Russian MBTs: Firepower and Protection versus NATO counterparts

Switch the Russians and the Chinese. The Chinese have massive gaps around their gun breach that allow even some 20mm to go right through and kill crew.

Well I believe relikt is designed with tandem warheads in mind. A lot of the destroyed T-90ms that you are referring to happen because of the tank being hit towards the back of the turret, side of the turret through the engine and the hatches. I haven’t seen any upper front plate video penetrations, TOWs penetrating the T-90m from the front (upper plate) armor or turret cheeks, I dont believe seeing any of them. True Relikt on the side skirts wont be able to stop a tandem warhead charge with 900mm of heat penetration at almost 90 degrees. It is true that Relikt or Kontakt 5 also does not work at every angle penetration, but the same can be said of other MBTs with composite materials.

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The Chinese have a reverse gear though.

That isn’t really an issue unless you want to do stuff involving a ton of risk to begin with, even then the T-80BVM is fine.

Uh huh. That’s why the higher reverse gear vehicles can cqc better? (Which is a lot of maps now), or since you only have -5 gun depression, your in an odd position (since there aren’t great one with that gun depression vs -8 or more), and you have to advance to get a shot out, then reverse, or turn around exposing your weakest spot to then get hit and die.

No. It’s much much bigger than you make it out to be. That’s why red desert is a good map for Russian tanks since they have the space necessary to utilize their armor while not totally being screwed by the reverse speed.

Or if your gun gets nailed, by the time you turn to flee, you’re dead. Vs an Leo or abrams is already out of danger in a couple seconds.

I thought I was the only one to notice this lol.

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I was this way months and months ago when I first started because you play them more. So your first thought is Russia tanks are BS.

Then you play a bit and realize they’re on the same footing as you. Till you get to top tier and go, it’s really the Leo’s, and not by a close margin. There’s a big difference between them and everyone else.

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Yeah but accurate reloads for all tanks would be nice. Russia may be in a better position if the T-80 u reloads are fixed. Abrams really isn’t hurting too bad to be honest. Unless I get 1 tapped I usually kill the enemy who hit me.

USA lacks teams who play more than one life / teams that play any map. I’ve noticed more often that usa players straight up quit if they don’t like a map.

I’m truly not sure what you’re trying to say.

I disagree, that reload sounds good when you compare it to Leo’s, or maybe even abrams(debatable, but would require concessions to the U.S. too IMO), but once your reference point becomes an ariete, a merkava, a challenger, a leclerc… your point of reference becomes much less sturdy.

USSR doesn’t need a loader buff(IMO) because there’s still other tanks besides Sweden, Germany and Italy(sorta) that you still must fight and fight you.

USSR reload isn’t the problem. I would like it as I’m maxing out top tier USSR ground now, but they’re basically equal to an Abrams as is, with map really deciding which is better.

The problem is the Leo’s and I’m increasingly becoming of the opinion a big problem is the difference between DU and Tungsten penetrators would level out a lot of gameplay at top tier for some nations.

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If I can’t back up my gun gets shot out at range and I repair, it isn’t a serious concern. At CQC the Russian tanks lower plate is much more concealed than the massive lower plate of the Chinese tanks and much less likely to lose crew due to massive gaps around the breech area on Chinese tanks.

Russian tanks in general are better protected, better armed, and in the case of the T-80 series have a faster reload. They are far more survivable than the Chinese tanks. Besides, I don’t think he was talking about scenarios I think it was more a list based on protection from BEING hit rather than the ability to avoid being hit.

Because I find it mildly interesting to have a look at people’s profiles, I’ll take a look at MiG_23’s over here. No judgement, just an objective look at the profile.


So immediately, a good number of vehicles unlocked, but not loads in the minor nations, and the spaderates are pretty low down there. Not much naval played, sad, but positive winrate and pretty strong on the 123%. Judging by the number of medals I’d guess you played the most back before the requirements were increased a lot. Most played vehicle is the Mig-23M, fair enough, then there are a good few top teir vehicles, both air and ground, not really any Heli’s apart from the Ka-50 and the chinese ones, though I certainly dont blame you for not grinding them out. Sorting ground and air seperately, its fairly clear the winrate and 123% come from air more than ground, you look to perform fairly average in ground, not massive K/D’s but mostly positive, where in air you are generally 55%+ on the winrate with much higher K/D’s. There are a fair few premiums knocking about, the soviet 10.0/3 Derivatsiya and Turms, the Bish, the Tiger 2 SLA, I saw the XP-55 in there somewhere, couldnt resist that one, and the aformentioned Black shark to name a few. Something interesting i did notice, is that with some of the minor nations where you have top teir Jets, you dont seem to have many games in any vehicles you would have used to grind those vehicles.




For France, Sweden and Israel for example there are almost certainly not enough matches in these vehicles to have gotten to top teir, so I would guess that there has been some GE used along the way, again, no hate or judgement, nothing wrong with spending money on the game for things you want. There is a bit of Sim air, but not nearly as much as Realistic. Overall, you do basically play all nations, you have many event vehicles that I can only assume you have ground over the years, you have played over 600 vehicles in realistic matches, so a huge variety played. The spaderates could use some work, would give you a much better idea of what a lot of vehicles perform like with all their mods, and gives you useful vehicles for ground lineups. Would also be nice to see some naval played. But in general, very nice profile, always good to see people playing all nations and grinding events.

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That’s because I bought the entire tech tree.

The vast majority of my hours in the game was in squadron realistic events and custom matches generally, testing, flying with friends. I don’t care to pad stats but when I do you can see the result. Check out the T-72B3 I just unlocked the other day for example.

I never said it would be the be all end all. But the data shows the T-80U, UK, UM2, UD, BVM, etc, anything T80U or newer of that model has a 6.0 sec reload.

The T90M is stuck at 7.1 as is its actual reload speed.

But having a gap between 1.5 - 2.1 secs is a bit much, considering the USSR has the slowest top tier reloads for the damage output / penetration.

So I do firmly believe that the buff is necessary as it’s historically accurate.

The abrams, on the other hand, is a mess of loading times ranging between 5.5 - 8ish seconds. Which, again, I wouldn’t care if the abrams has a 5.75 sec reload, and the T80 series has a 6.0, this still gives advantage to both without having bs values or fantasy land values.

Weren’t you the one posting 90m being pend by Tow2 missiles? I

Hmm. If Russia is so “over preforming or balanced” why are your stats higher in USA tanks than Russia ones?
Even your Chinese ones are higher than the Russian ones.

But your USA WR confirms what I’ve been saying, it’s the USA teams, not the tank. The tank preformed just fine with the 6.0 sec reload as many other manual loaded tanks do, but, usa teams are notoriously bad, and being the 1 life kings, it kills the WR.

Yes. But I’ve not seen anything suggesting it was only
“Rear turret hits”

I don’t play my Russian tanks in squads and I almost solely play other nations with my friends.

The 39% winrate in the US with the M1?

I play either with or without people, doesn’t seem to change much.

I also don’t have any crew aced, my highest is 115 for usa, all others are below 75, and I still have good stats in the abrams, imagine if they were ace crews.

I never wrote only rear turret hits, i wrote about side shots penetrating at almost 90 degrees (hull and turret), engine being attacked, but frontal plate or turret cheeks were not pend. I have never seen Tows penning frontal plate.