2M are very strong especially for their low BR, but for 12.7-13.0 personally if i want to play a good light tank and not just try to get into a plane as fast as possible (the main use of the russian light tanks for 13.0 for me) id rather be in something else.
That doesnt mean that the 2S38 or BMP2M are bad at top tier, far from it, but they do have some negatives. Coincidentally both have been far overshadowed by BMPT as it is everything BMP2M is but better. Even without scouting it is able to generate SP very fast and easy and has much higher staying power (broken damage model) than regular BMP2M that you are able to overpressure by hitting the grenade launcher ammo on the rooftop.
While BMP2M and 2S38 for 13.0 were generally glass cannons, being able to just style on MBTs if they were able to get the first shot out, the BMPT is just a tungsten cannon.
the best probably not, but in the top 3 after leos and abrams personally yes.
I used to put abrams below the T-tanks previously, but i played a shitton of Sep and SepV2 pre SM SV addition and while it is significantly more fragile than a T-Tank i prefer it over them as they feel a bit more nice to play with the gun handling and transmission.
As for the russian survivability.
Not every engagement is going to be in an isolation where people can say “just shoot the LFP” and added armor can and does make a difference. Russian tanks are at the same time much more forgiving and easier to play (literally had a match with T90M where I got shot by 122, it penned and only damaged autoloader after which i just killed it because my drives were unaffected) and more annoying to play than western tanks. You have good round and armor and dont get cucked by ultra massive basket but lack reverse gear and gun depression.
Personally i like T90M way more than BVM as it has actual turret protection.
crap? no
disadvantaged? yes
Playing type 10/tkx/type90/tkxp especially now with the basket is giving me ultra pain
it doesnt exactly matter if they call it light tank or tank destroyer, hell the thing isnt even categorized as that in reality so thats kinda pointless. Effectively it is an autocannon light tank on a heavy chassis without scouting but with ammo box.
And as for usability, it is infact still way more than usable at 12.7+ than what people think. After the 11.3 uptier change happened i just started to bring it to 13.0 and there have been effectively 0 issues. The fact its still at the BR its at is actually mental.
The ability to be hulldown effectively invincible and even when not hull down outside of LFP hits be a chunk of granite is just stupid.
This was for example a 13.0 match where i only brought BMPT and Mi35P while uptiered due to friend bringing Rafale and that was before SM SV was added to make russia even more protected from CAS which was one of the main things i kept dying to in BMPT
in the current top tier environment, doing CAS with NATO planes that are not Su30MKM is basically CBT adventure. Ive been playing a lot of SM SV
(as the only vehicle in the lineup) and that thing can shut down effectively everything, from my 161 deaths around 5-6 are to CAS (i am not joking*). Which is ridiculous. Unless youre on a very SPAA-hostile map like Sinai or Rhine for example, you can just shut down any and all planes and helicopters. Slow glide bombs and mavericks dont really pose a threat for the new pantsir and for typhoons with brimstones doing close range pop ups you can either kill them super fast thanks to 95Ya6M or just pop smoke.
*1 was to Mi28NM, i remember that because my missile failed to proxy on LMUR, 1 was to Z10ME where i didnt even notice the BA11s it fired after i killed it, one was to a typhoon that dropped paveway 4s on me while i was tunnel visioned on another typhoon. The other 2 or 3 i no longer remember but i kept the count.
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