Borderline the same tank. 2A7 has better round/thermals/acceleration, while 122 has slightly better armor and higher top speed. I group them together.
My replies here were almost all made before the leak list. After this, Germany does need some help due to the new influx of more CAS.
sure…
Gajins own armor table differences are quite big at some points
yes, but gets irrelevant, their round is good enough that it nearly performs the same, its edge cases
strv122 has comamnder thermal 2, between 2-3 is way less difference compared to 1.
It performs good enough here as well
2a7V is heavier then strv122 and somehow worse armored, gajin logic, taking values from a 30year old swedish study
i did not look at any. i replied purely at the ones u made 5h ago and continued to speak like germany doesnt deserve vehicles
And none of this makes a difference against the rounds you face, unless maybe a 292 which you click on anyway.
From my experience, far from it, DM53 feels far better to play
Strv 122 has Gen 1 for gunner, and a towel blocking the commander sight so its useless.
Swedes used a composite that weighed less, that was the explanation for that.
To clarify, they should not get a 2A8. Something like a 2A7A1 with less armor is fine.
so sweden dominating with uparmored leos is okay got it.
that was fixed some time ago already apparantly
sure 30y old composite, we are developing backwards. when the swedish choices still are german developed
IRL? As a Mk.4 crew member, yes. In WT? Oh, hell naw! WT has roughly 40% of the real armor values that are unclassified for the basic Mk.4.
They aren’t exactly dominating rn. Sweden WR is in the dump right now because they lack CAS and SPAA, which is the top tier meta.
[quote=“dotSHINI, post:147, topic:287169”]
that was fixed some time ago already apparantly
the camera was placed to low, which resulted in it being in the way, the camera was elevated which fixed it
so is germany lol? what are u talking about, we dont have CAS and our spaa got nerfed to the ground last patch with 4km IR range.
Germany is in just as bad of a position
Ah yeah, you are right. However, you are still spending most of your time in the gunner sight as commander sights are not exactly ideal.
I never said Germany was dominating (unless they pair w/ Russia). Sweden’s SPAA/CAS was already in the ground.
so germany is not dominating, they are quite bad overall everything considered right now
Since CAS is always king.
Where is the problem with more uparmored leos, when german line up is bad either way as well?
Pairing with other nations does not matter at all, sweden can pair with russia just as much
You are denying uparmored Leos, without reason and then everything you name ends up being an argument to add more uparmored leos to germany
Because they don’t need it. Sweden shouldn’t have 3 122s. What Germany actually needs is CAS and good support vehicles, as well as a buff to the IRIS-T possibly. The 2A7A1 would be fine. 2A8, no.
explain. why should they not? adding surviveablity to the mbts against CAS is actual kind of support that matters against CAS
the Difference is 1 plate, the Beak add on, you dont make sense. it only matters in a frontal confrontation.
Whats your obsession with denying that
The 2a8 literaly makes no difference in mbt vs mbt fights, besides lws maybe
You seriously only sound like u hate germany and dont want them to get equal to sweden
The strongest MBT in the game shouldn’t be immune to most CAS.
Which is a big factor in what makes the 2A7’s armor as strong as it is.
The 2A8 has better armor, rumored to have a better engine, and ofc the APS/LWS that makes it nigh immune to CAS.
No actually, I do enjoy playing Germany, often moreso than Sweden because they have a functioning SPAA.
not how it works lol and still not the strongest mbt either.
Over saturating is easily done.
There is 2 APS systems with a reload, any CAS still can easily kill it if they fire 3 of anything
2 being enough most of the time since degrees is restricted, 1 for each side
no sources, gajins gonna ignore it
not fitted yet, official statements stay 1500hp
You have no actual clue on the vehicles or how they work and deny them
You are being a child over 1 beak armor module, which most of the time doesnt make the difference,
hell the turret ring is so big just shoot it and you kill a leo either way
which is scrwed now as well
SLS still works great, its just a short range missle
It is. Everyone says it is.
Depends, considering they might overlap zones and end up doing nothing. Then there’s the fact that 2A7 doesn’t like to die to most ATGMs except HE/SAPHE.
We don’t know that for sure.
“Rumored”
It makes a huge difference. Most whiffs on the 2A7s armor are because of this add-on beak armor. Also Leo turret ring is small, I don’t know why you’re bringing that up.
IRIS-T is decent. The Elde is pure useless garbage.
strv122
once again,
overlap is fron and behind thats it
Which is most either way,
Tandem doesnt work either right now
2a7V armor is quoted to have a hull armor the same lvl of its turret armor
by a source that is accepted for everything else.
For armor they want / need values.
So yes gets ignored
so irrelevant, thank you for proving me right
its literaly floating most of the time
was fixed quite good, but literaly front and its an easy kill
not to mention shoot at the drivers optic and you take out everyone behind him
the frontal armor plate is not relevant,
its a skill issue if you dont take out a leo cause of laziness of not wanting to learn its weak spot
its an spaa, it doesnt need to do much besides shooting
Didnt reply to you, but i see the confusion sorry, meant to reply to the main post
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Which also affected the Abrams, I’ll agree its certainly arguably not the best anymore, just among them. But as far as i know no new darts have been added that counteract its armour better, unless some bug fix was implemented that ruined the volumetric on it idk.
Not really hating, just wondering why they were making leopards out to be some of the worst tanks in the game, dont believe I used hostile language anywhere in my comment (if I did I apologise), nor did i directly state germany shouldnt get more leopards, personally I’d love to see more. As for germany not being the best leo nation i can agree to that.
sorry, i am just annoyed by people like magic denying things for germany for the sake of it.
Many of the things you named are just problems that come from non knowledge.
if you put it at expert yes, but the majority does not have that, making it standardly in the higher reloads
nerf of the backside handling makes it a sitting frog if someone gets behind you
abrams and leo still are the only ones with the unrealistic turret basket.
it completly enables the leo and you are a sitting duck if it gets damaged.
can still be easily penetrated.
thats the strv122 more then anything. just shoot the driver optics and you kill the complete leo crew
spall liners dont realy do much either anymore
Generaly the Loe model is broken and unreliable
There is reasons gajin did acknowledge that and promise new DM, but ignored it after cause they dont care
Fair enough, you just came a little strongly off lol
tbf its been a few weeks since I played ground so may have missed some things
Although i disagree with practice of the ace crew standard being the metric for reloads, you do have to account for the max and minimum potential of the vehicle, which the leo is not horrible in. I think the biggest issue people have now is that it was indirectly nerfed when T80s got their desired reload of 6.0 seconds.
I also thought the turret basket was a questionable decision to add, but the Leo2A7 especially was dominating ground, the turret basket helped the problem by having you shots actually do something to the leo if your round fell victim to post pen volumetric or spall liners absorbing abhorrent amounts of your spall. Generally speaking i think all tanks should have this modeled by now, but either incompetance or ignorance has gaijin hesitating.
Honestly yes it can but is the hardest most inconsistent breech to pen, one of two breeches that you can shoot and typically not kill and crew, and no real other turret weakspots. The only one that can really challenge it is T80s and T90 due to relict having wonky hitboxes that regularly catch your round due to server or client side ping misplacing your shot.
Not really, 2A7 also has goofy composite that is like a barcode of pen and non pen values. and LFP doesnt do much unless the leo has more than 16 rounds. As for the drivers hatch thats also not terribly easy to hit whilst trying to not hit composite or other volumetric shapes that demolecularize your dart.
All in all Germany can defninetly stand to get some better and newer MBTs, i wouldnt deny them that, and Gaiijin could’ve only applied the turret basket to the 2A7 and 122s to spare the 2A5 and 6, but i quite frankly believe the C2, Merkavas, Arietes, and even arguably abrams have it worse than the Leo2A7 and 122s