Low Tier HEAT discussion - is this fair?

Machinery of War Discussion Ground Vehicle
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M50 and M56 are basically the same vehicle at the same BR, so what happens is that the American mains have at least 2 spawns of the same OP vehicle that can basically pen anything at any range with their HEAT shells.

These vehicles are at 6.7 for no reason, America has no reason to have 2 copy-pasted vehicles at the very same BR and at such a low rating.

Now let me tell you my experience as a german main and I’m more than happy to hear your experience against these vehicles too.

I spawn my Tiger 2, go in a sniping position and all of a sudden I get shot out of nowhere right through my turret face and get instantly killed by one of those vehicles.
So, the heaviest tank of WW2 has just been completely outplayed by a prototype vehicle that basically has never seen combat or anything.

“YeAH buT tHiS is a gamE”, a very “fair” game indeed.

Now, you might say “well but germany has a rat tank too, the Raketen!”, it does indeed and its basically the same as M56, but here’s the punchline…Raketen is at 8.0

So here’s what happens, a portion of German mains would say “Then Raketen needs to be undertiered!!!”, but here’s the problem with that, this will ONLY encourage more cold war HEAT spam at low tier while most people hate it.

This is the only solution that would make it fair once and for all:

Every vehicle that has HEAT with more than 200mm of pen for a nation that doesn’t even require it, needs to be tiered to 8.0 or higher based on how they perform, so a vehicle like M56 that can spam it’s shells that have 320mm of pen (it can basically pen everything) needs to be at the very least 8.0

Heavy vehicles get punished the most by these light tanks with high pen HEAT. Vehicles like Maus that are supposed to be totally unkillable have to face this sickness that gimps them and makes them totally unplayable, same goes for any other vehicle that faces off against this type of modern shells.

America has no need for TWO heat spammers at that BR.

~Conclusion: HEAT at low tier completely negates what a heavy tank means, your armor is completely irrelevant for the most part, because people whined about not being able to instantly kill a Tiger 2, Maus etc in one hit with their 20 ton tank. Heavy tanks need to be heavy tanks and light tanks need to be light tanks.

You shouldn’t be capable of facing off heavies as a light tank for the most part, you should be obligated to use your speed and just flank them and heavies should be obligated to hold the first lines or snipe, but the game right now is only about who has the fastest rat tanks with the most high penetrating shell, which I think its highly unfair.

This needs to get fixed.

Should low tier vehicles with High-Pen HEAT shells be uptiered to 8.0+ (if not explain why)?
  • Yes
  • No
0 voters
Do you think its genuinely fair for WW2 vehicles to face off against High-pen HEAT? (explain why if yes)
  • Yes
  • No
0 voters
Do you think Heavy Tanks are being affected by the HEAT spam? (if not, why)
  • Yes
  • No
0 voters
Did you even read my whole post before commenting?
  • Yes
  • No
0 voters
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Welcome back everyone to yet another heavy tank cope post where they are dumbfounded that the weapons which made the heavy tank an obsolete concept IRL also heavily affect them in WT.

The solution is simple, stop relying on your armour as a crutch to save you and actually learn to play the game. Move slowly and look around you rather than just holding W and none of these vehicles will ever be a problem for you again. They may be able to pen you pretty much everywhere, but a quick spray with your machinegun will kill them before they can even react to it.

“b-b-but muh mobility is bad cuz muh armour!!!” HEAT-slingers aren’t the only vehicles at these BRs, and a lot of them can struggle with you if you actually learn to position yourself in a good spot on the map. Only around a fifth of the vehicles that you face has HEAT, and all of them are heavily countered by situational awareness. Did you know that you have binoculars that you can use by pressing B, and using your mouse isn’t only for moving your turret on top of a vehicle right in front of you? Have you tried taking a good look at the different positions an enemy could be in before deciding to move into a different position?

You struggling with these vehicles so bad that you need to go on the forum and write a cope post about it only proves the skill issue you are suffering from.

9 Likes
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Why don’t we just send the maus to 3.7 whilst we’re at it?

HEAT at low BRs has terrible post pen damage, even if the penetration is good. Arguably, never gets much better post pen damage.

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That’s it folk, it’s time to nerf the charioteer!

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And also the challenger. Too OP, it can pen tigers!

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Hell, we must also nerf the comet. Up-BR that menace!

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The nerf for charioteer:
Charioteer now needs commander to get out to confirm hits on account of the gun producing too much smoke.

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3.0 lineup say bye bye to pz III N, 8.0 lineup say hello to ww2 heat slinger

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Man why is it always, always and pretty much only the German mains who make these things? Its weird how you dont really see this from UK players, or US players, or Russian players, or French… Italian… Japanese…

Now on the meat of it, you are trying to compare the Rakenten to the M56, you need to get yourself a bucket of cold water and dunk your head in it because you are stuck in an angry vision against the M56 because as a German main, you fight it, meanwhile, as a German main, you do not fight the raketen, which is a really, really good vehicle.

8.0 or higher… So ratels to 8.0? My dude you need to get out of your bubble a bit.

“heavy vehicles get punished” yes, they get punished when used wrong/ineffectively or simply, when a light vehicle is successful in using its abilities. Noticed you completely forgot about the Ru 251 lol.

“just flank bro” for lights is not exactly possible given the types of maps gaijin maps a lot of the time as a fyi, also, most of the time they do flank, because if they are not, you will be looking right at them in your tiger 2, while they are still having a wobbling gun…

Germany heavies are pretty damn good tanks, especially tigers etc, I just have no real interest in Germany, but whenever I have used them I dream of similar in other TTs with those guns and armour profiles (especially back before the solid shot buffs happened). The main issue however is I hate playing with them on my team, want to know why? Because German heavy tank players DONT KNOW HOW THE GAME WORKS. A large number of them see “tiger tank best tank” and dont angle, and constantly try to argue you shouldnt need to angle your tiger 1/2, etc. You are not suffering because light tank OP, you are suffering because teamwork is terrible in German teams. German players dont know how to play their tank and thus, dont know how to act as a team, thus, get screwed over by vehicles/players that are specifically playing extremely fragile vehicles meaning they neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed to work together and play to strengths of a map, not just “camp the back field” like so many German players do in their heavies.

It isnt a HEAT-FS issue, its a skill issue, I have been upteiring my M44 a fair bit and dunking like hell on Tiger 1/2s, is it because the M44 should be 8.0 too?

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The classic “skill issue” comment, ok sir

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Ohhh, so a vehicle designed to rely on its armor, its being used INEFFECTIVELY if you rely on its armor, makes sense makes sense 100%%

The artificially overpowering of a light vehicle by giving it 300mm+ of pen is totally fair ok dude and apparently light tanks are being used correctly by frontal plating every heavy possible right? ok dude im gonna take ur argument as it is!

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I spawn my Tiger 2, go in a sniping position and all of a sudden I get shot out of nowhere right through my turret face and get instantly killed by one of those vehicles.

If someone sees you, you see them too. So yes skill issue

If you engage in a sniper position without using your binoculars before necessarily putting yourself in the open.
Gathering information is more than essential, especially in heavy tanks

1 Like
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No, we are suffering because we have only a decent line up with the tiger 1 and 2, for which we are punished to hell after 7.0, take Maus as an example and many other vehicles that are purposefully overtiered just to create artificial lineups, they deleted our prototype vehicles and failed to add anything in that space, so now people have to play with tiger 2 up until Leopard 1

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Yeah I will totally see the rat vehicle at 2kms away hiding in a bush and camping while also he can point and click me, ok dude ok

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Use your binoculars, learn the spots on the maps actually.

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just play the leKpz m41 with heat fs and do the same how is it so hard?

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NO VEHICLE is designed to rely on your armour. Armour only exists to save you when you make a mistake, not to drive into enemy fire and distract them. You know nothing about anything you’re talking about lmao.

5 Likes
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HEAT is just unreliable, M-51 has no issue going through anything but you roll a dice on post-pen damage and they does different thing every time, all the HEAT slinger in that br, M-51, ELC-Bis and the two you mentioned, all of them don’t have armor, all getting one tab by the USSR 85mm and Tiger 1 just delete them out fo existence, and the M56 can be killed by AK-47

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Yh dude totally, its always the player’s fault and the game is perfectly balanced, we understand ur arguments

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You do realise positioning is also a key point of use of a vehicle, right? Also gun? Using your ears to hear enemy engines?

Light tanks are not artificially overpowered, theres a reason why light armour and armoured cars were produced in overwhelming numbers during and after the war by certain countries and really pretty much all nations looking for ways to upgun light vehicles. If you think the few we have now are OP, you should see the absolute madlad technology that gaijin still has not yet added. (if you want an example, look up the humber hornet)

Its weird how as a brit/french tank player, who faces those vehicles all the time, I dont really get bothered lol.

Also, I recommend the tactical onion.

Also also, your view on the M44 dunking on Tiger 1s and 2s?

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Irrelevant, Heavy tanks should hide away because some vehicle that never existed can cripple them with 1 frontal hit and then finish with the second hit, this is in no way the most realistic game ever (its claimed to be) and its not fair, adding fuel to the fire doesnt solve anything

these vehicles were added because america whined about the very tiger 2s and Maus, so Gaijin gave them an extremely unneeded type of vehicle while the german TT has been bleeding out since they removed the “fake vehicles”, fake or not they had their place and stood their ground and in their place they added the useless M109 and the cheap M41 that nobody likes to play with for very good reasons

So the game is not being fair at all no matter what you might make up, Israel needed the Super Sherman because they wouldnt be able to compete AT ALL if they didnt have it, while I never even been killed by it, so its not a concern at all, but M50s and M56s have full authority to just troll every possible heavy tank from all nations…

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Yes, so everyone has the same opinion but inevitably it’s us who are wrong.
Yes, everything is not perfectly balanced in the game, have you just arrived?
Some vehicles over time suffer from their BR. However, it’s bad form to say that people can see you and you can’t.
Use what the game gives you