Fair enough, yeah it’s interesting to compare all 3 Eurofighters but last time I did so, I came to the conclusion that the British Eurofighter mains were the most air-to-air oriented players than the Italians/Germans since they had less ratio of ground kills per battle than the other two.
The UK Eurofighter and Italian Eurofighter are both identical in radar gimbal limit and both minor nations. This eliminates variable 2 if you consider German players to be lower skilled.
UK and Italy are practically never on the same side in matchmaking pre-sets. So the difference in performance between the two is the difference between always facing Rafale and never facing Rafale. Averaging the stats between the two would create estimate of how both would do if they each had 50/50 shot of being against France and Rafale. UK Eurofighter is played slightly more than Italy Eurofighter at 133k games vs 103k games so one doesn’t disproportionately affect the sample size.
Mar WR Average = 54.7 (Worse than Rafale)
Mar KB Average = 1.14 (Better than Rafale)
Mar KD Average = 1.56 (Better than Rafale)
But also when you look at the amount of divergence between Eurofighter and Rafale there are still a number of differences.
For instance last month MS was arguing that the Italian Eurofighter performs worse in Air to Air than the British one due to higher number of ground kills. By same explanation the Rafale performance is also skewed by proportion of ground kills per game.
Or if we go back to the argument that he was making at the height of Rafale being dominant that it’s stats were disproportionately skewed by good players preferring meta-planes and Rafales reputation for being OP created self fulfilling cycle of high stats. Conversely now that other meta-mobiles exist in the game then their stats are artificially inflated by being preferred by the same meta chasing players and Rafale stats have deflated by equal amount of meta chasing players now preferring British Eurofighter.
There is also explanation that AI targets count towards kills per death and kills per battle and that superior range of AMRAAM means that it is more likely to be used against AI targets than MICA.
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It’s not as clean as comparing Italian Eurofighter to British one and then trying to compare them to the Rafale. The loadouts are different. Again, a mixed loadout for the Eurofighters is worse in air to air than a mixed loadout for the Rafale. It’s more clean and understandable to contain these comparisons to only planes of the same platform.
These stats don’t say anything about how the Rafale itself would do if it also had to face itself like the Eurofighters do, only how the Eurofighters do if it had to face itself + Rafale. Nothing more than that.
I guess thats possible but with how intransparent ground kills and kills are its a bit of a problematic argument.
I think the rock paper scissors explanation is not a bad one, the Typhoon is the better platform when played with the Rafale and the worse platform when played against it. At the end of the day its a good bit of conjecture due to the differences in matchmaker and tree distribution but to circle back to the original topic id say its fair to say that the Rafale is 100% not underperforming.
In your example, it still would be the case that the Rafale isn’t playing against itself.
I could see the Rafale’s statistics plummeting if it had to face itself + Eurofighters while the Eurofighters still maintain the edge in statistics in every aspect.
If the Rafales stats hypothetically plummet more due to fighting itself than they do fighting only EFTs like rn wouldnt that mean that the Rafale is a better platform?
This is not true.
Eurofighter can take 6x Spice 250 without sacrificing any air to air missiles. Rafale has to sacrifice air to air missiles in order to take similar load out.
The Rafale facing itself is irrelevant to the point of discussion. It’s always on a team with itself. If Eurofighter was clearly better than Rafale then the stats would reflect that.
The only thing that is reflected in the stats is that Eurofighter is basically equal to the Rafale and that it’s performance has finally normalized against 1 other plane in the game after over a year of clearly being the best plane in the game.
Complaining about Rafale current performance relative to competition is extremely silly endeavor at current moment. It shows position of privilege that French players grew accustomed to over the past year when at worse their plane is 10% worst than the next best thing is cause for concern and necessities buffing the plane and weapon systems.
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No it just means that when it dodges the 100 missiles flung at it from long and medium ranges, that it no longer can enjoy being the only competition at short ranges.
Let’s be honest, it’s long overdue.
Rafale had made-up performance and overall unfair advantage in radar and missiles for over a year now.
10 million games (3rd most played plane) with (best of 14.7/14.3) 64.2% WR and 1.61 (best of 14.7/14.3) kill ratio. Still not enough?
Why are we looking at the past year and not recent/now?
Why are we complaining that it is now performing below it’s historical norm? Or is it perfectly fine for a plane to be overwhelmingly better than another for an entire year+?
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If we mean “how balanced the weapon load is”, I don’t see it. EFT can keep a full 10x A2A missile loadout with a wide selection of A2G options;
If we mean the FM impact of a multirole loadout… maybe? But if I just went with 8xSPICE250 thats light enough where you don’t notice and still get 8x FnF weapons.
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Hmmm, I wonder who’s alt account you are.
Because you’re using the past as a benchmark.
Who ever did that?
When? Can you point to a post I made?
I meant moreso that the type of players who go ground pounding in air rb are taking full air to ground loadouts with leftover air to air weapons.
It isn’t ideal to do ground pounding in air rb but the Rafale players are less handicapped by doing so with a full air to ground loadout than EFT players are.
Aren’t you complaining that the Rafale’s stats are dwindling in comparison to…so far?
This isn’t complaining, this is pointing out new changes
I mean, are they? 6xAASM is good an all, but its less than 8xSPICE250 and I can still take a pair of GPS guided weapons if I’m looking to crack a few pillboxes without any effort. Sure if I use all six stations for A2G but would you want to?
And in that end aren’t we just saying that due to the limit available weapons pylons on Rafale that its better for multirole because it has less options? Seems counter intuitive.
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I would imagine that the type of players going with any air to ground loadout in air rb don’t have the discernment to take less air to ground weapons for for more air of air, otherwise why not just go full air to air?