Well, if you don’t have anything productive to say about LDIRCM then leave the thread? Why do you even come here and complain about something that shouldn’t concern you in the first place? So you don’t play top tier and come here and act as if though you knew what’s going on? Dude.
At least try to offer solutions, bossman.
Yes, as does ty-90
“suppression” is overstating it.
this is ignoring that IRCCD/IIR cameras/seekers have algorithms that assist in protecting the seeker as well as maintain target tracking and decoy rejection
as explained above. suppression of a large section of the target from the FOV of the IIR seeker is possible however it is not enough to decoy the missile. especially not modern IIR guided ones
Sun isnt even comparable to a laser
you are comparing a planar source to a point source.
And i really wouldnt call a 3.5 kVA (2.8 kW) laser a “low power” laser
" In order to destroy an IIR seeker, a much stronger laser emitter is required. In the above example, the laser is with a 10μW/cm2 irradiance. Even then, the beam energy at the center is close but not at the limit to which it would start to destroy the FPA (focal plane array). This is not including the laser intensity drop off with increase in atmospheric disturbances, weather etc. "
In this case, assuming a seeker of 10cm2 area, it would be 280W per cm2. If we assume all the atmospheric stuff, distance, inneffeciencies etc. lets assume its 2.8 watts per cm2, a far cry from the 10 micro watts per cm2
people kinda said the same thing about AI, cars, industrialisation and machanisation
the only thing that will change is skill, and methodology.
theres a reason why IR guided AGMs have become common to almost all nations helis at top tier
people will have to prioritise smarter gameplay when using helicopters. currently the skill level is too low. i say this as i myself find it harder to play aircraft CAS as compard to heli CAS. although that might be to do with germany not having any FnF weaponry on its aircraft (havent gotten the SLE yet)
shorter reactions times and new tactics will be the key to performing in the new environment of heavy air defense and IR AGMs
if it were upto me, multi vehicle systems would never have been added. there are other options for all nations utilising SACLOS//ACLOS tech.
as or the LDIRCCM/LDIRCM debate,
you say helicopters will be ade useless… all helicopters have a tough time against an IRIS-T SLM. except the three we all know and hate. so why no outrage for them?
and why must SLM, having only IR (IIR) missiles, be completely useless against the three helis?
helis can defend themselves using smart tactics. SPAA in the current game environment cannot
a silly argument. People play warthunder over games like WOT and AW because of its promise of realism. or promise to acheive it. traction is one thing i understand. but do not use this argument as it furthers no ones cause
then i dont see why you arent asking or WH40k vehicles in game?
i dont pretend. infact i support it.
german fakes were removed, r2y2 was removed, remove the Hori series and any other fake vehicles or tech as well
i you see an IRIS symbol on ur RWR, KEEP programmed flares ON. the missile will have a hard time locking you if the area is already saturated with flares
ofcourse you need to vacate the area as well before it reaches you purely on DL and IOG
So you want helicopters that cost triple digit amount of SP to have high skill floors, basically barely surviving against 70 SP AAs, that can just point and click stuff on their radar overlay while watching a movie and cooking their lunch at the same time ?
I’m a pretty anti-CAS oriented guy but even to me that sounds extremely ridiculous.
Also, Gaijin doesn’t want the skill level to rise, contrary to your own opinion.
no. it is you who naively beleives that player who havent yet reached top tier care NOTHING about it. as if they arent aiming to go play it in the future as well and arent concerned about how playable it will be.
as it stands, top GRB is becoming like ground sim, where CAS holds absolute power
This tells me everything about you as a person, imagine thinking like this. So far, you haven’t offered any solutions to an unrealistic and overperfoming feature in the game, which is what this thread is about. I wish DLIRCM was implemented properly, so that the few “malding” players who spent thousands of hours grinding SLM and top tier vehicles don’t feel useless while playing it.
The skill ceiling for helicopter gameplay needs to go up, the fact that you can have hovering helicopters for the duration of an entire match is a measure of how absurdly powerful this feature is. It is not balanced or fun to play against in the slightest.
The only way Gaijin can fix this is by implementing jamming cool downs and missile jam limits until the game is ready for the realistic implementation of IIR and DL+IOG for IRIS-T.
Plus for the sake of balance, its neither smart to have DIRCM act like its current state, or let IIR completely ignore it.
A simple fix is just limit 1 missile per turret, and triggered ONLY when MAWS have detected the missile.
Imagine getting away from WoT and start playing WT just to get your team wiped out by a Coelian.
Peak realism, isn’t it ?
No need, we already have enough.
Those weren’t removed, just hidden from research.
You can still meet those in games and get killed by them as well.
All the files related to those should be permanently removed from the game, otherwise this game can’t call itself realistic.
CAS was holding absolute power in many instances and BRs.
Maybe it’s what Gaijin wants, have you thought about that for a second ?
in terms of power (amplitude) of radiation emmittance it is comparable.
the sun can damage both the human eye as well as cameras and IR sensors
in comparison to higher power lasers, yes it is pretty low power. it is impossible to cause damage in the short amount of time the laser actually affects an IIR seeker (in case of a speeding SLM missile coming at it).
i did these calc as well and i know something is off but im not educated enough on IR physics to convert the units correctly. the values that you state are primarily concerning the center of the laser beam, which dazzle the center of the seeker but the outer sensor sectors of the seeker remain active and operatonal which allows for the missile to maintain tracking. (using the many algorithms at its disposal)
a 2800W laser is weak also in the regards of range
not to mention seeker bloom decreases proportionally with range to the laser source.
i am arguing or realism. balancing is not my subject of discussion so you can take that up with gaijin or open a thread elsewhere bro
i never stated gaijin wanted the skill level to rise.
I want the skill level to rise. i dont want to see zero IQ noobs at top tier who dont know how to play or contribute to their team
strawman argument. welldone
heres your first 10/10 in this discussion
ooh now you have enough?
hy stop at the current level of inaccuracy?
since realism is worth nothing in WT as you stated earlier
i support that to the extreme, upto removal rom player accounts. did you see why i put hours into 3d modelling to make the historically accurate models of E-100 and panther II?
i want them fixed and the wrong ones deleted.
this old guard prioritisation is baloney
i KNOW its what gaijin wants
but gaijin isnt the playerbase. the playerbase wants balance
Except with each BR, CAS is met with a hard counter, be it, SPAAGs, SAMs and MANPADS. Except, the hard counter to DLIRCM is non-existent as of now.
Taking out an obsolete SACLOS AA in 13.0 battles is already putting yourself and your team at a disadvantage, as you cannot deal with multiple threats.
These multi SAM AAs were added due to the fact that the old SACLOS AAs could not cope with the complexity of top tier threats, and this “feature” just rendered the only AA that could effectively deal with CAS useless.
A realistic implementation and approach to DLRICM wouldn’t make helicopters completely off meta either, as they can still jam up to 3 to 2 missiles each, meaning that an IRIS-T or AIM-9X battery has to waste more missiles than it has to and gives the helicopter player time to react and get to cover.
You denying reality isn’t good for you.
It’s already been done and after that the thread descends into a circlejerk cesspool, there’s nothing more to add. I’ve been here for more than enough to notice how “plans and ideas” lead nowhere and Gaijin just keep doing their usual, ignoring all the outcries.
People also wished that early IR SAMs had their correct lock ranges on helicopters, so that they can actually engage smarter players using ATGMs. It’s been a long while and that problem is still there even with endless amounts of cope threads created about it.
It’s about damn time you start noticing patterns and conclude this is maybe what Gaijin wants and isn’t changing unless some drastic outcry happens, which is highly unlikely due to not so many players being affected by the problem.
I don’t think Gaijin agrees.
Refer to my statement above about early IR SAMs.
First you need to persuade Gaijin this is a problem that needs fixing.
This is the hardest part and most ideas fail at this step.
It would sound better if the person saying it understood at least a little bit how to play helicopters.
The sun is a point source, hence radiation emits radially, the intensity is inversely proportional to the square of distance
Laser is a planar source, the intensity doesnt depend on distance at all THEORETICALLY, particle behaviour in essence. But realistically there will be some spread but very very negligible.
a 30 KW laser burning a whole drone…
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/_HBjn2YnpZ0
yes the setup is EXTREMELY weird compared to DIRCM, but is comparable in terms of power. if a 30 kw laser can damage a drone by this much, i dont doubt a 2.8 kw laser damaging a fragile seeker
The problem is that in that short amount of time the logic of the missile will tell it to home on jam (as it is being heated by the laser) and shortly after the seeker is damaged, the missile will simply fall back to IOG+DL guidance. So for in-game purposes the latter would be the best solution, or just IOG.