Planes carrying AGM’s at lower BR’s just ruin the game

So, with me unlocking my Ozelot, I got my first taste of 9.7.

It is pure hell.

My SAM’s have a max frontal aspect lock range of 6km. Pretty cool right? Until your realize they are effectively capped to 4km due to the fact the enemy can easily outmaneuver them.

The planes I’m fighting can fire AGM’s from 8km away without me even knowing. By the time they come within range, I am long dead.

The simple fact is that planes carrying and sort of AGM at this be are almost invincible. No SAM system can touch them

My suggestion is either removing their AGM’s, forcing them to actually play smart and come in close for attack runs instead of sitting back without worry of being shot down.

Or, you should simply raise the br of these aircraft to the point where there are SAM systems that can counter them. The Ozelot cannot kill an A10 flying 7km from the battlefield firing mavericks. However, the Roland can. Similar SAM systems to Roland can.


Again, this is why we need different Air RB and Ground RB BRs (And decompression)

A10 early is 10.0, which means in a balanced match it is facing the 10.0 French roland carrier which only has IRST tracking, and every other roland carrier is at 10.3.

So imo they should just lock out 6km+ ordinance until 10.3 where the rolands have a chance to counter. There simply shouldn’t be an encounter where Air outranges ground outside of special tactics like bomb throwing and TV bombs locking the ground instead of moving targets (because if you are just sitting in one place the whole match you kinda deserve to get bonked)

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This is quite a good solution with the locking ordinance until higher br’s. I think if they did that, it would solve a majority of the problems with AGM CAS.

Just remove air to ground guided munitions which are fire and forget.

Like manual controle ones are already at too low a BR but fully automated aiming and guiding from air to ground? That is insane.

Drones gave me an early taste of it and I quit right away. a 5 minute guide on the proper key binds and a few tips to firing was all I needed to get on average 1.25 kills per drone spawn. to achive the same with 500kg bombs it took me hours of gameplay. with rokets even longer. And you usually also have more than two drops with bombs and rokets.

Drones are whack, normal planes with guided munitions have big heat signatures and can like actually be locked by IR SAMs.

A-10 (Late) would be balanced facing rolands I feel, since even though the mavs technically have a tracking range of 20km, the 4x zoom and slow speed mean its more like a third of that in a real match

Now, the Maverick B’s (or the one the swiss hunter carries) are much better in game thanks to the super zoom they have, so can effectively out-range most SPAA in the game (12km tracking distance)

All of the TV GBUs in game are limited to 6/7 km tracking distance so would be okay facing rolands (Except for KAB-50 which appears to be bugged and is actually inverted with a 18km vehicle lock range)

True. Still they outrange SPAAs by multiple kilometers and usually can attack from right above where no SPAA can reach either with radar or missiles. Most of them like the A-4E or Mig 23 or 27 are immune to SPAA if played correctly. And if no SPAA is present even tzhe biggest troll could get kills at the highest level without any skill whatsoever.

Ironically the higher in BR you go for ground CAS the lower the skill level required to be effective is.
While in lower BRs up to 3.0 Cas is a bit excessive at around 4.0 to almost 7.0 CAs and SPAA remain fairly balanced in terms of capabilities even with the lack of upgrades past 5.0 for most nations. CAS needs to avoid SPAAs unless they outnumber it. Tanks have MGs capable of damaging and destroying planes as well so stupid headons get you killed most of the tiome even against tanks.
In 7.0 to around 9.0 Cas overtakes SPAAs slighly with some afterburner jets facing not a single Missile at times, making even the best shot in SPAA pray for a stupid pilot.
And past 9.0 all hell is let loose. SPAAs are either a 1 shot 1 kill monster or outterly useless. there is no inbetween and playerskill rarley matters. A Pilot who knows radar ranges (which honestly is a 2min google search) above the battlefield will fly to the needed height and then essentially play as a big Drone with no reliable counter and an almost 100% hitrate depending on map. (Rhine probably is worse for them than Sands of Sinai)

I was mostly considering ~10.3 but yeah, stuff like laser GBUs having a max range of however far they can fly in 60 seconds + precision guidance means SPAA (other than Pantsir) have literally no possible way to counter a competent laser GBU player

Pantsir can counter by virue of 20km max range, since as far as I know, to get a stabalised lase on a target you have to be within 20km

But there’s no reason any LGB carrier (A6 especially because 10.0) couldn’t simply fly over the maximum range of their target, and its only going to get worse the more the game progresses forward

In my experience, my agms can only lock on to tanks no further than about 6km. Past 6km, I can lock the ground so I could take out the tank assuming he doesnt move for that like 15+seconds it would take for the bomb/missile to hit.
Yeah, the 10g overload really hurts your chances of hitting a plane if they know you are firing at them. At least for a10s, most times I can take them out with the first missile because thy are tunnel visioned in their agm view. But if they do dodge the first missile, they tend to lose enough energy to get hit by the second.
I do think that the stingers, as well as other manpads in-game, are under preforming and I hope they get a rework soon.

The problem I have is that by the time I can get a firing solution, your missile is already out heading towards me. If I fire my missile, you’ll just dodge with ease due to how bad the FM-92K’s tracking is being able to be outmaneuvered by even the IL28.

Not to mention that if something like a heli appear, I’m just dead.

Fought a 10.0 Tiger with HOT ATGM’s today. He had already fired 7 missiles by the time he got within 4km of me. I can’t even lock helis until 3.3km.

So, understandably, I got killed. I got killed because I could not get a firing solution on the heli meanwhile he was able to kill me 2x outside the range of my SAM’s.

Laser guided weapon carrying vehicles are practically invincible if you just don’t get close.

However, everyone seems ti forget that fact and fly right into my SAM range and are surprised when my Stinger doesn’t give a damn about their flares.

This has come from a short experience of only playing SPAA at 9.7+. There just is not a lot you can do. You can only hide, but most of the time that doesn’t work.

Just remove air to ground guided munitions which are fire and forget.

“Just remove the entire reason a large % of the jets in game exist for”

Most TV ordinance is not good like that. Stop coping about CAS to the point you make up problems

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They have to get within 6km to even attempt to lock your tank. By the time they can get the lock and fire, they will be within 4-5km. If they are firing their missile from 8km+ out, they locked on to the ground and fired hoping that you will sit there.

Helis are a problem because they drastically lowered their heat signature for some reason. If they fixed that issue, helis would not be as big of a problem.

I have played a lot of the ozelot and a vast majority of my deaths were not from missiles but from a jet strafing me with guns or a close rocket strike. I also try to stay near some cover so that when I see a heli fire at me, I can just pull behind it and make them waste that missile.

I’m aware you can only fire once you’re within 4-5km. But, due to them being laser guided, you can just fly away as soon as the missile is fired. You don’t have to stay there: Then, all you have to worry about is dodging basically a flare resistant Aim 9B. Pretty damn easy if you ask me.

About the Heli’s. You see, that’s the problem though. Instead of having a fair engagement against a heli, what you have is you, hiding behind cover, waiting for the heli’s missile to hit the ground, and then peak out only to see he still isn’t close enough to fire on meaning you have to hide behind cover until he either A: RTB’s for MORE missiles or B: Is brain dead enough to come wtihin 3.3km, in that case you blow him out of the sky.

My experience has been the complete opposite in the Ozelot. I haven’t been touched by rockets or guns once. If you get strafed or rocket attacked, you did something horribly wrong.

IRST basically allows everyone to stay detected on the battlefield(unless they are above 5km alt) meaning that any plane getting close enough to strafe you or hit you with rockets is on you.

Both of these can not be true at the same time. If it is easy for them to dodge the missile, then it should be easy for them to get within gun range.

With firing tv/laser agms at that range, you have time to get behind cover. I know you think that is unbalanced but, I would argue that it would be unbalanced if spaa could just sit in an open field without having to worry much about getting hit back.

Yes, it is an artificial buff that gaijin gave to helis and still need to correct.

Most Heli’s have IRCM or other methods to reduce their heat signature.

I dont doubt that helis have a way to lower their heat signature. However, is it really able to lower it to the point that it is smaller than the heat signature than the frontal-aspect of a drone?

Except, you missed what I said. Both of these can absolutely be true at the same time I said they are easy to dodge 5km out however, if they come within your 3km death sphere, then the FM-92K’s are very hard to dodge meaning that gun runs and rocket strafes shouldn’t be possible.

Ah yes, “getting behind cover” doesn’t really help when either A) The map you are on has no cover within 1km (looking at you Fields of Poland or B) they fire the AGM dead over the top of you so if you don’t have anything covering the top of you, you are dead.

Most things at this tier don’t have LWS, meaning that if you are high enough, they can even do anything.

I don’t think SPAA should be able to sit in a field and be invincible like the Pantsir does. I also don’t think that planes should get laser guided weaponry when most SPAA’s have a hard time countering them even at 10.3.

When they are above, you can still use the missile. I sort of like it when they go up high because they will think they are being sneaky while I have them locked the whole time. If you are unable to get to cover in time, you got smoke.
I will say that currently, thanks to the missile nerf, planes have a larger advantage. Before it, I had no issues fighting planes with spaa. It was pretty fun to sit there and pick off planes the second they entered my missile’s range. I would say that it is less of a plane issue and more of an issue with gaijin nerfing spaa. Instead of removing plane munitions, which would be a big shake up and cause massive balance issues, gaijin should just revert the missile nerf.

9.7 is considered low br?

It’s considered low when SAM systems can only reach to about 4km when they are firing from 6km+.

Ozelots max range is 6km. Cas max range is about 6km, until around 11.0. The only expection i can think of is the jaguar but it would have to manually guide its bomb in. The flakrakpz’s range is 8km which allows for you to fire on them before they can get a lock.