Nerf MICAs

[UNN_Daedalos]

@かがり

Mica-EM, Gaijin: YOLO MISSILE GO BALLIN

More like MICA-EM, => cut the range by 30 clicks

@Thodin

Micas should be disabled for Ground RB maps. Its indeed the most imbalanced missile ever. These maps are too small, there is no way to compete with Rafales. For ARB you have at least the chance to stay out of range. But Ground RB is just unplayable. They spawn and in minutes the whole sky es empty - all shot down by air spawned Micas.

Careful what you wish for, the occasional mad french main doing some CAP (hello) is one of the few things preventing your leopard from being obliterated by a continuous KH38MT apocalyptic rain.

@MikeyPlayzonYT

I don’t agree with what the topic suggests at all, but lets not act like the MICA isn’t a top 3 ARH missile in the game.

Nah quite clerarly it’s busted especially on Ground RB map. But i’d much prefer the spawns to be further away, give some space to aircrafts, or over gameplay tweaks, removing MICA EM from french CAP or nerfing it to the ground is a laughable solution.

What do you want to do CAP with, Magic II and 530D ?

[Fluffy_Bucketles]

Can’t really call folk out for cope, then present arguably the greatest example of it. Just a bit silly.

You outrange threats with MICA by ~20km effective range (worst case) from equivalently competent platforms with AIM 120. MICA is below top 3, as even the base R77 out ranges it. Only sub 15km (if you’re fortunate) does MICA start gaining an edge, at which point an AMRAAM (or R77-1) would have been well on its way. AMRAAM is generally the best ARH missile, with only minor pressure from the R77-1 to rival its BVR efficacy. Except you find R77-1 is found on a very mediocre platform as opposed to some of the best aside from Rafale. The primary (and arguably only one worth noting) advantage for MICA is the agility in the short range. Sub 10km, sure, it’s the best (But both R77-1 and AIM 120 are still very competent at these ranges). But you’ve still got 40km to make up in which you’ve already been engaged.

@dedale_stargate

Nah quite clerarly it’s busted especially on Ground RB map.

Only overly effective here on account of things starting within its range, as opposed to starting well outside of its range generally followed by salvoing a volley of AMRAAMs well before they’re in a good launch distance otherwise.

[UNN_Daedalos]

yep

Bye bye KH38 and Kronstadt then

[ItsOnyy]

Airfields and air spawns should be moved back by at least multiple factors, and they should also have MANPADS or SACLOS missiles protecting them, hilariously pathetic SPAAG should have been swapped for top tier long ago. Or better yet, remove AMRAAMS from top tier GRB, it’s completely unplayable at this time.

[Farlexgamer_psn]

@Fluffy_Bucketles

Rafale does not carry the second best Fox 3, let alone first. It falls behind in range/energy retention to R77-1 and AIM 120. You know, generally the more beneficial aspects for BVR

Well alright then, it carries the 2nd best fox-3, just behind the R-77-1, more and more people are improving at notching missiles, especially from longer ranges in which case evading missiles becomes stupidly easy.

Realistically speaking, if someone is dying consistently from missiles shot from more than 15 or 16 km away, they have a skill issue.

Besides, amraams are not as good as you are making them seems to be, not saying they are bad of course, but the only thing they excel is range and even then the R-77-1 is tied with them while also having superior turning capabilities.

a rafale can play both offensive and defensive at the same time; the capability of the rafale to stay in the notch while lobbing micas can and will lure planes to push the rafale resulting in the opponents getting closer and closer to the effective range of micas.

When power creep keeps creeping

Jump straight to the minute 6:12 and you will see just how easy it is.

@Fluffy_Bucketles

This was tested in full real, without the aoa limiter, minimum fuel load, and no armament, in a multitude of maneuvers to give this claim the most chance of occurring.

Who and when did such tests.

@Fluffy_Bucketles

A more notable exception being the Gripen, because people like you complained, even when they had the figures accurate.

Ah yes, the plane of which there are so few docs about it’s flight performance, gaijin seemed to just guess them all when they released it.

@Fluffy_Bucketles

MICA is below top 3

Lmao no

@Fluffy_Bucketles

But you’ve still got 40km to make up in which you’ve already been engaged.

At such distance i don’t even need chaff to defeat the missile

[Farlexgamer_psn]

Yea sure

[MikeyPlayzonYT]

/s means sarcasm or satire

@Fluffy_Bucketles

MICA is below top 3, as even the base R77 out ranges it.

Catergorically false lmao. 20km headon shots are very viable with the MICA.

@Fluffy_Bucketles

Only sub 15km (if you’re fortunate) does MICA start gaining an edge, at which point an AMRAAM (or R77-1) would have been well on its way.

Good thing it’s on the best plane in the game with best-in-class everything to make defeating missiles easy mode.

@Fluffy_Bucketles

AMRAAM is generally the best ARH missile

The AAM-4 is just better in every way

@Fluffy_Bucketles

AIM 120 are still very competent at these ranges)

The Aim-120 is the worst.

[WreckingAres283]

@かがり

AAM-4’s being nerfed from 50G’s to 32G’s not to mention other nerfs gaijin implemented to it

AAM-4 on dev server was a MICA EM copy, there was no nerf. Even the 32G are incorrect, it should be 25G.

In fact, the AAM-4 was never nerfed, all changes it ever got were buffs.

[UNN_Daedalos]

@Farlexgamer_psn

a rafale can play both offensive and defensive at the same time; the capability of the rafale to stay in the notch while lobbing micas at the same time can and will lure planes to push the rafale resulting in the opponents getting closer and closer to the effective range of micas.

I mean if you want to nerf the Rafale sure, i won’t disagree with you, the thing turns crazy G and maybe keeps its energy too well, but on that particular video :

• The guy is defensive all the time, a novice player would have been dead long ago, the opponents, 16 and 15, also took the bait quite happily. You want to approach with an angle when you get close, so that you can notch quickly if needed, they just went straight at him. That means when fired at, they need to turn 90° instead of 30 or so when going in the notch, and they lose time doing so, time you don’t have against a fox 3 fired up close
• The MICA isn’t as much of a problem as the ability of the plane to point its nose at will.

Case in point : the MICA wasn’t talked about much or considered a big threat when it was carried on M2K only. It only became a problem when it could be yeeted at mach 1.8 at 10km, making it a menace even at medium range considering its DV and the little reaction time it gives to an opponent

[Farlexgamer_psn]

@dedale_stargate

I mean if you want to nerf the Rafale

I do, in fact, i don’t have as much of a problem with the mica (which i think it’s fine as it is) as i do with the rafale.

The plane is the best in almost everything, dogfight, wvr, cas… you name it, it’s always in the convo of being the best or one of the best.

The rafale is already absurdly broken, and the mica only amplifies the problem.

@dedale_stargate

That means when fired at, they need to turn 90° instead of 30 or so when going in the notch, and they lose time doing so, time you don’t have against a fox 3 fired up close

Explain the last part

[UNN_Daedalos]

@Farlexgamer_psn

The plane is the best in almost everything, dogfight, wvr, cas… you name it, it’s always in the convo of being the best or one of the best.

Yes well one could say it was added a bit too early

@Farlexgamer_psn

rafail

drop it though, it doesn’t bring much to the discussion

[GALWAYLION-live]

Yeah, the China and British mains here are totally Rafale abusers

[Farlexgamer_psn]

Please explain further the last part of your comment i highlighted

[MikeyPlayzonYT]

look up what /s means

[かがり]

source?

[UNN_Daedalos]

@Farlexgamer_psn

Explain the last part

Missed it

In the video around 6 minutes, the F15 are going straight to the Rafale, i’ll try with a poorly made schema :
Mind you i’m not saying the Rafale isn’t very strong at close range, i’m just implying that the F15 and F16 could have lasted longer in that fight, and caused the protagonist of that video more problems.

Here we go :

In the scenario, the opponents arrived like this :

Straight at the Rafale doing its evasive shenanigans. When the Rafale fires a MICA at relatively close range, those guys are basically dead, because they have no time to “hit the notch” (make their plane trajectory and the missile trajectory perpendicular → leads to a greater chance of the missile losing lock because the pulse doppler in the missile seeker doesn’t detect any relative velocity, to put it simply)

Now onto the second scenario :

If they keep the rafale near their radar’s gimbal limit, they can create an offset angle, and if a Rafale baits them like our protagonist, they will gain precious seconds to hit the notch faster and potentially evade the missile. Quite ironically, that’s exactly the technique Rafale players use all the time to fire off boresight shots and evade counter fire quickly.

Please note : i’m not saying that it will be as efficient in a F16 or a F15 than in a Rafale, because MICAs do in fact give a clear advantage in off boresight close range shots, but it is a way to survive longer and give more problems to your opponents, especially when in a 2v1 situation like in the video.

Note bis : this is theory of course, in game behavior can be more erratic. it’s not an “ez win” button, and i’m aware that it’s not necessarily reliable all the time, but in the long term and on a large sample of encounters, you will feel a difference

Please excuse the terrible hand drawing X)

[MotorolaCRO]

MICA doesn’t need any nerfs.

[SirinKaslana]

I love having the French on my team in Ground RB. Keeps the pesky CAS mains out of the air and my tank happy on ground instead of getting insta obliterated by some CAS mook spawning in after getting a cap and 2 assists.

[Xeno_quaza]

Thrust vectoring missiles internally have PID values which change over time to limit this (as well as timetohittogain values like other ARHs), however they dont really line up with burn times at all so they dont actually help that much.

[WatchAboveBroLOL]

I didn’t said MICAs are long range I said the jet platforms that can carry MICAs can also carry long range missiles.