i think the poll was about the state of the whole Minor nations not just the top tiers
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Yeah but for pretty much every tier except the top few, minor nations are pretty equal, even when compared to the big 3. All nations have fairly solid rank 3-6s. France and Japan suffer more in tier 1 but they pass by really quickly, so it doesn’t really matter.
Like sure there’s a few gaps in those tiers, like early jet/late-prop CAS, a random mid-tier lineup being bad, and all the various rank 4 SPAA gaps, but overall the main differences are is at top tier.
Israel in this regard is the weakest, because after rank 4 they have 0 light vehicles, and most of the medium tanks are really sluggish too.
2 Likes
A lack of premium options for “minor” nations is also a big problem and it’s quite easy to solve, as you can make multiple c&p GE premium reskins across different brs. For example, Italy could easily get one of Hungarian MiG-21s as a GE premium + some slightly different variant of AMX can be a pack premium instead of F-104S as the only option.
Another issue is a lack of ingenious weapons (and designs as well) which would make vehicles more interesting (Medusa and Orione launchers, various WW2 bombs including MOTOBOMBA FFF, Sispre C-7 aams, ground vehicles equipped with Folgore recoilless rifles and etc).
All italy 11+ BR APDF 900mm
China to russian tree ( basically add tor and ztz )
Israel to USA tree ( basically 3 merkavas )
Remove all soviet stuff from other than russia ( except the german ones )
Remove spall lines
Game fixed 80%
If you are creating a poll, the sample has to be a random selection of the subset of people you are polling. So if you are interfering with this randomness, the polled sample is no longer representative.
So the title of the thread needs to be neutral and be more enticing to people leaning a certain way towards an answer of a poll-question.
The title is adressed to people playing minor nations. Which is fine regarding the first two questions as they are just asking things like “which minor nation do you play?”.
But the question like “should minor nation be a priority right now for gaijin?” Is like asking “what is better AB or RB?” In the RB subsection of the forum… The result isn’t representative of the war thunder playerbase. The question becomes useless.
1st issue I’ve always had is nations not getting content despite having options to do so while claiming they get less content be a use less people play them. Well who are people going to play the 3 nations that get 80% or more of an updates content or the nation still suffering from huge gaps and lack of regular content?
Look how much smaller the British tree is compared to the top 3 despite being in the game the same amount of time, being a major developer of weapons systems like planes, tanks and ships and technologies.
When new vehicles are added to nations outside top 3 they often lack the unique technology or me hanics that vehicle would have because it’s new and the top 3 don’t have it yet. But when it’s a top 3 nation it gets all the new tech while other have to wait months or years to get equivelant.
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China should not be treated like a minor nation.
2 Likes
What’s most annoying is that 99% of the minor nations issues could probably be fixed in a single major update. They just… won’t
Britain for example:
Air:
We are mostly fine. Though they have made some colossal mistakes recently (Aim-9M on the Gr7 for example). But for the most part, what we need is just previous additions fixing. Tornado Gr1, Sea Harrier FRS1, Tornado F3, Harrier Gr7 and Buccaneer S2B. All missing crucial aspects that kinda nerf them hard.
Lower tiers are fine-ish, but missile systems like SRAAM and Red Tops need a total overhaul.
We could probably just do with additions like the Gnat and Hawk and our jet era stuff would be golden. But Britian has loads of additions that we are still waiting on, like a proper bomber mosquito.
Ground:
At top tier, it would just take 1 or 2 good IFVs and fixing the Challenger 2.
Below that, they really just need to polish our SPAA line and stop screwing around with the BR of tanks that were fine where they were (thinking tanks like the Chieftain Mk3)
Naval:
Mostly suffers due to compression. But would be good to get some missing features like naval radar. But all we really need is 1 good top tier Battleship. Which Britain has half a dozen to choose from.
3 Likes
Ariete’s not listed.
AMX is, and it’s going up as it should.
I find this post somewhat gratuitous as players will always think that their nation “suffers” more. You go to any national community on this forum that plays their nation, and they think that Gaijin has something out to get them. The problem is not just with Gaijin themselves, but also with the playerbase. They will naturally gravitate to nations like Russia, the US, and Germany. With a lack of interest, Gaijin has less incentive to invest in minor nations. Unfortunately, this leads to a cycle where minor nations are thus less interesting to other players. If Gaijin invested more in such minor nations, I’m sure they would see a return. Also nations like Japan suffer from lack of information, not only with primary sources being in another language
Also calling the UK a “minor nation” is absurd.
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Players are not interested in Chinese vehicles (other than Chinese players themselves), so it is not surprising they do not receive as much attention
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Any nation thats not Soviet Union/Russia suffers from a severe lack of information on their vehicles, some more than others.
Abrams Composite: Based off export armour package.
Ariete War Kit: Nuff said
Merkava 4: Composite is just cardboard against KE
Challenger 2: Mobility will never be fixed because minor nation, TES ERA, Mantlet remodel, APFSDS
Leclerc: Armour, Fuel Tanks, Mobility, APFSDS
ZTZs: Mantlet is wrong.
All nations suffer to some degree at certain points with their vehicles BUT objectively nations that are not US, Germany, USSR, Sweden (In top tier GRB) suffer more. People use their nation’s problems to discredit other nations problems because “they see themselves as suffering more”. When in reality all minor nations suffer.
Perfectly quoted.
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The biggest issue of “minor” nations is their lower profitability for Gaijin. Gaijin is influenced by profit only, many historical issues are ignored (not a bug) if there is not a sufficient threat or possibility of increased profit. For example, refusal to fix the tens of issues of ZTZ99A. But, when the American community was in uproar about uranium armour, a 5 second reload was readily dispensed (which is also due to the fallacious statistics-based balancing of Gaijin).
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Dont know much about the other nations, but gaijn really needs to take a look at swedish aircraft BR’s, at least for the J22/J21.
J22-B is the most egregious issue.
I’m disappointed with the state of Italy, France, and Israel. Major TT gaps, underperforming vehicles, and a lack of diverse playstyles.
Italy suffers from TT gaps and underperforming vehicles.
Israel suffers from TT gaps, underperforming vehicles, and a lack of diverse vehicles.
France suffers from TT gaps, underperforming vehicles, and a lack of diverse vehicles.
Israel and France have many vehicles that could be added to fix this issue. I’m not well versed in French designs, but even I know they have loads of wheeled vehicles to pick from. Israel has just been neglected. Sure, we finally have something of a TD line, but it’s basically non-existent. There’s plenty of unique and non-copy/paste additions that could be placed there. As for Israel’s light tank and IFV line, they haven’t even tried. I can only recall the tech tree having a single AML-90.
I’m sure other tech trees have their issues, but I don’t really know how to comment on them as I’ve rarely played or interacted with them. As someone who plays Israel and France though, I’d love to see these flourish.
Complaining about France not having enough vehicles?
Another low tier AA next update, take it or leave it.
lol.
They do have a tech tree gap from 9.7 to 11.7, so I think they should get some love. They’re also missing a large portion of variety towards the top of their tech tree for Ground Battles. France has a mobility doctrine, so seeing them not get their wheeled additions is sad. Same also goes for the US.
God forbid Gaijin adds Light tanks to help fill France and Britain.
Still waiting for Gaijin to add LITERALLY ANYTHING to Israel thats not a M60 / Merkava.
Just some Israel tanks they could add.
Pereh
Achzarit IFV
Namer IFV
Sholef SPG
HVSD/ADAMS
PT-76-2000
Carmel
AMX-13 60mm HVMS
The Israeli tree suffers from the same Gaijin created problem that France does. Current tree has large capability gaps, people don’t play said tree, Gaijin uses lack of players to justify not spending effort to add possible vehicles. It’s a viscous cycle and it’s gonna take Gaijin just ignoring current player numbers to build a desirable tree.
Both trees also suffer from the same problem at top tier, nothing to offer expect AA and bad MBTs.
Comment pulled from Israel
This problem extends to UK, Italy, Sweden, Japan, China there so many vehicles these nations could get but since “Low player count” the nations don’t get anything.
All minor nations need is a focus devs have on major nation - prioritize adding vehicles to minor trees until they have everything major nations have.
It’s just ridiculous to see yet another CAS su25 now with 20km AGMs while best thing I have is hardcoded 8km max range type81(if lucky to get good weather).
Ridiculous to get a poor copy-paste into the tree that is missing entire vehicle categories in some lineups while major nation that already have everything gets another unique thing.
Minor nations are minor because devs don’t give them a thing, not because of something about nation itself.
All ten tech trees currently get equal attention.
Equal attention =/= equal output; despite that they tend to have similar outputs regardless.