One thing no one mentioned is that you can only face 4 vehicles at the top. Of the br bracket. So that means at for instance 6.7-7.7 only 4 are going to be 7.7. Since there are 4 vr brackets in the 1.0 br spread, there’s 3 br’s where there’s no limit to player number. And top br is limited to 4. So there’s a much higher chance you get put in the 3 lower brackets rather than the highest, not only because it’s 3/4. But also because the top br is limited to 4 people. Imagine at top tier air. If you bring out a 13.0, you’re gaurunteed 4 enemies at 14.0. However at 13.3, the entire enemy team can be 14.0. Of course you can be down tiered to 12.0 but only as 1 of 4 potential slots. What’s far more likely (ignoring current player numbers) is you get something like 12.3-13.3 or 12.7 to 13.7 which is mostly fair. And worst case, only 4 enemies are 14.0
Another problem is the human brain is wired to focus/remember the negative more than the positive. So even if you’re not fully uptiered, when you die to a guy 3 steps above (rather than 4) you still subconsciously attribute it to uptiering.
The system, mathematically, is actually pretty good. Having a full uptiered limited to 4 vehicles is good. But sometimes you get an extreme example where the entire enemy team is 14.0 and the entire friendly is 13.3, AFAIK that’s possible, and obviously unfair.
This all ignores the fact that more players play 10.3 ground, or 14.0 air. They’re popular right now. Playing near that area gets you pulled into those matches. This also doesn’t help when certain areas are horribly compressed. I think the best proposal is raise the br cap of air. The current 14.0 should not be fighting 13.0. Move them up to 14.7 or 15.0, spread the top br’s a little more. And same with ground. If top tier ground only had to worry about f16, f5, su27, su25, etc, it wouldn’t be so over run with Cas.
This means that the Cas monsters, su34, eft, rafale, f15e, are simply too strong for ground matches. Until we get stronger spaa.
Thanks for the reply. My understanding was that each tier had equal representation. For example 9.0 to 10.0 there would be an equal amount of 9.0, 9.3, 9.7 and 10.0. So if your explanation is accurate, what happened to me is even more crazy. Here is how I define tiering. In the example above the 9.0 is fully uptiered, 9.3 is partially uptiered, 9.7 is partially downtiered, and 10.0 is fully downtiered. It just is a way to label each possibility. I had 17 straight where I was fully uptiered. And I find that around 75% of the time I am fully uptiered overall regardless of country or br. In the example above it was all different countries and all different brs. I did this mostly because of the timeout for backing out of a match, but when it hit 17 in a row I realized I had inadvertantly created a somewhat random sample. Regardless of how the tiering is done, there has to be another factor we are not aware of. Maybe it is player level? 100 seemed pretty easy so it seems unlikely, but maybe that is why I see so many full uptiers. I tossed out some other ideas, but at this point all I know is that something is affecting the matchmaking pushing me to more full uptiers, and obviously someone else to downtiers. Knowing it isn’t random is all I am communicating. I mentioned above a very easy programming fix, where one factor is your previous 3 or 5 matches. If you were fullly uptiered for some number of matches in a row, it should not be possible to get another. My big question now is why is this system even necessary? If we have as many players as it seems, we should be able to narrow the spread, or maybe even eliminate it all together. This question brought in another possibility. Are all the players actually players? Are they tossing in bots to fill out a match, and having them always be downtiered to offset the fact the ai is not as good as a live player? Lots to think about I guess. In the end it isn’t the end of the world, I just found it annoying when the 17 in a row happened. So I have now decided to do a real study on this. I am going to run a random sample and will post results as well as how I setup the sample. Cheers.
That isn’t possible, and it is strange that you think that way. Obviously someone has to get the down while someone else gets to up. What I am saying is that it isn’t random, it cannot be with what happened. We probably will never know what the additional variable is.
I think it’s a full up/down tier plus the type of map combination.So get a map where you are forced to face the enemy head on and it can be a very good or very bad outcome for you.
Same as with he bushes that you speak off.Useful on some maps and a death sentence on others.Who wants bright green bushes in Berlin where everything is grey?
I found that playing the US server as Germany at 4-% BR I hardly had any uptiers or should I say I hardly saw any tanks much higher than I was.
That could be down to the fact that at 4.3 BR Germany has good vehicles capable of dealing with those of the enemy a tier above and maybe many nations can say the same.
The issue of tiers can be in those era where tech is advancing and some vehicle simply don’t have the tech that their enemies posses.For tanks it can be NV or rangefinders and for planes it’s missiles or jet vs Prop.
I think Warthunder just advanced beyond it’s own capabilities as far as game play goes. WW2 was just easier to replicate and implement.I’m still convinced some BRs and nation choices lend themselves to a more stable tier experience overall.
You suggested that gaijin was doing it. Or at least targeting you.
That is probably what is affecting it. If you leave a match before a certain time, it has a very high chance of giving you the same map. There is a timer that expects you to play on the map for a certain time. Probably does the same with tiering
They dont do this because it would be abused. People will just spawn reserve stuff and leave. After that 3-5 times, load up their real line up knowing they wont get an uptier.
They have bots. Mostly in naval. It is very easy to tell if they are a bot or not.
So it has happened twice more this week. Here is the progression. USSR 10.3, USA 9.3, Germany 7.7, China 5.0, Japan 5.7, GB 8.0, France 8.7, Sweden 8.0, Isreal 6.0, Italy 2.7. I ran through all of them and each one was a full uptier. The first time it took four more tries to get something other than a full uptier, so 15 in a row (I don’t start bailing out of full uptiers until I have played two in a row). The second time it took 12 tries, so 13 in a row. Add in the frustration of cheats and the game is becoming almost unplayable. Guessing most who try to deny these issues above only play top tier or run cheats so they don’t care. The frustration of outplaying guys only to get outtanked in an uptier is nonsense. And the few times it is a full downtier I feel guilty, like it isn’t real. They just simply need to stop the mixed tier nonsense and make the game more about skill. To be clear, I run zero cheats including bushes which I consider a cheat, I do not spawn camp because that is weak and for those desperate to compete. I ignore the rude driving, the shooting of teammates to give up their location, etc. And yes I acknowledge when someone outplays me fair and square, it happens plenty. In short I play the game with integrity the way I was raised. If everyone did they would never sell another set of bushes, the guys coding cheats would be broke, and the game would be way better. I have a dream!
Given that you lied about 17 in a row last time I’m going to assume you are lieing again.
This is just scummy, why make other players experience worse? And according to your conspiracy of getting uptiers how is leaving one going to prevent a full uptier the next game?
This not as clear cut as you may think, I personally have no issue with the current system although I do mostly play tanks that are fine in uptiers.
Another great take again. You would have to change the defintion of what a ‘cheat’ is for this to be the case.
Good for you but there will always be people who don’t think this way and do cheat. This is the case for any game not just this one.
I get that - I was referring to MatchMaker assignment… when you hit “BATTLE”.
However, even the 5.3 "assignment means a 6.3 top tank… so I guess I’m wrong there… still being uptiered, if only by .3. I suppose I have an issue with the code that always forces a full BR. If there are enough players in queue - why not have 5.3 → 6.0? Why force the 6.3 in there?
I guess my issue is with how often I get the FULL BR uptier. It’s way more than the 25% it is supposed to be.
Explain to me how I lied? I will record it next time seeing as you need proof, and I expect a full apology for slander. Curious, do you work for the company? Played long enough to be at top so uptiers make your battles always a downtier? Full mods on all your tanks at all tiers? Because a string of uptiers at 10.3 with only heat and no thermalswill surely change your opinion quickly. And as for cheats, weird question. Any purchased advantage is a cheat. You seem reasonably intelligent, so this shouldn’t be hard. I am reminded of the couple posts about top tier clans requiring their members to run cheats. Are you in a top tier clan? If you have information on your interface that I cannot get, you have aim assist or targeting software outside of the games coding, or you have a purchased advantage like bushes which are a huge advantage until thermals, then you are cheating. Hopefully that makes it clearer for you. Not sure why you would be combative, so help me understand. I would prefer not to make assumptions.
Actually this is not true. You looked many matches after I had posted. I do appreciate you looking up how to represent probability that takes serious commitment, but do you know what it means? How far back did your research go? 19 matches is a small sample. Any reason you stopped there? As with most who wish to exploit statistics I am guessing the 20th and several after were full uptiers and would have proved you wrong. Stopping at 19 is very strange behavior. Does it include matches I do not complete? Help me with where you got this information, and I will direct you there the next time I hit a run of full (1 full br) uptiers in a row.
This isn’t accurate. A full uptier is a 5.0 tank in a 6.0 match. From my understanding each match has four tiers, with approximately 25% of the players from each. That means 25% of the time is a full uptier, where you are the bottom. Easy to see based on starting spawn points, so you can know every match before it even starts. Three times in the last month I had more than 10 full uptiers in a row. I get no one wants to believe it, and most have no idea because they don’t know what tanks are what tiers, they just hump along. My hope is to cause enough of a stir to cause change by Gaijin. Probably a pipe dream because I am sure they have determined what action makes people open their wallets.