“Finland isn’t as new”
I have absolutely no idea why you think this.
“Yes, it’s pretty much devoid of props”
It’s not pretty much devoid of them, it’s devoid of them completely.
“I don’t mean a tree but more just more SAAF vehicles”
This has already been done with JAS39C.
Pyorremyrsky, Fokker, B-239, Hurricane, Bf-109. They have as many fighters per rank as Sweden.
IIRC SA was 2021, Finland was 2022.
Once, at top tier, after 2-3 years with the same top tier fighter where vehicles like the Cheetah, F1CZ, etcetera fill the gap between 9.7 and 11.3 (if you even class vehicles like the Hunter f.6 as decent fighters).
So yes, I do think the implementation of SA has been rather tone-deaf/shoddy/half-assed or whatever. You can argue Finland and Hungary are more-so but that doesn’t mean both cannot be true simultaneously.
Edit:on the ‘not as new note’ apparently I forgot how to English, I meant not as old
“Pyorremyrsky, Fokker, B-239, Hurricane, Bf-109. They have as many fighters per rank as Sweden.”
I thought you were only referring to Finnish vehicles. Also, the Pyorremyrsky should not be counted due being a premium.
“IIRC SA was 2021, Finland was 2022.”
Yes, meaning that South Africa isn’t as new, not Finland.
As for point three, that’s subjective, and thus I have nothing to say on it.
I was referring to vehicles that fly under the Finnish flag and would otherwise not be in the tree.
Fair enough.
That was my mistake, I meant not as old, as in SA would therefore have had more time to be developed and therefore should, in theory, be larger.
Anyway, I suspect AMRAAM for the next major update, IIRC the word is one of the first two major updates of the year. To counter AMRAAM there is the option of the R-77, I doubt the R27EA as kinematically its an ER on a few steroids with an ARH Seeker and should I believe be better than the early R77.
That is the point. You can add what remains to be added from a national TT. Or you can put a subTT and stretch the useful life of that nation much further. This is perfect if we think that many vehicles could never be in the game because those nations cannot support themselves and if you add to all this that you expand the representation to other regions of the world, then the sub trees may be some of Gaijin’s best inventions in recent years.
This game is based on adding vehicles every few months. At this rate and at the point we are at, without sub trees the game would not be able to maintain the current pace of updates for much longer.
This is already happening. Great Britain, Sweden and Italy extended their useful life to continue receiving vehicles in future updates. UK needed light tanks in almost all its lines. Could the UK have received its light subTT with indigenous vehicles? I’m sure I could have, but then what?
South Africa allowed the UK to complete its lineups and, at the same time, continue receiving vehicles for some time to come. The same with Sweden and Italy, these sub trees will give oxygen to these technological trees for a longer time.
SubTTs are inevitable if we want this game to receive content for many years to come. The German air TT urgently needs a subTT (unless we agree that the game is over for the German air in a few more updates).
If they don’t get something rule bending (trialed vehicles) or a Subtree then yeah its going to be dead until at least the second half of the year.
I love how they like to explain things as rules but yet deny having rules and yet again using some random X rule
Like now They are not letting Germany have a trailed vehicles to fill in gaps.
But yet Sweden got the T-80U which they don’t need.
I agree. My main problem (and what is felt here) is the lack of predictability of the game in the future.
We have Challenger 3, Leopard 2A7V 2S38 and T90M among others, and then what? What will we receive in each major update?
Did you think about this?
The only game mode that is exempt from sub trees at the moment is naval.
May I once again point out that Gaijin has dug itself into the current place and doesn’t seem to want to change that.
That a tree is made up of researchable 5 lines max and that a sub-tree is 1 line.
With everything we’ve learned, it doesn’t seem like Gaijin wants to change this so we only have 3 at max but more like 2 that could take a sub-tree. This brings us to point one more tech-trees.
We still have plenty that even if they just have to last until they could get a sub-tree. It would be fine.
My assumption is that at the ends of the lines there’ll be modern tech demonstrators and experimental MBTs like the Leopard 2-140 and M1 CATTB, as well as giving NLOS missiles more of their real life capabilities and moving all vehicles with them up.
We need sub trees to have their own tab within the host nation.
That is the only way forward to me
I think with naval for most tree’s you either have enough for a full tree or you don’t. Therefore subtree’s are not required. At most you can argue the UK has some CW naval additions but they were quite literally a part of the Royal Navy and the sub-nation was more like a division within the RN than an independent force.
I don’t understand why some are against sub trees. We’re getting to the point where at least 5 nations receive the M109 in the same update.
This is what I mean when people don’t understand how the game works.
Without new sub trees and nation and we are at a point of adding tanks not even in service yet.
How are we going to keep going forward ?
Hehe F-35 would like to have a word btw m8
Yes, that would have been the better way of doing so(and would have allowed for more than one sub-tree).
But we work with what we have. 5 researchable lines (Air and Ground) and 1 sub-tree (line 5).
From our more extreme Bexladux ideas: Dutch tree with large Bulgum sub-tree.
Or our less extreme Commonwealth idea(Now that it won’t have SA): Canada with an ANZAC sub-tree.
I believe that these are the only possible nations with sub-tree combos actively talked about. Or at least the only ones I’ve taken part of.
I’m not against it. It’s just that the facts I have collected from Gaijin have it so how sub-trees are done right now not all nations can get one.
If they did it differently maybe I’d look at the big three and say the could get one but now how they are right now.
In other forums we work with a Latin American TT project, but we don’t get too excited until Gaijin shows signs of wanting to incorporate combined trees.
A TT between Argentina, Brazil and Chile can work well in the game if they do it combined.
The good thing is that Gaijin always bends his own rules. The bad thing is that we never know in which direction he does it.