No one is your post and the other is your post with my response where everyone can see how is untouched, simple.
Yes, i try to show how you really are and them people dont fall in your endless trolling spam.
Because you never said the Panzer 4G movility is not far from M18, right???
I mean it’s good for the team composition but it doesn’t enhance the German tanks CQC abilities, they still suck at CQC and are amongst the worst, the fact they require other nations to negate that problem is telling enough.
I agree, the Tiger 2 P is absolute garbage, and is completely wrecking by Jumbo 75
Tiger 2 can just point and click on jumbo from kilometer.
So, you’re basically just a clingy ex?
lmfao, we didn’t even date!
My posts are far more cerebral than your own and lay out the realities of WT as told by an informed player…your desperate attempts at deriding my posts are simply funny.
While tanks like the Panther D are obviously poorly suited for CQC, I think you’re being excessively harsh about and underselling the Germans’ general CQC capabilities.
Sureeeee.
Please, respond to that.
Most of german tanks are not suited for CQC, can’t really find any that would be better than other nation vechicles
It’s true and you’ve proven it. You keep spamming the thread whimpering about an innocuous comment from 2020…you’re like a clingy ex that won’t accept that it’s over. Well, it’s over.
Here’s the actual quote you generated you fake claims from:
What I’d actually written was a specific preface of 5.X/6.X usage with a plain assessment of the vehicles’ relative merits and had already noted the M18’s vulnerability to hull break beforehand (hull break was a mechanic then).
At the time, M18 hype was still popular–but as a German player familiar with the Hellcat, I felt obliged to provide a more realistic, sober assessment of it. Predictably, the M18 hype was overblown.
You lied about what I said and are still stewing about it over 3 years later…ouch.
If you read what was written, you’d see I acknowledged the vehicles’ differences years ago.
Rather than continually with this derailing over 2020 arguments you’re upset about, why don’t you spend some time reading and get to understanding things? (Or just refrain from posting irrelevant chatter.)
Germany has many US/SU tanks above 6.X which are reputedly better for CQC than their own native stuff. Beneath, at and above that range, Germany is also paired commonly with other nations that complement them and augment their capabilities.
Furthermore…what Germany generally has (average to above average armor/armament) is already quite nice for WT’s rendition of CQC fighting in itself, as much of WT RB GFs is CQC from the start to finish from map size alone.
Set map boundaries, hard cover and limited access points to certain areas (especially caps) mean two vehicles driving toward another will quickly find themselves in a CQC shootout regardless of exact distance just by the firing range set up by the funneling.
Much of the time, you don’t even have to go halfway across a map to get shots on people…the lane extends well into the others’ side of the map (such as on Abandoned Factory).
As I’d said before to @Miragen, saying “most German tanks are not ‘suited’” seems a tad harsh.
Most people (including myself) would probably say a long list of German vehicles could be regarded as “‘not optimized’ for CQC”–however, many of those same vehicles are entirely usable at CQC work nonetheless.
There’s nuance and variation to vehicle use…and I say that after using the Tiger II (P) and Ferdinand to great effect as anti-flankers.
Nah. The Panther D is obvously not suited for CQC and while the Panther A/G make it better, they are still not as effective as the other nations.
They are obvously not bad tanks, I quite enjoyed the Panther G when the Panther A didn’t have its engine RPM limiter and was just better than the G.
As long as you play them to their strenghts they are just as good as any other mediums in the 5.3-6.0 BR range.
I’d take the Panthers over almost any other medium at that tier for brawling. The lack of a reverse gear hurts, as does the weak side armor, but the gun is very stable while maintaining speed and the armor gives you a substantial reaction advantage over anything but the American stabilized guns.
Every other nation’s mediums have no useful armor, meaning that while they’re still trying to aim for your mantlet (And praying to the volumetric gods to let a round go through for once) you can just point and click. So long as you play a bit more carefully and pay more attention to not letting people get around you, it’s a very solid choice for brawling.
The Tigers aren’t bad either. So long as you can maintain a position where you can’t be flanked without knowing it, you can keep your armor perfectly angled to where enemies will show up. And again, the gun is great, you will punch right through most targets while they’re still trying to line up a decent shot.
They aren’t exceptional here, certainly worse than they perform at longer ranges, but compare them to what the British, Italians, Swedish, etc get. They aren’t bad at brawling in the slightest comparitively.
Their capabilities are relative to the competition, they are amazing if they are fighting reserve French tanks, but against the US and Russia they are not good, they have no features that help them in CQC, they are large, they are slow, they are heavy, they rely on frontal armor, they have slow turret rotation speed, they tend to have longer reloads… it’s just worse for them on every level compared to being at range where they are a serious threat.
A Sherman is going to dunk on a Panther in CQC, same or better mobility, faster reload, better turret rotation, on top of having a stabilizer that is always on in CQC basically.
The second a Panther comes around the corner, or the barrel comes around the corner, the Sherman has a trivial time just shooting the muzzle break which destroys the barrel because reasons.
And that’s game over, Panther cannot reverse out of there, zero chance of escaping and it’s just dead.
A somewhat insignificant weakness if you don’t overextend and let tanks get on your flanks.
They are about average in terms of medium tank speed.
Ok? Not sure how this is a weakness.
At least they have armor to rely on.
Third best in class after the 76mm Shermans and the T-34-85s, 0.7 degrees per second slower than the M4A3 76, one degree slower than the M4A1/2. Not exactly a weakness.
Longer than the US 76mm and the Fireflies, but tied with the other long 75/76mm (SA50, Comet) and the 85mm. So again, average for the tier.
Obviously the Shermans have an advantage in close quaters combat, but despite the memes, not every nation gets 76mm Shermans. Take a second and compare the Panther’s chances in close quarters versus a Firefly, a Challenger, a Comet, a T-34-85, an SA50, a Chi-Ri. These are the mediums most nations actually have at this tier.
Especially if we compare them against the second best brawlers, the Soviets, probably with the IS-1, I’d say it’s actually pretty close. The Panther has the better gun, smaller frontal weakspots, faster turret and a more stable gun, while the IS actually has a reverse gear and armor that can be angled. I might still give a slight edge to the IS, since it’s more comfortable to brawl with due to the reverse gear and more forgiving armor layout, but it’s close.
Outside the 76mm Shermans and the IS-1, what else beats the Panther in CQB? Assuming the Panther player is smart enough not to overextend and give enemies free access to his flanks.
Pretty sure that, as it currently stands, the 5.7 Panthers are the slowest (to accelerate) medium tanks out of the whole roster of 5.7 mediums.
Pretty sure that by definition that means they are below average for mediums, at least specifically at 5.7. Not that it means much.
While the Panthers don’t exactly have slow turret traverse (except the Panther F and II), this is outright false?
The M4A3 (76) has a turret traverse of 21º/s. Panther A and G is 20º/s. M4A1 and M4A2 (76) are both 24º/s.
Acceleration wise, correct, though I’d say it’s hardly crippling. They’re slower than most, but still perfectly useable. If we extend it to include mediums at or below though, then you get things like the Fireflies which are definitely on the less useable side of slow.
I see my issue, I had my Panthers in my lineup when I looked, which boosted their turret traverse due to crew skills (Why is this even a thing?).
Again though, as you say, it’s perfectly useable, and faster than several (And only 0.7 degrees slower than the M4A3). I will edit my comment to reflect this.
The actual absolute value depends on how leveled your crews are. At an equal crew level, the M4A3 will always have 5% higher turret traverse, and the M4A1 and M4A2 a 20% higher turret traverse. If you’re using a stock crew, since the base value is lower, that also means that the increase is lower.
The values I’ve quoted are for level 150, aced crews. The maximum possible.
And we clearly see “EDITED” …
Dont worry i have more:
Panzer 4G is a equal or even better than m18 for sure.
For God sake and you continues with your bad trolling attemps.
Yeah, I just went with upgraded but uncrewed values, as while I can’t make any assumptions as to crew level, I can at least assume a fully upgraded tank.
Guess someone really skilled can operate that electric turret drive just that little bit faster, huh? Sorry, that’s been a bugbear of mine forever. Same with a wounded gunner crippling your turret traverse rates.
