C.205 S3, C.205N2, G.55S1, G55S.
The only plane that performs well is G.55 S0, though it is outperformed by everything it faces.
I played a ton of custom battles because there you can just get 30 kills in a span of minutes vs bots. 2 rounds into wing snaps it. MG151/20 requires more rounds on target.
Vs tails it’s similar, but that’s because tails are made od paper. Unless you ahoot an elevator off and keep hitting the same spot and non-existing module keeps tanking shots, but such is life :P
All these planes are pretty damn competitive at their BR, especially the first 2. Haven’t flown the G55 in some time but I doubt it is terrible at 5.0.
I actually flew the 205S3 and 205N2 quite recently and I couldn’t come up with some definitive complain as to what they face. Yea you can face the occasional 5.7 game against US and their current 4B spam, but what have you. BR for BR they are very solid.
S3 is absolutely dogthing. I can dogfight it in 190, but S3 lscks speed, resilience, rudder and flaps to compete. Also is worse armed due to wing mounted cannons.
And N2 is simply even worse.
Now, after giganerf Fw 190 A5/U2 is no longer superior.
But then you have: J2M2, J2M5, Yak-3, Bf 109G2, Bf 109G6, P-51-D10, Wyvern, XP-50, XP-55, Yak-9U (oh god…), and it turns out C.205 S3 is not really competitive with anything.
And G55 S and G.55 S1 are just G.55S0 but at higher BR, and right now I’ll take 4 Bredas over 2 MG151/20 in the wings because these Bredas allow me to snipe people from 900m away (I’ve killed some people from further away, the bullets somehow fly great).
You aren’t going to win a straight up dogfight with a 190 vs any of those planes, the S3 sits pretty much on par with a 109G2 if I had to give it an estimate without going into some test flight and crunch some numbers. The N2 is a bit more of a challenge to play, but it’s still very solid to do well in.
I actually prefer wing mounted cannons over nose mounted.
Probably you’d have to play those planes a bit more, especially the 205S3. I don’t like bringing stats into any discussion because they are quite meaningless due to changes in meta, guns, BR, and so on, but I’m not some super amazing pilot and still pull 10:1s out of those planes with my eyes closed.
I used to have top 10 kills per battle in the entire game for quite some time. I never came close to 10:1 in any of my planes but Ki-44-II when it was so ridiculously OP it hurt (now it’s still OP).
C.205 S3 is simply one of the worst planes at 4.7
Wing mounted cannons means you have longer time to kill when put of convergence compared to Fw 190.
It has bad rudder at high speed. Worse turn at high speed than Fw 190 and worse roll. It can’t use flaps at high speed so Fw 190 can just dump on it in a diving roller. And if you throttle drop - good for you, that Fw 190 will be gone in seconds - if he’s smart, way before you get your guns on target. And then what? Head on? Where Fw 190 crashes 205 due to way tougher airframe?
Of course I’m talking about pre-nerf Fw 190 A5U2.
It can’t expect to outrun anyone at low alt and real speed advantage shows up only over 5km. Meanwhile A5U2 had speed parity with Yak-3 at most altitudes and was faster than J2M2, XP-50, XP-55 and Bf 109G6 at low alt, often also higher up.
C.205S3 has no way out of bad situation, no outdiving (it has way lower rip.speed than Fw and locks up earlier) no outturning. And what could it outclimb exactly? Oh yes, maybe Fw 190 and P-51D10 (premium one) by amount too little to amount for anything.
If you really made it to 10:1 by honestly playing solo withour AF crutch, then you’re a god of this game, because once again - this plane has no way out of bad situations at 4.7
It was super good when it sat at 4.0 with WAY BETTER performance and FM I guess, at 4.7 after several hard nerfs to all aspects of performance - absolute joke of a plane.
I guess in Ta-152H you’d go 20:1 solo no problem killing 3-4 guys per battle, if you did so great in modern day C.205S3, and I’m being serious.
I dunno man, just took the 205N2 out for a couple of games… 5 kill including sketchy stall fighting a decent yak3 and spit IX, 2 kill because enemy team bad, 0 kill because I’m unlucky and set on fire by a glancing hit with 50 cals and burned up, and a 6 kill carry though there was a G55 that could rub his braincells together in my team and we got 10 kills between us (it was 2 vs 9 and we were mostly co-alt with enemy). So that’s 13:1 in 4 games, low sample size but whatever, just wanted to see again how it fares.
These planes really aren’t bad. Sure they have limitations… but what’s the fun to spam J2M2/XP50/Yak3/9U/P51C/D10 and so on. Yes those are better planes at similar BR, but also ridiculously undertiered, can just mostly take a dump on anything you face regardless of the skill of the other pilot when he’s in an inferior plane if you at least know more or less what you’re doing.
I don’t like the Ta152H, would probably play it again if it lost its airspawn, but that’s never going to happen… The last I touched it was very many years ago and I think I just spaded it and parked it. That was before they added the air defense spawn it has today iirc.
And honestly, I don’t play for getting stats or trying to top 10 the leaderboards. There’s no “internet fame” in WT. I just like planes and wanna have fun
But seriously dude, these are some of the worst 4.7 planes in game. I’m just playing the game to get the kills. Then lo and behold, you jump into the worst plane and are legendary.
The problem is - your claims it’s “good” aren’t really confirmed by any performance metric of the plane itself. It absolutely does nothing really good. It’s not a high speed monster, it’s not great climber, it turns simply bad, it’s not fast. Then what makes it good?
If not Ta, them use Bf 109 G6 and just casually score best KPB in the entire game. I mean, why the hell not? G6 gwts way better MM.than Ta (more targets). G6 outclimbs C.205, outruns it, has better rudder, matches it in a dive, has better acceleration and probably turn rate is equal or better too. Or G.55S0 where you can pull insane maneuvers at 750IAS because it barely locks up, it has good turn rate overal, it’s an excellent gun platform and on top of that sits at lower BR.
And you’ll basically decimate entire teams time and time again.
I looked up your stat card some time ago, and thought “pretty good guy, but I:m doing better”. Oh boy, was I wrong, if you can just avoid death, losing and scoring low kill numbers in a plane that is both slow, bad turning, has mediocre armanent and no real redeeming trait, then I bow my head.because you truely are something different. I have no idea how does C.205 S3 casually clobber people that can fly circles around it, and never get simply overwhelmwd by faster, better turning planes (Yak-3 f.e.) but god damn…
I don’t think you give those planes enough credit…
C205S3 is a great plane… if you think the 109G2 is good, it’s pretty equal. Its about 10 kph slower at SL and altitude but it turns slightly better (both minfuel, no gunpods obv), climb to 5000 meters is like 6-8 seconds in favor of the 109G2 so not very big difference, C205S3 has better flaps and can manage its overheating just fine. More guns as well instead of a single 20mm and 7.7s. If the 109G2 carries gunpods the C205S3 beats it in every category.
I really wouldn’t call that bad, but sure it’s not some hardcore meta mobile like the J2M2 or Yak3. But beating people because your plane is better is no fun I think.
C205N2 is just heavier, so a little worse in most regards.
EDIT: C.205 has WAY better turn above 700IAS than I expected, so it’s pretty solid at high speed indeed. Not G.55 S levels, but still v. good.
G2 Trop is “kinda OK” for 4.3 but I generally consider it the easiest kill anyway, and inferior to F4.
205S3 is 4.7 with generally worse performance.
Winning with a “worse plane” is sometimes fun. But playing solo at a BR where my teams are "underperforming"in a bad plane is not my cup of coffee.
I die in most of my losses (because if I wouldn’t die, then the enemy would be dead instead). To have even 8:1 K/d I’d have to achieve around 80% WR solo. Which is not happening in this one.
Now, back to the plane itself - it can’t really do much vs G6. G6 actually holds better maneuvrability at high speed. The armanent (and I’m talking no gunpods) is not really less effective because 2MG131 deal a ton of damage with HE belt and hit roughly the same spots as the cannon. Bf 109 is a smaller target with a huge armored plate for what it’s worth.
Yak-9U beats it basically everywhere but maybe climb.
Yak-3 beats it everywhere under 5000m but rip speed.
XP-55 beats it everywhere but maybe at climb (slightly) and has a huge firepower advantage
J2M2 is worse above 600 IAS and much better everywhere else
J2M5 - same story
La-7 beats it everywhere by a large margin but maybe in climb.
I-185 beats it in firepower and climb and in speed by a LOT. Loses slightly in turn performance at mid-low speeds but that’s it.
ITP - very similar performance, better armanent, no rudder bricking, 4.0 BR :p
P-38L - beats it everywhere but it sucks as a gun platform, so there’s that.
F4U4 beats it everywhere but short range firepower and climb, but the speed advantage is huuuge.
P-51D20 is so bad it’s getting beaten (4.3 plane).
P-51D10 is pretty damn competitive and can hang with C.205 in a dogfight, while being way superior diver and way faster
Fw 190 A5 is indeed horrible and gets clapped
Fw 190 F8 and D9 (0.3 BR higher) just smash this plane out of the sky due to airspawn (former) and ridiculous performance advantage (latter)
Pyorrrbdgmraaakskiyyakiy - lacks roll and a bit of speed, better everywhere else, 4.3
J21A - generally a horrible plane, byt it’s 4.3 with way better turn and armanent, but yeah, this one can be beaten
A6M5 - much slower, but bettwr armed and ridiculously good turn and somehow excellent high speed turn, if flown properly, a huge pain in the butt, and C.205S3 can get reversed way easier than pre-nerf A5/U2.
I have too little experience in P-47D to write anything about it, but I’d expect P-47 to be able to hang in a dogfight for quite some time (not necessarily win, but prolong the combat long enough for help to arrive), and if need be - be able to run away quite effectively. And P-47 has huge advantages at speedz hhigh speed maneuvrability, durability and long range firepower.
I won’t discuss more 4.0 planes since I don’t want to write a wall of text.
But the thing is - the fact that with some godlike skills you can avoid all certain death scenarios doesn’t mean the plane is good. The plane is a huge underdog and I generally rate it as “easy kill” along with Bf 109 G2 trop. C.205 caught at equal alt by a better plane has no escape route other than force a head on, or count on the enemy making huge mistakes and pulling a reversal. And it’s not good at head ons, it was food for the time of early real shatter, because during late real shatter and nuclear real shatter (now) it was going to trade 1:1 against anyone semi-competent.
The fact that a godlike player like yourself (remember, I can get nowhere close to your legendary K/D and 3-4 kills per battle in C.205S3, to me it has always been a struggle, and I was reliably sitting in top 10 kills per battle for months and in top-20 not even flying the most meta/OP aircraft, just aircraft that had good firepower and I was able to do this pre-real shatter, so we can assume I’m OK, and yet nowhere close to you) may make it work, doesn’t mean it’s good. It just means you are head and shoulders above almost all players currently in the game and that’s it.
EDIT: Played 2 games.
1st - 2 kills, didn’t manage to kill anyone else because 3-4 Wyverns took out our tickets.
2nd - P-61 pushes a head-on and hits my radiator due to high velocity armanent and good nose authority. Then I shoot him down, then my teammates die, I’m left with P-47 who goes ground pounding and fires all his ammo vs 5 enemy fighters, I shoot down one, avoid getting into my AF AAA (cause that’s a mark of a horrible player), and I die.
It’s pretty fun when above the enemy, but same can be said about Fw 190 A5U2 pre nerf.
EDIT: I again see little redeeming quality to this plane at 4.7. It requires cautious approach unless someone is squadded, then it probably is pretty damn good due to high speed performance.
Dunno why so many defending the changes…
Thats what lefter after hit by a short brrrp from Hispanos.
Thats all what remains of a FW after h it by two shvak 20mm shells. One hit the tail and one the wing.
Its worse than in movies like red tails. Set fragment damage to zero would be best.
For a short BRP we can still see well over 10 hits on the still existing plane so you got hit by a lot.
One hit to tail and wing? Mhm strange how again there are more hits around the misisng parts area than apparently hit the parts missing.
You got hit by a massive burst both times thats it. Your FW lokks like it was hit by at least 15 rounds of 20mm possibly 3 or 4 on both the wing and tail.
To further illustrate. The Shavak player probably used his universal belt which gives him an FI, HEF (or was it HEI) and AP round. So twice as many HE round as AP rounds. Yet you have 5 AP hits and 5HE hits visible on your wreck as well as two much smaler AP hits possibly from 7.7s. SO my 15 hits total might actually be to low considering the spread the SHvak still has. 20 to 25 might be more accurate.
The biggest problem with the C205S3 is its stall, if you stall out in a close to vertical position (>80 degrees) your plane will flip several times over before you gain lift again and stabilize and anyone who you might be stallfighting or is nearby will just pick you up as a free kill. If you’re unlucky you will also have fuel starvation and your engine will shut itself off too. So that’s great fun.
If you’re ever get to fight someone who is a good pilot and he is in a C205S3, just do a steep vertical scissors to a point you are both nearly vertical, and see if he sticks that. If he does, he’s done. He will either have to break off early to not tumble out of the sky, or tumble and die. Either way, you’ll have the kill or enough position to get the kill.
Try it out to see what I mean :)
And…
Dude, I’m nowhere near godlike, I make plenty of mistakes and play like a dumbass more often than I care to admit. You can get >2.5kpb on several planes, I’m sure that if you focus your attention on flying some mid planes you’ll do just fine, and will do even better when actually flying the good stuff afterwards. Exploiting the enemy pilot is a more rewarding game than exploiting the enemy’s plane.
Lol thats a generic skin. Looks always like this if hit. Those entry holes don’t mean there really hit something.
No it is not. I whish we had the generic skins back
Nope it does not
True, but they correspond to where the game calculates a hit.
Welcome to hit corresponding damage models fully introduced in LaRoyale. and tested prior to it for about half a year.
Errm. No.
Erm yes
Because perhaps for the first time ever most guns work and are fun to play with?
War Thunder is a GAME with design preferences & engine limitations. Not a movie, not real life.
You have no clue of what you are asking for. You realize that 0 fragment damage equals to essentially water pistols?
Yea cuz that would be very realistic compared to what we have now. Might as well change the game rules to airsoft rules, so that when you get hit you type “I’m dead” in chat and RTB.
It’s worse than when realshatter was initially introduced (we had 0-3 fragments, they had a small % of damage and still would do basically nothing to your plane).
False. I was able to find the replay where you get hit by “2” 20mm Shvaks, and you get hit by a burst of at least 16-20 rounds of it after trying to loop infront of a I-185 (has x3 cannons) that was 0.2km away from you. You believe that you should’ve survived that? IRL and in any other simulator game you’d be dead regardless of your tail n wings being ripped or not. Or do you perhaps think that his shells should only paint your plane yellow?
Meanwhile in that same match you kill somebody with a very similar burst that ends up with identical damage, but yea… apparently when you are the one getting the kill, no complaints right?
You don’t want realism, what you seem to want is your guns to work while the rest can have water pistols. Honestly not very surprised that you main Germany in the game.
Agreed. I stopped playing ARB because it taking half my ammo to secure a kill was not fun. Im now playing the occasional game of ARB
Yes he does because he ONLY plays Germany so oopsie, now people can actually kill him in a single pass too instead of him just tanking the tickle cannons of the enemy and flying away while being able to just kill everyone easily.
His opinion is biased as heck and entirely invalid.
So basically you are saying “Let’s take 1 of the 2 gimmicks the German planes have and give it to everyone else instead, while also nerfing the same gimmick for the Germans”, since this is what basically happened up to now.
