Wdym,you get 80% for severe damage and then 20% for the kill once the plane hits the ground. So still 100%
You are probably replying to the wrong person… but you would already get 100% for what you now get 80%, IF no one else finishes it or IF it ends crashing or IF it’s unable to repair you’ll get the remaining 20%, so “still 100%” with a couple of “IFs”, not the same 100% as before.
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Yeah - this hole topic gets extremely annoying the longer you play.
Regarding “auto kills” / “declarations of death” at game end (time or tickets) a short reminder:
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Besides the known downsides - have you ever realized that if you “severely damage” an enemy (which was a often a clean kill in the past) shortly before the match ends by tickets, you receive the message “severe damage…kill counted” that you lost the 20% as you won’t get the SL/RP for it?
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And ofc the kill is counted for this match and tasks, but not for your overall vehicle statistics.
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Whilst the “killed by severe damage at game end” enemy pays full repair cost and got a real death to the match and his overall statistics?
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I mean from a pure logical pov this makes no sense - if gaijin would actually care for the attacker they would fully reward the kill (and not just 80%) and add this kill to his overall statistics, not just for the match.
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So there are simply two guys losing - the guy able to shoot down the last enemy in order to win the match will lose his aircraft if he got damaged in this process - and the guy who has managed to stay alive (even / despite of he got severely damaged) as last guy to secure a ticket win for his team…
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Gaijin wins every case - the attacker loses 20% of his rewards and the damaged guy get full repair cost…
Edit: They changed the repair cost for “declared deaths” after tickets run out. I lost today an aircraft due to this - and paid just 25 SL instead of ~ 1.800. I do not adjust my initial statement as this was previously not the case.
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I suspect this is a bug as I can’t imagine it was intentionally designed this way.
But at the same time, in my opinion killing a plane with destroyed horizontal stabilizers at the end of the battle is also a bug:
This condition (black horizontal stabilizers) doesn’t affect the plane’s performance, so how can it be counted as serious damage? But well, I’m just a player, and I can only look from the logic point of view. When we talk about the details, we can’t be sure what is and what isn’t a bug, we can only guess. And there is no way to reach the devs, so we can’t even ask them about this.
For me personally missing critical hits also looked like a bug. Because to severely damage a plane you have to cause a critical hit condition on specific parts. So it just makes sense to include that critical hit from breaking parts. Especially it was working like that before, so why changing something like this? Of course you can suspect they wanted to silently reduce the rewards, but taking 33% of the score from every kill is a huge change. From the score perspective, that’s 1 additional kill every 3 kills, so removing these critical hits was a massive score reduction!
But because the devs reduced the number of critical hits required in some tasks, I’m pretty sure now old critical hits won’t return. And for me this is actually the biggest problem with this new system.
This also brings a question, will Ground battles be changed the same way as well? Because right now in Ground battles, killing a tank by destroying specific part (e.g. ammo explosion) gives you a critical hit (like it used to work in Air in the old system). So we have inconsistency right now, the same mechanics works differently in different game modes. I think it’s more likely now the devs are going to remove these critical hits from Ground battles than add them back to Air battles.
The thing is, players always only lose with such changes. You don’t gain anything from it, you only lose (the score and rewards in case of removed critical hits).
Actually it doesn’t matter if it is a bug or intentionally designed this way - the result counts.
So if they transform a clean kill from the old world into a severe damage (= 80% of rewards) and try to “heal” this by declaring the severe damaged guy as dead without rewarding the missing 20% - we have in a best case a quality control within gaijin on par with some guys (in charge of aircraft doors) at Boeing plants…
But: If you see the text in the battle summary you read in the part “destruction of aircraft”:
Mission end (no reward)
This is imho a smoking gun that this is intended.
Its just another gaijin nerf to make your grind harder. You been around long enough and know this.
What does it take to break even with or with out premium in a match if you die? You know the figures better than me. I fly atm p51d20na which has 705% reward with premium if i dont die and a 4383 repair bill if i do, but if i run at a loss i get compensation
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It does matter, because the bug will be fixed, and the design will stay.
Check this part of the article:
Written off aircraft with severe damage at the end of the battle
At the end of a battle, all severely damaged aircraft will be considered destroyed — players in this state will receive the following message: “Written off due to severe damage”. A death in the statistics will be credited, and the player who caused the severe damage will be credited with a destroyed aircraft, where the rest of the reward will be given.
If this article is correct then not giving you the rest of the reward is a bug (this situation should be counted as a full destruction, but it isn’t currently). Of course we can’t be sure, maybe they changed their mind after this article was written?
The same thing happened with the engine damage, which was added to severe damage conditions after the first article was written. And honestly, this part again isn’t very well thought out. The engine damage is something that in some situations doesn’t affect the plane performance that much (especially if you are high in the air, so you can still convert the altitude to speed).
There is also another inconsistency with this. Even if you assume the destroyed engine should be counted as severe damage, because you have no engine power anymore (so it definitely affects your actions), destroying all enemy fuel tanks still isn’t counted as severe damage. Both these actions have exactly same effect, your engines can’t be used, but the reward result is completely different. I actually had this situation yesterday:
Spoiler
And that guy, who destroyed both my fuel tanks didn’t receive a severe damage. I still had an altitude, so I could just go back to base, but this guy received nothing but a few hits (that aren’t worth much). You don’t even get a critical hit nowadays with such damage, it’s crazy! In the old system he would get a critical hit, so 33% of the kill score (that’s always something, 1/3 of the kill).
Like I said, there are many problems and simply lack of logic in this new system. Destroying all engines = severe damage and 80% rewards, destroying all fuel tanks = just a few hits. And in both situations the effect is exactly the same, dead engines. But the rewards are completely different.
And somehow the devs wrote this new system is simple and easy to understand. No, it’s not! It’s inconsistent and in many situations it just doesn’t make any sense.
In my opinion, the previous system may not have been perfect, but it was much more consistent and also provided more rewards.
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I appreciate that you corrected wrong spelling in your first draft - but imho this discussion would be off-topic.
I mean the math is not hard - try to survive one match and score a single kill and you get your answer - the battle summaries provided as messages after the match give you detailed data about your income…
So I figured out the real kill stealing is by Gaijin. If you leave the match you don’t get the “severe damage kill reward” or whatever.
As an example, I played a match where I shot a JU-87’s wing off and he started tumbling to the ground. I then set a BF-109 on fire. I got killed by the BF-109 and he was chiming as he was burning and as I was falling to the ground. When I left the match neither of the planes had hit the ground or burnt up despite being out of the fight and not combat-capable. When the match ended I only got 2 severe damage rewards. If the planes died I never got credit. What a dishonest thing to do.
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That sounds like a reportable bug to be honest… Should lodge one showing this, even after a relog to make sure it did happen.
there is also a effect on the actual battle pass challenge where one must make 3 (or more) kills in a ground attacker plane without dying - 10 times. Some of the severe damaged (killed) planes were not counted when playing e.g. air AB. I can not say exactly under which conditions this occurs but I realized that not all kills noted in the statistics were taken into account. Nevertheless I fullfilled the challenge so I can’t further analyse the issue.
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I don’t believe it is a bug but an intentional nerf. The replay session is 2a1e059000f8fbd. It clearly states that I have shot down both aircraft but here is what my post-mission results screen looks like:
Well done Gaijin! You tried to fix kill stealing by stealing the rewards yourself! Are any of the developers going to go back and retroactively award the missed kills for all players?
I just had a similar situation in the battle, and it looks like there is a big bug with the kill credit in the new system.
The enemy player damaged me pretty badly. He received a critical hit, but it wasn’t enough for severe damage:
Spoiler
My gunner killed him a few seconds later:
Spoiler
He left the battle, and I tried to get back to the base, but I failed and crashed some time later:
Spoiler
In theory you can see he got a kill credit (right bottom corner of the screen). But when you look at the scoreboard:
Spoiler
You can see he still has 0 kills on the scoreboard. The interesting part is, he received a full kill score anyway, just no kill credit:
Spoiler
This proves only the kill credit is bugged. But that’s not the first bug related to this new system, there are a few of them already mentioned in this topic. Maybe some day all these bugs will be fixed, we will see.
BTW: Just an interesting side note. The score in Air Realistic is exactly 2.5x the score from Air Arcade. A kill (at the same BR) in Air Arcade is 180 score, in Air Realistic 450. The critical hit in Air Arcade is 60 score, in Air Realistic 150 score.
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What this tells me is that it was a stealth nerf to rewards. I can’t see how this was missed.
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Yeah, they reversed the work we fought for last year. This is honestly stupid.
What ‘work’ has been reversed?
I can see I’m not the only one who is thinking this can easily be a bug, but jumping to the ‘bad gaijin’ instantly is quite reckless.
Almost needs more testing, did anyone actually question if having a player die after you’d left a battle was tracked correctly in the first place?
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It was never supposed to fix kill stealing. It’s supposed to fix the issue of being killed by a plane that appears dead but can still fly.
Nothing was reversed.
Imho you pointed out a very old thing. The kill counter in itself was always like that. It added the mission score within the scoreboard, but not the kill itself when the player died and left.
This became obvious in longer games with a lot of delayed kills. You somehow managed to kill 3 guys, and the whole lobby had maximum 2 kills - but after the match you received no “terror of the sky” award. Usually exactly this happened and you found one or 2 kills in the battle log which were not shown as kills as the player was dead before.
Imho your issue looks like a bug. As i usually don’t die (or at least that fast) i have never realized this issue. As a lot of pilots follow this playstyle i am wondering why this haven’t popped up earlier.
Imho we have currently these confirmed nerfs regarding income:
- Clear kills in the past are now “severe damage” = ./. 20%
- Clear reduction of mission score = ./. 10-15 %
- Clear reduction of income by anti-air orders = ./. 80%
- Situational reduction of “be the best” order = ./. 100%
I made an example regarding mission score here and regarding anti air orders somewhere else. It boils down that anti-air orders just multiply the score of SL related to “aircraft destroyed”. If you severely damage your opponent before the actual kill your score for aircraft destroyed is reduced by 80%.
You see the same for mission score. For a kill without severe damage you get 450 points, the score is split in 90 for the kill and 360 if you severe damage the same plane.
The “be the best order” relates to mission score of aircraft destroyed. If you kill an enemy you severely damaged him upfront order activation it gives you just 90 points for the final kill. The victim itself gets the “i got shot down score” of 135 points - i made an unwanted donation of 15.000 SL to an enemy this way - lesson learned.
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I normally play Arcade, so maybe that’s why I never noticed this bug. The whole game is much faster in Arcade, and when you die you can always respawn.
Well, it looks like the same bug as above.
It’s just more visible now, because of delayed kills. In the new system there can be many damaged planes with delayed kill credit, in the old system most heavily damaged planes would be dead already.
Oh and by the way. I said kill credit is missing. Of course with that kill credit you also miss the rewards for that kill. You still gain the score, but if this kill is not counted, then you don’t receive rewards from it. I’m pretty sure it’s the same bug. What matters is that if you exit the battle before all damaged enemies actually die, you lose kill credit with rewards, awards and so on, but you don’t lose the score. It definitely shouldn’t work this way, even if it’s an old bug. Delayed kills just made it more visible nowadays.
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