nah 5.3 max. 5.7 turn in to food.
You hardly even played them and have negative K/D in both. Yet you want them massively uptiered.
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I dont statwhore and most the deaths are from when i was a new player years ago.
i now only take them out at 4.3 and have stabilised the K/D from it
youre also far from one that can talk about stats.
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You certainly do glaze german stuff and players like you do.
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lmao.
You seem to be only comparing stats that might help your argument.
Let’s do a more comprehensive comparison of the M4 (76) vs Pz4 H…
Armor - front = tie
Armor - side = similar but nod goes to Sherman
Armor - turret = Sherman
Gun - Penn main ammo = tie
Gun Penn Flat = Pz 4
Gun - Damage = Sherman
Gun - Rotation = Sherman
Gun - Depression = Sherman
Gun - Reload = Tie
Gun - Optics = Sherman
Gun Stab = Sherman
Secondary Arm = Sherman
Move HP/T ratio = Sherman
Move Top Speed = Tie
Move Rev = close but nod to Pz 4
Summing above…
Tie = 4
Pz 4H = 2
Sherm (76) = 9
Unless I’m missing something crucial or miscounted, it’s not even close.
Which is why the M4 (76) is BR 5.0 and the Pz 4 H is 3.7. Pz 4 H at 4.0 would not be totally out of place though.
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I understand where you are coming from however i firmly think the differences are a hell of a lot smaller than everyone thinks
the sherman overall is a better package. The sherman was objectivley the best tank of WW2 for a reason.
I just firmly beleive that the panzer 4 H/J are more than adequate to be either extremley close or identical in BR to a sherman 76mm or firefly.
armour
overall is the same in practical protection. the sherman turret is thicker but when youre facing 57mm guns at the weakest it isnt really holding up any better
Gun
the lower TNT yield of the pz4 gun really doesnt matter with how APHE still behaves, if the APHE changes had happenned id agree its got a realistic disadvantage
Sights
sherman optics are 5x 15 deg FOV only when the pz4 has a 1.9x - 3.5x 40-21 deg FOV optic. while its worse for long range its more practical for everything else because of a less restrictive FOV.
while the sherman has a quick stop stabiliser the panzer 4 is stable enough that i cant say its much worse at all. these tanks arent zippy like a cromwell so dont jerk everywhere.
mobility is close enough to be near identical across a map.
the only place i think the sherman has a major edge is the turret rotation speed
panzer 4 has a lower profile but that doesnt really matter either.
4.3 would be the lowest acceptable BR for them when comparing the two. 4.0 for the F2 and G would be fair as they are glass canons that get eaten by 2pdr guns. 4.7 fits best and that whole BR is a glass canon meta with rare exclusion to the churchill VII
when you can lolpen the best and most BS gaijin jankily armoured medium of that whole BR range (T34) through the upper plate from as far as a kilometre i just cant agree with it being matchmakered with the likes of and m4a1 75mm or a ram 1
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Walking down this road can be dangerous though… the 3.3 M10 GMC can penn the front of a 5.7 Tiger H with enough post-pen damage to kill most of the crew - if not outright killing it through ammunition capping off.
The Sherman is better at almost everything, even if the gap is sometimes small. It’s the sum of the parts.
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the difference is that a wolverine is a self propelled tank destroyer. its doctrinal role is different.
compare mediums not TDs
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Agreed. Below tiger tier I’d always pick the Pz4’s 75 over the 17pdr because it already has plenty of pen and far, far better postpen. The Pz4 is a much better package than people make out to be, and the armour isn’t better than something like a cromwell, despite having a better gun and being a lower BR.
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There is no “doctrine” in WT. You play each tank to the best of its ability.
M10 and long gun Pz IVs play identically due to weak armor, mediocre mobility, and good guns.
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Pz.4 is better than the M10 at pretty much everything, whilst M4A1 (76) is only better than Pz.IV in some specific areas.
I mostly play arcade, where last month I had a 3.17 K/D. But I’m not the one arguing that vehicles where I have a negative K/D and played less than 30 games with should be MASSIVELY uptiered.
Which is why one is 3.3 and the other 3.7.
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HAHAHAHAHA
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the other should be 3.7-4.3, whilst currently it’s 3.3-3.7.
4.0 rank 3 would be just perfect. If it’s not rank 3 it can stay at 3.7.
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I have killed MBTs using the PzIV F2, that doesn’t mean it should get moved to top tier. They are fine where they are at
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F2 at 3.7
J at 4.0
H at 4.3
All rank 2 would be best imo
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Why would they all be rank 2? Do you want them to specifically NOT be able to grind events?
F2 and J are sidegrades, if one is gonna be 3.7 they should both be. H would be more than fine at 4.0 shared with the G.