J7w1

(I were just checking after 3 months break if they perhaps fixed “real” shatter, and no way they did, wow, applause)

While that, I stumbled upon this topic by accident, it was just displaying on this new “great” forum in hot or something section so i clicked.

Only to discover pointless discussion about same topics that were discussed years ago. Proven, and if memory serves, they were passed to developers.

They sure were.

I’m honestly surprised that i still care enough to write anything about it, i gave up no fixing the game long time ago.
Found many bugs, reported none, some of them work against user and some are clear exploits.
Why should we care?

It took them 7 months to fix 20mm gun pods bug that could lead to your wing exploding if invisible gun pod got destroyed.

And here we expect them to fix plane 3D model, flight model, then engine?

Just give up.

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The old forum can still be accessed.

https://old-forum.warthunder.com/

They will be deleted after 2 years, so if anything they should be used now rather than later.

Remember guys…

The Engine peak altitude at military power is at 8400m.
The stated top speed is at 8700m

This means that 750km/h at 8700m is achieved at military power just like japanese state military power top speed for all their other planes.

WEP optimal altitude will be lower than that of military power meaning the top speed at WEP would be at lower altitude, not at 8700m.

So as was stated before
593km/h at sea level should be achieved at 100% power, not 593km/h with WEP.
The plane should be a lot faster.

1730hp at SL at Military power should give 593km/h at sea level
WEP gives 2130hp at sea level.

2130 / 1730 = 1.2312
1.2312 Cube Rooted = 1.0718

593 x 1.0718 = 635.6km/h

So at WEP, fixed J7W1 should be doing 636km/h, not 593km/h

Ki-84 speed was calculated by the americans the same way
http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/japan/Ki-84-156A.pdf

1765hp at SL at 100%
1970hp at SL at WEP
Ki-84 is listed as 350mph at SL at 100%
1970 / 1765 = 1.11615
1.11615 cube rooted = 1.03731
350mph x 1.03731 = 363
Ki-84 does 363mph at SL at WEP

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Im not even employed.
Is a volunteer work.
What I say is what I think and know.
You can belive whatever you want but it is what it is.

Claiming things without a single proof is not useful at all.

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So you think that 8400m is 100% crit alt with full ram?
This would mean a big nerf for j7w1 high alt performance.

Right now the airplane is configured as 8400m being the 0 ram 100% crit alt.

It is that small detail what changes everything.
If any proof is found to specify ram then it can be reported.

Well RAM effect allows it the top speed at 8700m, instead of the crit altitude of 8400m.

Plus what i suggesting is the J7W1 will do 750km/h at 8700m at 100% without using WEP at all (Huge Buff)
and 636km/h at SL instead of 593km/h with WEP (again, huge buff)

300m of ram effect for 750kph at 8700m is not logical

Well those were japanese estimates, maybe 8400m was peak with ram effect already

This was one of the many, but they truly got either hidden or removed

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warthunder/comments/dbttqf/please_fix_the_current_j7w1/ (One of the newer reports that was made in past)

Kyushu J7W1 Shinden Interceptor Fighter | Old Machine Press (Article that mentions the engine and slats and flaps systems)

J7W1 Shinden | Aircraft of World War II - WW2Aircraft.net Forums (Mentions of slats on canard wing)

Kyushu J7W1 Shinden/J7W2 Shinden-kai | Page 2 | Secret Projects Forum (Lots of pictures and data, mentions of double flaps and slats)

4 places were existence of slats or double flaps were mentioned and proven with citation to sources or by pictures/blueprints

Link 2 (year 2020) and 4 (2012) Mention same parameters, meaning they have same source

Link 2 is very convenient as it given quite the source material to back it’s claims

I could not found the old stuff tho, i’m afraid that forum got removed (i’m not talking about wt forum)
sigh, there were some good stuff there, but nothing lasts forever, true shame, all pictures and data down to drain.

And yet still, where are those flaps and slats? Nowhere.

With engine power curve it’s actually harder to prove, but flaps and slats? We have picture of real thing on which we can see loosen slat minimally falling out of canard wing.

That, and all that documentation and evidence with citations from books ranging from 1980 to 2010 and yet they somehow made it without either flaps or slats, and then they persistently avoid addressing this issue.

God da*n it, i always get angry even thinking about it, how tha fug can you get something this wrong with this much data all around? With N1K2 Shiden Kai it is more understandable as obtaining data was very hard (from what i dig out it had better, later version of engine, and bigger propeller, hence, i’m guessing, later version of engine increased it power enough that older, smaller propeller got inefficient)

But i f*cked up big time, as i did not saved any evidence of that and then when they magically reached me after 4 or more months i could not even use my search history to try to dig it up again.

Therefore we are stuck with fictional N1K2 J and Ja copy paste as they did not had same engine power and neither same size of propeller but yeah… I guess i did not thought about saving data on that one as i kinda assumed they wont give a f about it anyways, and well, even if i would give them data, they would apply stamp “acknowledged & passed to developers for consideration” as they did with J7W only to nothing ever to be fixed

And let’s be real, evidence on N1K2 was much weaker and more uncertain than solid data of plane like J7W1 that is still not fixed so like, yeah.

Also did you knew Ki-44 had bulletproof glass? 40mm if i recall, so yeah, but it’s pointless to look after this feature in game, its absent.

Same as Hs-129 had bulletproof side glass, cockpit armor of different thickness than it is in game and different armament + ammo loads.

When they fixed and added Ki-61 armor i nearly dropped from my chair from disbelief, like, now way man… they fix stuff?? (To this day i do not know what kind of royal treatment Ki-61 got to be fixed and what caused it)

Ta152C3 has bugged 3D model of engine block.

Do335 A series has incorrect drag model (worse flight performance than those of Ta154 despite being equal in power to weight ratio, but i honestly forgot the details so i do not remember any more what was what)

Ho-5 cannons and their lack of bullets

Ki-84 wrong G thresholds

And many more, but, since i can not provide wikipedia of citation or sources to those (or rather i’m not willing) those things will remain “fictional”

I would not mind seeing prototypes of vehicles in game to be honest, war thunder is as historically accurate as new battlefields with black women in “SS” with drum magazine Mp40 with reflective sight.

And when it comes to new stuff, at least there is hope they will get it right.
Old stuff? Nobody cares.

4 Likes

Here’s a funny fact for you:

I made that reddit post with an old, now deleted account.

1 existed, flew, and was built. The other has a chassis and a wooden mockup turret.

It isn’t a fighter, it is an interceptor meant to engage Bombers at high altitudes that is what it was designed for doing. At the altitudes bombers such as the B-29’s would have been at fighters would at this point have a lot of trouble really engaging It up here. Although in-game its issue is mainly fighting jet based aircrafts.

Sigh, that would only prove a point that hardly anyone cares.

Oh well…

Hey, if you ever find that info about N1K2s again, let the community know. Even if Gaijin will take years to change them, or won’t bother at all, it’s at least good enough to prove a point which is satisfying by itself. On another note: was that bulletproof glass of the ki-44 mounted in the windshield?

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I have a few pages of the N1K2’s pilot manual, I just can’t get a translation. The one person I know who knows japanese says these WW2-era characters have all been replaced decades ago and even with a dictionary he can only make out a few words at most.

N1-K2-Manual-1-of-4
N1-K2-Manual-2-of-4
N1-K2-Manual-3-of-4
N1-K2-Manual-4-of-4

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For the second picture, it should be

Engine Operation Limits

Max Continuous Thrust: No Limits, 2650rpm, +100 intake manifold pressure(of unknown unit)

WEP(?) translates to something like “specified running”: under 30 minutes, 2900rpm, +250 pressure

TOGA: under 1 minute, 2900rpm, +400 pressure

“High speed running”: when high speed descending, 3000rpm, -200 pressure

For the 3rd and 4th picture, it is mostly the dimensions of the fuselage, wings, elevators, vertical and horizontal stabilizers, etc.

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Ki-44?

Great, can you verify if the automatic translation I tried a while back confirms that:
Empty weight: 2660 kg
Gross Weight: 4200 kg
Max Overload: 4475 kg

At the moment the N1K2-J’s empty weight is set to 2949kg, with 526kg of max fuel load.

Thanks in advance.

In game N1K2-J take-off weight with full internal fuel and ammo load is 3859kg.

Another original document document gives these weights:
Empty: 2657kg
Gross: 4000kg
Overload: 4360kg
Overload: 4860kg

Empty weight in documents is somewhat meaningless, if it doesn’t say exactly what the plane has or doesn’t have. In some cases it seems like guns, armor and radio are not included in it.

Luckily for N1K2-J there is this page from some book which lists every single thing the plane had in three different confirgurations. You can throw it into google translate.

Spoiler

If I’m not missing anything:
Regular: 3800kg
-rear tank empty
1st Overload: 4032kg
-full internal load
2nd Overload: 4376kg
-full internal load and drop tank

4860 or 4876kg would have to be with full internal load, drop tank and two 250kg bombs.
This makes me wonder if the centerline drop tank could be replaced with a 250kg bomb like in few other Japanese planes.

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Should be mostly correct, it should translate to something like

Self weight: 2660
Full combat load: 4200
Weight of load: 1540 (4200-2660)
Allowed overload weight: 4475

Not sure about the unit since it translates to Kilowatts, I suspect it should mean kg?

The unit is kg.

1 Like