My brother have you seen average performance on those planes? You should check it.
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My bad I thought I was responding to him lol. I thought he said that
I’m on my phone hahaha ima delete because I don’t want it to take away from the pint you made
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Lmao, no worries brother mistakes can happens.
Wrong because there is no evidence to prove that J35XS could perform effectively at 13.0 because it performs effectively at 10.7. Again, your argument is exaggerated and you’re trying to make my argument seem unreasonable based on non sense exaggerations. Bumping j35xs from 10.7 to 13.0 is not anyhow realistic and j35xs performance at 13.0 is not anyhow related to S4 performance at 12.0 instead of 11.7. Again, i told you to scrap the Winrate based argument because i recognized it as unreliable. Either recognize this and argue against the current facts i have provided or stop talking, if you cant deny the facts i have provided
Understand that every single specific engagement can be “theoretical” at this depth therefore acting like its solely theoretical and that it doesn’t apply to this game is non sense.
Infact it does not matter wether something is theoretical or not as long as it can happen in the game and it is fact based and reasonable. You’re just trying to shut down my argument by saying “its theoretical so its irrelevant” even though this benefit exists in real batles. And because you can’t argue against the benefit, you would try to argue that i can’t specificy a realistic engagement which proves something because blah blah.
Thats new.
Except i dont see any facts from you but some empty claims buddy.
Further proof of ignorance because i stated this earlier. Read my arguments fully or do not reply to them at all.
I already mentioned facts about the superior maneuverability of the 530D against 7M, the forcekill capability of IRCCM of magic 2 and the fact that F-14 can’t match these forcekill capabilities.
These facts are based on stat card facts.
Are you gonna say that I can’t prove that it’s harder to evade a aim-9b compared to R-73 because the engagement situation would be “theoretical”? This is your argument. If within your argument we can’t prove a clear fact of something that is widely obvious and known, then your argument can’t be used because it doesn’t leave room to prove anything. Therefore, drop the arguement or make it viable for anyone to prove that a stronger missile is indeed stronger or your argument is invalid on basis of not being able to accept a fact.
İf thats the case then R27ER should be buffed even more considering my R27ER’s missed some of the most easy kills ever.
And how many times it does benefit, 20-30 or lets make it 40 if that whats gonna make you happy. As long as you talk based on theoritical scenarios without any hard evidence your claims will mean nothing thats why hard evidences are vital thing in counter arguments.
Except thats literally what im doing,lmao.
Yeah I think we sufficiently examined his reasoning. It’s not stupid, but it’s rooted his average low win rate and for some reason 68% is too high in his mind.
Therefore the jet must go up in BR and all other jets that resemble it that he has not flown.
He will not consider the fact that the S5 was perfectly fine at 11.7 prior and that the issue is over saturation of event S4. He is dead set on increasing both aircrafts BR. He will not consider that active radar missiles are coming and increasing the BR will put them at a great disadvantage. Nor once GJ moves adjust their BR they will leave it permanently potentially screwing up the French tech trees S5.
This is all due to his own belief that he is incapable of achieving a 68% winrate, therefore it must be the jets fault.
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Sure, alright. R-27ER is obviously better. Also “r27er missed some of the most easy kills ever” this is a flaw of every single air to air missile and because it is a bug based flaw and not a performance based flaw, its not open for argument. We don’t argue based on bug performance, if we did i could say that the aim-7m belongs to 10.0 because it often flies into ground.
So, the “missing easy kills” argument is invalid if it is not based on true performance of the missile that can be compared to another missile.
Tell me what you want as hard evidence that can reasonably prove this. Tell me exactly what you accept. It has to be consistent for missiles that have huge performance margin, and missiles that have small performance margin yet one being stronger than the other
Not in your earlier 20 different replies
İ just said thats new which indicates we agreed on something, you good my guy? Seems like you’re loosing your touch.
Except you’re the one who accepted that 5G will change nothing in practise, i love it when you debunk your own argument.
Except im the one who mentioned in the first place, are you trying to steal my pen arguments? Lmao.
F-14 will literally circle around you and kill you easily if he knows whats he’s doing, especially if its a F-14B, you have no idea what you’re talking about.
Except Aim-9B pulls only 10G while R73 pulls 40G with TVC capabilites and IRCCM its not the same situation if you compare to aim-7M vs 530D, gosh your counter arguments becomes more and more stupid.
My man you should let go of your ego sometimes and touch some grass while doin it, it will do wonderful for you.
I think im going to ignore you, ziggy because you refuse to take part in the debate in good faith and everything you are posting now is ignorant to the current debate.
I already argued against therefore i did indeed consider it.
You’re ignoring the fact that this is completely normal!
A 10.7 plane is in great disadvantange compared to a 11.7 plane
A 12.0 plane is in great disadvantange against a 13.0 plane
Your argument also ignores the fluidity of battle rating.
The mirage s2000 S4 would not be at great disadvantange at 12.0 against any possible platform that would carry active radar missile at 12.0, and the disadvantange is expected to grow when BR’s go higher. Therefore you can’t argue that it is something bad because this is exactly how battle ratings work. You are at disadvantange towards something of higher battle rating and pretending like its a bad thing is non sense stupid argument
Wise words.
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Just because it’s not as obvious does not mean that the difference does not exist
This is your exact ignorance, you’re minimizing the difference so that it means nothing even though it means something. In this case, the difference is between wether you can dodge a 7M by pulling max G and not being able to dodge a 530D by pulling max G, so even if it appears statistically small, its extremely relevant on the battelfeild.
F-14 can kill the mirage if it catches the mirage in a bad situation. The mirage can kill the F-14 if it catches the F-14 in a bad situation
Except the f-14 can force a bad situation on a F-14 because the F-14 physically can’t outrun a mirage 2000 while the F-14 can’t force such situation on mirage solely based on performance and it has to be more about mistake based.
Also, a bad situation for f-14 is ending within engagement envelope of magic 2 irccm quality while a bad situation for mirage would be having to run out of energy or something similar that can’t be forced with a smaller top speed.
The mirage has a slight advantange over the F-14 In being able to force a kill against other aircraft and against the F-14 itself which is why the mirages should be at 12.0.
If you can’t provide a reasonable request where i ask you to tell me how you want me to prove something that you’re asking for, then don’t argue. If you only talk about “ego” instead of providing the information i asked for (making it impossible for me to prove something), you might aswell not argue at all because that is not debate, it’s just name calling and ignorance.
Just like Aim-7M cause you cannot dodge that missile without proper notching and countermeasures.
Then 5G difference is also irrevelant because of the reasons i mentioned already.
You’re the one who’s gonna Show me the exact evidences that supports your claim, burden of proof is on you in this case.
You can dodge the aim-7m absolutely with raw power often at low altitudes so claiming otherwise is misinformation. I would not even need to prove this as a “fact” because this is a commonly known basic thing. However if i feel like it i can install my hdd in my pc and give you video footage.
It is not irrelevant at all becaus when you have to pull 10-11G’s to dodge an aim-7m and your airframe capability maxes around that, you can’t pull more required G’s to dodge the 530Dm making the 530D undodgable in those situations.
Tell me what kind of evidence you accept. Don’t tell me to produce evidence if you can’t specify what exactly is considered acceptable that can prove a smaller margin of performance difference.
11G
R-73 pulls 40G without TVC, in-game it is underperforming as in real life it pulls up to 60G during motor operation thanks to TVC and then drops to 40G post-burn (as long as there is sufficient airspeed / energy).
A growing populous has already done this
I’m not sure what is being argued as I am hopping into the middle of it. What we know is that the Super 530D is likely underperforming as since it is tail controlled there is a high likelihood that it maneuvers in combined plane. We know the Magic 2 was modified from the Magic 1 to do so, there is no reason not to believe the Super 530D was still maneuvering in single plane when the French had mastered better guidance methods already at the time.
I don’t think I’ve had issues dodging AIM-7M unless I put myself in a position where it is undodgeable, such as going head-on above 100m alt towards a target at closer ranges… which is dumb.
I agree
The Super 530D is superior as far as kinematics in closer ranges go, chaff is required to dodge it without multi-pathing… but that makes all radar missiles kinda poo rn.
@Panther2995 I’m not sure there is anything to discuss here, you two are going back and forth no better than someone wasting their time arguing with Ziggy at the moment. Seems to me neither of you will admit fault here or change your minds.
Except there is huge difference between 30G and 5G in this case and no 5G will practically make no difference if you pass 18G tresshold.
Except F-14 can basically force your hands with Aim-54’s and Aim-7M while you have to notch therefore you flight performance will become irrevelant in that case.
Except in order use benefits of Magic-2’s irccm capabilites you have to sit back on F-14’s ass otherwise he can basically flare it not to mention F-14 can force Mirage on many situations while Mirage has to rely on its initial turning capabilites.
Mirage has one advantage against F-14B while F-14B has multiple ones so its clear how this is gonna end.
İ already answered to this question so im not gonna waste my time again.
530D is considerably harder to dodge than 7M, especially in low to medium altitude situations.
I don’t think an F-14 has ever forced anyones’ hands with those weapons unless they were flying in space for some unknown reasons
Easily done in just a few turns
The F-14 isn’t the person forcing anything in fights against a M2K.
You’re welcome to elaborate on how this would play out. I already know, and it seems you don’t.
I agree, that isn’t obvious to some people?