Leopard 1 is way too weak at 8.0

Leopard 1 tanks are just too vulnerable to autocannon vehicles. There are so many of them which sport 80++ pen and maps are all rather small cqc’s. Thats imho what makes it a bad tank. One Falcon sliding around the corner can gun down a whole company of Leopard 1’s in 3-4 seconds. You don’t even have a stabilzer, you’re brrrp’ed before you brake to make a shot. It just can’t be fixed. The game setting is not made to support these tanks.

Brrrp brrpp brrrp.

Also…ZSU-57 the bane of Leopard 1 teams.

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Yeah, with no stabilizer it deserves to be at 7.7 but if you think about it the latter T-54 variants sit at 8.0 BUT they have some Armor and can survive hits. Idk I’m torn about it, it has good ammunition and it’s very easy to play at range but in CQB it’s kind of painful.

1A5 can’t face those, as those are above 10.3.

My mobility claim was about Leopard I, while A1A1 and 1A5 have decent mobility but that’s about it.

Leopard I should never be lower than T-54s.

T-54’s are better suited for all those cqc map we’ve got ingame. Leopard doesn’t suit them.

Worse mobility, reload speed, gun handling and no neutral steering. I don’t see how T-54s are better suited to CQC ?

Armor. The T-54s have pretty trolly armor, even against APDS. I prefer them to my centurion in cqc simply because of this - It forces enemies to take time to aim/has their shots bounce.

Its especially effective against stuff like the Strv 81, since they have to aim even with their apds.

Do they though, never experienced this myself ?
APDS slice right through them just like it does with most 8.0s.

Good thing they have full stabilization and will easily get precise shots on target, every time.

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Could just be my AB experience, armor plays a bigger role there. In RB I dunno, ill yield to anyone that plays em there.

dies in 20pdr I fucking hate that gun kill it now why is it so shit

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Perhaps the T-54s are too high as well.

84mm will OHK less frequently so you’ll have to aim for the gunner, which is where stabilization help.

Most of the time it just nonpens or turns em yellow for me, and the full AP isnt much better. Cant nail em through the front plate either, which is unfortunate.

The 105 on the other hand… that one is wonderful.

In my opinion, T-54s are worse than Leopard I, but decreasing the BR of many 8.0s might create chaos under them. I think some decompression is needed here, unstabilized tanks fighting against fully stabilized ones with LRF/darts on a regular basis doesn’t really seem good to me.

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Sweet, so we’re back to compression being the major cause.

All roads lead to an insufficient BR cap, I guess.

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Yeah that’s pretty much my opinion. BR decompression could solve most issues regarding vehicles being OP/bad.

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Yep. Still amazed Gaijin still haven’t gone all the way up to BR 13.3 like air does. They could easily use that additional space to decompress mid-ranks.

The worse part is if you’re a ground only player even if you get to the top of the tree you’re still getting uptiered thanks to ground & air players bringing these higher tier aircraft into GRB.

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Cant have a Leopard facing 6.7s, madness

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Just one question. Why not??? i mean where is the main problem with a possbile return of the leo 1 to 7.7???

Because it dominated at that BR, The Leopard 1 has good mobility, great optics and good reliable fire power.
T-54 is 8.0
M60 8.0
Cent Mk10 - 8.0
AMX-30 - 8.0

Excluding the Cent which is stabilised but slow as hell. The Leopard is better than the rest.

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Better in what sense?

All of them are generally more mobile than lower BR tanks while having significantly better armor protection.

The Leopard is like a M18. A tank destroyer with high mobility, to ambush other tanks.

However it is far too vulnerable to be played aggressively, since literally any vehicle can take it out when it gets jumped.

10x Zoom doesn’t mean anything when 90% of maps make you fight below 500m.

A Tiger II or Ferdiand is great at long range becaue the have good RoF and high velocity APHE firing guns. But they can also rely on armor at closer range, even when they become more vulnerable.

The Leopard doesn’t have any more firepower than the other 8.0s and the better mobility comes at the cost of any meaningful armor.

In uptiers it struggles the same as any other 8.0 and in downtiers the only advantage is mobility, which isn’t even that significant.

I’m not for lowering the Leopard but it needs RoF buff to be viable in its role.
Most L7 tanks should have a 5s reload, like the Vickers MBT, but the Leopard is the prime candidate for that.

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