Here we go:
2 Likes
You only get % if destroyed by 2nd party, but you do get 1 frag
When a friendly player finishes off an enemy aircraft that is severely damaged, they will receive a new message: “Finished Off”. For doing this, they will receive the rest of the reward and the frag in their statistics. For the player who inflicted the original severe damage, they will also receive a fully-fledged frag to their statistics as well — however, no additional reward because they did not play a part in finishing this enemy off.
As a result, both players will receive a frag of the enemy aircraft in their statistics, as well as counting for tasks and camouflage unlocks as usual, for example.
Maybe you can check my replay link and post a screenshot of the condition to make this more clear. I am unable to add screenshots whilst using xbox. In the replay you see that both (horizontal stabilizer and elevator) were black and i could easy perform a second attack at 7:05 - as written before: I had no deterioration of my FM.
2 Likes
I don’t even want to try to understand how you did those calculations.
I wrote all this before, but I understand 99.9% of the players won’t even follow or read full topic, they prefer to just make up numbers and share their theories without testing them.
Previous system example.
This was the most common way for me to get instant kills (tearing off more than half of the wing):
Spoiler
I received 100% score, 100% RP/SL rewards and a kill credit.
Someone who decided to finish this guy would receive additional assist, so 67% of the kill score and 25% of kill RP/SL rewards.
In total both players could get 167% of the kill score and 125% of kill RP/SL rewards from one enemy. But only the first person would be credited with a kill, second person with assist.
The same example in the new system, where most kill conditions were converted to severe damage:
Spoiler
INFO: don’t look at RP/SL numbers on the screen because they are affected by vehicle multiplier, planes BR difference, boosters etc., so they are incomparable!
I only receive 80% of the score and 80% of RP/SL rewards, but no kill credit (probably a bug).
Someone who decide to finish this guy will receive finisher status, so 40% of the kill score, 40% of kill RP/SL rewards and a kill credit.
In total both players can get 120% of the kill score and 120% of kill RP/SL rewards. Only second player will be credited with a kill (probably a bug).
So you can see the combined score was lowered hugely in the new system (167% in the old system vs 120% in the new system), but RP/SL rewards are almost at the same level as before (125% in the old system vs 120% in the new system).
The problem is, previously many players ignored “destroyed” planes. But in the new system most “destroyed” planes were changed to “severely damaged” and kept the red nameplate. So more players will attack them, it’s pretty obvious.
We don’t know the stats, but Gaijin surely made calculations based on stats (they can check how many previously destroyed planes were finished in the old system and calculate predictions for the new system).
Some players assumed that the devs predicted overall increase in RP/SL with this new system, and possibly that’s why they disabled most critical hits. I’m personally not sure about this, because it would be easier for the devs to just reduce RP and SL game mode multipliers (we know that there are such multipliers for each game mode from information revealed by the devs a long time ago).
I hope everything is clearer now.
3 Likes
All these new pop up messages there to long and to quick, that messages at the end about being written off is way to fast, not once have i been able to resd it. Never known a pvp game to be run by an accountant, far to complicated
Add to that instructor that randomly decides you cant control plane anymore. Flown half the map with half a wing missing - 1km before runway plane suddenly spin out of control - didn’t touch a thing guy of course got the kill.
Also often happen you severely damage plane -rip his wings and someone just steal your kill - if you got assist you are lucky more often than not you get nothing.
I say it again make severely damage planes greyed out like killed ones and make sure player that did this damage actually get reward for it.
You realize that most of the damage you do to get those 80% now would give you a true kill(100%) in the old system?
And even if you think that you can still get the 100% by finishing it yourself, the few conditions you now need for the remaining 20% simply make it much harder and more time consuming. Not to mention that the severe damage will keep the player marker red which will make all your teammates go for it as if it’s untouched, increasing what you consider “kill stealing” behaviour.
I also thought this change would be very positive when I read it in the roadmap devblog, now I know it’s a big nerf to collective rewards.
5 Likes
A true kill, for an aircraft that was able to fly up to no fuel?
Don’t make me laugh bro,… the “true kill” of yours is barely sufficient to incapacitate any combat abilities, but clearly not making the aircraft to go down,…
A “true kill” as it is considered by the game, not as it is considered by you. An “old” kill would give you 100% of the score and now in almost every situation will give you only 80%, if you think that’s an improvement…
And to get the same 100% you would get from an “old” kill the few types of damage(killing pilots, cutting off tail, cutting off more than half wing) you must do to get the finishing off will make it much harder to also get the remaining 20%.
But not surprising that you like it.
3 Likes
so actually we have 4 categories of hits:
- normal hit: causes only some scratches
- critical hit: making damage on parts but plane can still fly and fight
- severe damage: plane is more or less doomed and damaged in lethal systems but still in flight
- “mysterious hit”: plane is instant destroyed or pilot is killed but the related hit is either critical or severe
previously: severe damaged planes were counted as kill
This isn’t correct. You get the kill credit but you don’t get the extra 20% score.
Oh, I get it now. My English skill is terrible, I didn’t understand what he tried to say.
So basically he should say that assuming that the guy who caused a severe damage in the new system e.g. destroyed the engine, it would work pretty much this way:
You caused a severe damage to the engine and the kill was “stolen” from you → the new system still doesn’t give you a kill credit (most likely a bug?) → you receive 80% score (instead of previous 67% from assist + 33% from additional critical hit).
I could also add that from the finisher perspective:
You see a plane, it looks fine (engine damage is sometimes impossible to notice, when it’s not burning and not leaking), and you attack it → it’s very hard to finish him, it takes a lot of time and ammo, but you finally receive a finisher reward and a kill credit → you receive only 40% score (instead of the previous 100% for a kill and 33% from critical hit).
And some people somehow understand this as a win for the players. It works this way right now (maybe this will change in the future, I don’t know).
EDIT: Fixed, because the engine damage is a more complicated topic. This is the previous Critical Hit condition that was changed to Severe Damage.
4 Likes
For myself, I don’t hate it? (I know, you were talking to someone else, you just made me think how I feel about it after a weekend of nothing but air AB).
If severe damage counted as a crit for tasks, and finishing counted as an assist for tasks, I’d be fine with the rest, basically. If the stats do end up showing a net score reduction across all players (which I think they must), you could adjust up the net score points per kill (which all the other values are based on) to bring the balance back (maybe 240 instead of 200, or whatever). That’s how I’d fix it now, anyway.
(Gaijin has other mechanics that also have big effects on net score, btw. Changing the average match size down from 16v16 has even bigger effects, potentially. Everything’s a tradeoff in this stuff.)
1 Like
From where 33% of critic comes by? Like currently critics only are 3 times a hit, but are definetly lower than 33% of kill.
The introduction of Severe Damage looks like it gives new air battle players a chance to grind quicker for their choice of aircraft. What confuses me is what counts as a Severe Damage, because it looks to be more of an emphasized Critical Hit. All in all, it’s a good grindative thing.
From the score perspective, a kill is 100%, an assist is 2/3rd of the kill score (about 67%), a critical hit is 1/3rd of the kill score (about 33%).
You can check this in the battle. Just enter the battle, deal critical damage to the enemy, then check the score details:
A kill is worth 180 score, an Assist 120 score (2/3rd of 180), a Critical hit 60 score (1/3rd of 180). That’s why removing most critical hits affected the score so much.
PS. A normal hit is 10 score, so I made 4 normal hits on this enemy.
3 Likes
That last phrase wasn’t particularly about this mechanic, more about the one that was meant to.
The point is that some still think that this change will make things better when saying that now they’ll get 80% instead of just 40% but completely miss the times they will now get 80% instead of 100% for doing the exact same thing on both situations.
3 Likes
I would make sense if you add to your score/ratio data a disclaimer that you talk about Air AB - imho you lose a hell of Air RB / Air SB readers with your values as they can’t align the very low values (for mission score) with their experiences.
The problem is, I don’t play Realistic, so I’m not sure how the score is set there. I think it should be about x3. So the kill should be about 180 * 3. But don’t take it for granted. I don’t play Realistic, so for me doing such tests in Air RB doesn’t make sense.
I understand players are lazy by nature. But what’s the problem of going into Realistic, getting e.g. 1 kill and checking the score, right? And then you can do calculations (assist = 2/3rd of the kill score, critical hit = 1/3rd of the kill score). It’s not really that hard. Just keep in mind, to kill/assist/crit the enemy at the same (or higher) BR as you are. Otherwise the score will be lowered. It’s the easiest to do this kind of test by playing a 1.0 BR plane.
1 Like
The fact you have all spent so much time discussing this trying to work it out shows what a confusing mess it all is. On what is a simple shoot em up.
4 Likes