Also “no one plays the jumbo”? Are you kidding? It’s the 5th most played heavy tank in the entire US lineup, followed by the Jumbo 76 in 3rd place and extremely powerful 6.7 T34/T29.
If France had a 4x 50 cal truck that’d be fine.
@Beeschurger
What? Tigers and Panthers are brawlers not snipers.
Panther v. Jumbo… Tiger H is inferior to the Jumbo at close range, obviously. But anecdotes like this are unhelpful. Full teams of jumbos are non-existent. I see full teams of Tigers and Panthers all the time, but never full teams of jumbos (I wonder why…). Regardless, they could move the Jumbo up to 6.0 because they moved everything else around it up.
Because the Panthers were the main tanks of the later German Wehrmacht while the Jumbo was always a niche tank in the US Army, and for the US side likes to spam light tanks and then CAS.
The Tiger maybe, but the panther is much more of a sniper than a brawler.
Panthers arent nowhere near agile enough (NOT faster, agile) to brawl.
Tigers need to keep their distance to have their armor angled as effectively as possible.
Both get worse closer to enemy they get due to weakspots being more prominent enough.
The Panthers are more snipers/flankers. The Tigers are just multi-purpose crypto-medium tanks that act as the main brawling tank for the Germans for lack of a better option.
That is wierd, because thats all i use my 6.0 Panther for and it does really well due to a very stable gun plattform, and good traverse.
And this describes every tank ever. And in the case of the Panther it just means you as a panther get to leverage the excellent gun plattform
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Not saying you are making stuff up but anyone who has ever played panther knows that they indeed do not traverse well.
For mid to long range combat yes.
Panthers and Tigers get dunked on by stabilised shermans at close range.
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Hull traverse is fine and the turret traverse is rather decent on the 6.0 Panthers.
For all combat ranges. The Panther has an exceptionally stable gun plattform that makes it able to fire on the move just fine.
In the case of the Panther at 6.0 thats mostly a skill issue. Well at least the Panther A has an excuse to some degree. The other ones having near immunity against the Sherman 75.
Brawling is about reload more than anything, and armor second.
Agility has little to do with brawling.
Which is why the Tiger 2 and T26E5 are the best 6.7 brawlers in the game for example.
The Jumbo 75 is 5.7 precisely because they moved it up together with everything else around it in those BR ranges.
You’re asking for something that has already happened.
You ARE making stuff up.
On part of Panthers, yes.
You are contradicting yourself.
If agility has nothing to do with brawling, then by your own metric both panther and tigers are bad brawlers.
Short 88 has slower reload than Tiger I and its armor is objectively bad unless angled - and to angle precisely and fast enough, you need to have agility.
Moreso for panther which has strong armor only in the frontal aspect, side armor is objectively terrible and you NEED to angle your tank to face enemy with your strongest armor, again, something you do with AGILITY.
Short 88 reloads in 8.5 seconds without expert crew, that is fast.
Angling armor is exactly what you do in brawling which is why Tiger 1 is so good at it especially.
None of what you said has to do with agility, and all you did was prove there are no contradictions in my post.
T-44 has 8.5 seconds.
M26 has 8.6 seconds [it’s 6.7 due to its APCR though].
Just as two examples…
Well in game its exceptionally stable. No CA Lorraine, but close enough. And im offcourse just reciting my experience in using the Panther at 6.0.
This is offcourse in game, IRL firing on the move for basically any tank except at low speed in a stabilized sherman was out of the question.
Mmh.
This is not true. It does not matter if you load APCR or any other shell, the reload on the M26 remains 7.5 to 9.75 seconds depending on crew (without taking into account the reload multiplier that comes into effect when you run out of ammunition on the ready rack).
The hull traverse is terrible.
Being able to fire at short/medium ranges on perfectly flat ground whilst travelling at a constant speed (i.e. not accelerating or deaccelerating) is hardly “exceptional” and is nothing like having a stabiliser.
No. Given equal skill the Sherman wins every time. The Panthers have massive muzzle breaks that are very easy to hit with stabilised Shermans.
It really isnt
And every sherman other than the Jumboes get lolpenned, and the jumbo you just fire in the machinegun port.
And the jumbo 76 isnt stabilized iirc. And if you arent in the Panther A, you have basically frontal immunity against the Jumbo.
Sure, a Jumbo can deal with a Panther, but the Panther has every opportunity to do the same against the Jumbo