Because it actually sees 12.0 and bullies them with Fox-3 missiles, have you ever considered that?
Against any competetent JAS39A and Mig-29G pilot J8F becomes dead meat, you know this pretty Well but you like to ignore it cause it doesnt fit in your ego.
Couldnt care less about your news dude.
But i highly suggest try to be less arrogant next time and instead explain your opinion properly, if you can ofc.
Dogfighting isn’t everything. Su-27 climbs a lot faster than the MiG-23. The one thing the MIG-23 would be very good at is high altitude speed, problem is it takes too long to reach 10000m.
MiG-23 also doesn’t turn well enough at high speed to quickly notch (well it can but with wing closed it bleeds to much speed). It’s just much harder to perform in it compared to other aircraft.
Yeah but J8F is useless in up tiers, it kinda proves the point that against 4 (almost 4.5) gen fighters the MiG-23 would struggle a lot.
Side note: looking at the engine manual from the other thread I think most people (me included), where taking far too much fuel on the flanker. At 600kph 13 min on the flanker is equal to a whopping 21min on the F-16C, and with those fuel loads the fight is very much viable.
So what you’re saying is we should take less fuel and be conservative from the start?
While it would defeat the point of the aircraft a bit (just like with the MiG-21bison), the 23-98 could do fine at 12.7 with 2 R-27ER and 2 R-73
That would be actually nice but there are still some apex predators at 13.0 that will hunt 23-98 easily.
Im not against it but i suspect its gonna struggle a lot.
Yep, and with less I mean MUCH less fuel. I’m taking 17 mins right now (used to take 28) and use 106% throttle at start (110% if I climb at altitude to do BVR (at altitude fuel consumption is very low). The low fuel time number might feel uncomfortable but I’ve yet to run out.
I will try this tactic to see if it makes any difference, as for endurance map how much fuel do you advise?
That’s happening to all 12.7s thought. I don’t think an R-73 armed MiG-23 with a far better radar than the N019 (while also having 2 R-27ER) is much weaker than a MiG-29 with R-60s.
Endurance map about 22min. Conversion is basically F-16C fuel time x 0.6. Maybe a bit less (like 0.65 or 0.7 if one stays a lot at high speed)
Yea its not that much but 12.7 is still a place where airframe performance matters a lot.
In BVR 23-98 should be better due to its avionics but Mig-29 can surprass that with its flight performance.
If it comes to 12.7 with ER’s only then it could be good option but if it comes with R-77 then, meh.
Ok, thanks for the information.
My J-8F stats generally predate the fox-3s
I don’t think that is the case, I can casually accelerate away from either at altitude or keep distance and launch PL-12’s. If it doesn’t perform as well it will surely be reduced in BR in the future and that’s the whole thing.
If the MLD doesn’t perform well, it will be reduced. Look at the Harriers carrying AIM-9M and AMRAAM at 12.7…
So your argument if you don’t mind me quoting you;
You are asking if we learned anything? I don’t know what you’re talking about because unless they are up for a BR reduction - there is nothing to your claim. If it isn’t for you, it isn’t for you. Why are you even commenting here?
Words of wisdom, very ironic coming from you.
I was gonna say your argument doesn’t have a leg to stand on and even if it did, you fell off the table the moment you responded by insulting the person critiquing your stance.
I just fly low and launch R-24R’s at people, it’s hilarious. Smoked 4 or 5 4th gens the other day in it first match out and then went to work. That was with R-60Ms.
Ask @Gunjob how he feels about the Tornado, I’m kind of curious what other people think about this topic who fly these “underperforming against peers” airframes. Previously he had no issues using the Tornado without fox-3s against fourth gens. iirc the claim was that he went 50/50 against them on average in dogfights. Maybe I’m wrong about that but it was some time ago.
It couldn’t mount the R-27ER I think, and the R-77 was never able to be fired from the 98-1 radar. The 98-2 radar upgrade was never commissioned due to lack of orders and therefore the plane would need to mount something like Kopyo under fuselage to mount the R-77.
If Gaijin is liberal with their implementation you have three possibilities;
98-1 with R-27R/T and R-73 w/ HMS
98-2 with upgraded radar, R-77 & R-73, HMS
Realistic 98-2 with belly mounted radar & R-77, HMS
Well at 12,7 it would still be the 5th best airframe around. F-16, MiG-29 and M2K are better, F-14B is about equal/slightly better. After that the MLD absolutely murders F-14As, Phantoms, Viggens, J8s etc.
Those alleged apex predators are generally flown by your average war thunder pilot and some cases also crash on takeoff. (Nearly every other match). I’m scared.
Press X to doubt.
Shame if you could only do the same, guess having giant ego prevents you to do that.
I could go on but i noticed you’re not worth of my time anymore, if you can dig up your head from sand and decide to be more humble then let me know, until then dont bother me with your empty claims please.
Then lets just hope it will come with Fox-1’s only.
So you have no rebuttal, cheers
Ur welcome, I’m still doing testing to find conversions for multiple speed ranges (like mach 0.2-0.6, 0.7-1, 1.2+). I think I will do this for a couple of aircraft to find fuels also to compare turn times/accelertion etc.
For once in your life stop bein such a walking ego and end the conversation without saying the last word, but it seems you’re also incapable of doing that.
Oh cmon, we already have MiG-21 Bison, might as well get updated MiG-23