Should Namer RCWS-30, Namer Tsrikhon and Eitan recieve additational munitions in the hull to fix its poor perfomance?
- Yes. They should recieve additational munitions.
- No. Leave those vehicles as it is.
Right now Israeli IFV’s have a huge issue, making them currently unplayable.
Game mode:
Vehicles affected:
- Namer RCWS-30
- Namer Tsrikhon
- Eitan (wich is obviously gonna get the exact same treatment)
Issue with following vehicles:
Both types of battle modules found on those vehicles lose all of its munitions after being hit once. No additational belts found in the hull of those vehicles, except for two spike missiles.
Why is this a huge issue:
- Namers are extremely slow and cant really capture points for resupply in 99% of cases
- Unlike BMPT’s it has absolutely no armor against 120/125 mm shells so those vehicles cant effectively engage MBT’s frontally
- Unlike BMPT’s its 30mm belts getting blown away completely, not leaving any ammunition left except for maybe 5-8 shots
- Munitions used on those vehicles are extremely unreliable due to bushmaster accuracy/damage and spike missiles struggling to deal damage at all
- right now 11.3 in GRB plays only against 12.0-12.3 BR. Most vehicles you face are nearly impossible to kill with those IFV’s kit.
Examples of similar vehicles found in other tech trees:
-
Puma VJTF (Germany):
(+) much faster movement speed
(+) faster turret traverse
(+) much harder to destroy its 30mm belts
(+) if its currently loaded belts gets destroyed, you can still rearm due to additational belts stored in a hull
(+) time fuze rounds
(+) while being objectively better vehicle, sits 0.3 BR lower for some reasons
-
KF41 (Italy):
(+) much faster movement speed
(+) much faster turret traverse
(–) can be oneshoted to the turret
(+) if its currently loaded belts gets destroyed, you can still rearm due to additational belts stored in a hull
(+) sits 0.3 BR lower
-
EBRC Jaguar (France):
(+) much faster movement speed
(+) much faster turret traverse
(–) can be oneshoted to the turret
(+) doesnt have an actual ammo in a turret
(+) huge difference in firepower - it can reliably penetrate t-80/90 in a side aspect with its main canon
(+) time fuze rounds
(+) sits 0.3 BR lower
-
BMPT/BMPT-72 (USSR):
(+) much faster movement speed
(+) faster turret traverse
(+) huge difference in firepower - doesnt fight USSR MBT’s for obvious reasons, have much better rate of fire which is critical, can reliably aim for a weakspots with its atgm
(+) huge difference in armor - cant be penned at 90% of its frontal aspect
(+) huge difference in survivability - the rest 10% of areas which are actually can be penned frontally, cant be considered weakspots. APFSDS often gets stopped by a drivers face or just passes through the vehicle, killing driver and engine but ignoring ammo in the hull
(+) BMPT version having two additational crew members
(–) worse gun depression angles
(–) worse reverse speed
(+) BMPT version having time fuze rounds
(+) for some absolute unknown reasons (jk) gets ammo box, so it can practically never be left without ammo
Honorable mentions:
-
2S38 (USSR)
(+) faster vehicle movement speed
(+) faster turret traverse
(+) huge difference in firepower - can penetrate any vehicle frontally with exception of most heavily armored Leo 2’s
(+) crazy difference in damage - can oneshot MBT’s if you aim properly (also gets AP shells with explosive mass)
(+) PF rounds
(+) nearly impossible to ammorack by hitting turret
(–) worse gun depression angles
(+) same survivability because of fuel tank
(+) sits 0.6 BR lower
-
Freccia/Freccia OWS 30 (Italy):
(+) much faster movement speed
(+) faster turret traverse
(+) huge difference in firepower - much faster firerate of 25mm in case of regular Freccia, 10 Spikes, unlike 4 on other vehicles
(–) regular Freccia can be oneshoted to the turret
(+) sits 0.6 BR lower
Given Israeli IFV’s losing its ammo after being shot once with 30mm at the turret and not being able to rearm most of the times in case of Namers, I consider them inferior to all of their counterparts in other tech trees.
My proposal is to add 8 additational spikes in the hull of Namers and Eitan instead of 2, as well as 200 additational 30mm rounds (2x100 shells like in Puma) so those vehicles can be actually useful because of quantity of its munitions and not being “bricked” by a one random 30mm shell randomly hitting its unmanned turret.
Why is it fair:
- Namers and Eitan have enormously large crew compartment meant to carry infantry with its munitions and weapons. its obviously can be used to transport supplies such as its own munitions.
- BMPT’s got additational munitions in case of supply boxes even so there is absolutely no space for extra missiles and 30mm belts inside
25 Likes
The Namers are very underwhelming, specially considering they are the same BR as the BMPTs.
Therefore, any way to improve them would be warmly welcome!
10 Likes
Namers are meant to play hull down with the crewless turrets, but then 4 spikes, that most of the time does not one shot… What you gonna do? flank enemy tanks while driving a 64 T with 54 km/h top speed? yeah dont think so
4 Likes
Yep thats exactly what im pointing out here. Im not even asking for reasonable armor for this vehicles - we all know its 60 tons of Israeli mainers tears between paper screens. Im just trying to find a way of increasing its effectivness by means oficially used by gaijin as a balancing factors.
Also spikes must recieve damage buff. Im not even talking about oneshots, I specially mean damage. Its just stupid how most of my missiles simply bounce out of armor or breaking machineguns on top of a tanks. I definetely managed to utilize 3 out of 4 spikes like 3-4 times during my whole time of playing on namers, but it happened during a thousand matches so the percent of effective hits is just sad. Spike should at least take out two crew members and damage alot of tanks insides but right now you need at least 2 of them just to get 2s38. But this is a topic for another post.
Right now you can literally charge at Namers in any MBT without any fear of slightest resistance. So they should at the very least be somewhat descent support vehicles, providing fire support to allied MBT’s and not just losing its whole ability to infict damage the second they stick tip of their manless turret out of a hill.
2 Likes
The only realistic way to increase damage its the correct lofting trayectory, you just cant increase the TNT or the spall bc its a light ATGM in compare with the hellfires (which got a spall buff).
2 Likes
Yep this is one of the ways you can improve it. And dont forget - damage in general and spall are completely imaginary values, which are being adjusted for balancing reasons. Its not like you cant increase spall of a spike missile because of some of its irl characteristics.
1 Like
It has to be done this way, just imagine:
11.3Namer RCWS-30 +11.3Namer Tsrikhon + 11.3Eitan = one 10.7Freccia, gaijin what are you doing, is there any balance left at all？
1 Like
they should just give the namer more armor, it weighs one ton less than the merkava mk4 with less armour and no turret
6 Likes
I agree but just because we have proof that actually has this armour gaijin just will ignore every report about it even tho its an obvious thing
1 Like
unfortunately israel keeps its military tech a lot more secret than italy, if you want spikes i guess youll just have to wait for the pereh
2 Likes
@Smin1080p_WT @Stona_WT hey guys, could you pass this to devs, please? Israeli IFV’s are the only vehicles with this issue of losing its ability to fight after one random 30 mm shell hitting unmanned turret…
And we dont even have an actual top tier mbt, spaa, jet or heli: everything is completely inferior to other nations, but have its BR artificially rised to be “top” vehicle. Like merkava mk4 is worse then a 12.0 abrams. Spyder is a 12.0 spaa at best if we compare it to claws. We dont have a jet capable of competeing with ef’s, rafales and su-30. And our 13.0 heli is just a AH-60 without dircm, with half of range of ah-64e/mi-28nm.
2 Likes
Stop using HEAT-FS, and you can actually go through the front of the BMPT. Every nation has a round that can go through the BMPT frontally at BRs even lower than the BMPT can actually face.
Who are you bullshitting ? Yeah right 430 mm is enough to pen bmpt frontally while he can disable you in a second yk Even if your statement was true which isn’t but your argument is still invalid because this game is not mbt simulator there are other types of vehicles and his statement is in fact true gaijin addressed that issue only for the bmpt by giving it an ammo box so they know about it but they refuse to fix it for others
yeah cause most just explode after it happens
There’s a difference between ammo being internal and external and a remote turret also makes a difference
Especially on a rcws30
the bmpt for some reason doesn’t obey that law
And the only one that comes with an ammo box
Every nation has multiple TT vehicles at a lower BR with a round that can lfp the BMPT and go through the vertical armor above the UFP. I will attach German and American proof, but all the other nations can as well. Both of these vehicles are also 1.0+ below the BMPT.
Protection map isnt entirely accurate and the majority of the highlighted areas will not result in any meaningful damage when shot.
At the same time the ability to penetrate something in theory does not mean it is consistent nor reliable in matches - nor that penetrating an area will actually result in destroying or disabling anything.
3 Likes
The guy above me answered you even with top tier rounds those spots are inconsistent even the LFP
While ignoring the ammo box that only the bmpt gets which is the topic of this forum or the ammo going all the way inside the tank to it’s bottom but doesn’t connect for some reason when shot at
It gets an ammo box because it is a td, which i dont think is unreasonable
I know be glad you are alive at all after having your ammo hit, unlike most vehicles which just die
