Is the requirement for economy / progression suggestions too high?

Game Discussion General Discussion
22

I’m asking in general do people feel the requirements for submitting a suggestion are acceptable.

The suggestion moderator had to have their teeth pulled before they’d answer publicly what they viewed as wrong about said suggestion. They still have not answered whether the post meeting all stated guidelines would be accepted since it is not a fundamental change.

If only “fundamental changes” are accepted for economy / progression updates then we truly have no way to provide feedback on the economy besides this forum section. I’m commonly told to submit a suggestion when presenting ideas like this here, now I’ll be able to definitively state (assuming the suggestion moderator answers) that there is no point as it is not a fundamental change.

23

So you’re suggesting a change to the suggestion requirements. Shouldn’t this be in the suggestion area following their formatting? LOL

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24

Prove anything I said is subjective isn’t. With facts, not feelings or opinions.

Changes to repair costs, foldering vehicles, lowering total rp costs overall to reach top tier, premium account changes to not lose sl, all changes made to the economy. RP is not at all the same as it was in 2014. It isn’t even the same as when I started playing in late 2022.

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Look I can show you Thunderskill stats too, the T-32E1 needs to go up in BR too.
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The Sherman Jumbo as well!!!

Again, prove that it is an issue with facts and no opinions.

25

This is hilarious.

26

I have not. I am asking if people are accepting of the current requirements.

If I were suggesting a change you are not supposed to do this through the suggestions section rather by “contacting a senior suggestions moderator” as noted here:

27

Please understand, we suggestion moderators have rules to keep order in our section. Not to section any specific idea.
As long as you follow the rules posted, and it wasn’t previously posted. It would be accepted as an suggestion.
If it doesnt not classify as an suggestion, but as an bug report. We would also decline such suggestion.

If your suggestion isn’t opened up, you can always PM an suggestion moderator to get an reply about why your suggestion had been declined. We will also supply you a copy of your declined suggestion for you to remake the suggestion with the fix.
We are more willing to help you than you think.

You can read more about the rules here

28

This goes against your own guidelines. You state that ideas for economy / progression changes must be “fundamental changes”. It is not simply formatting or depth of the post that is an issue but the base idea itself.

As noted.

29

Here’s a suggestion I suggest you take. Just stop!

30

Stop what?

31

The least they can do is literally to just lover premium price in high tier to $35 on the tier 7 premium. Its not that hard. Plus people only buy shit on sale anyway. so they should start charging DLC Price for merel fucking plane, not a whole ass AAA Game price.

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32

Wishful thinking but not going to happen.

33

The pricing of premium vehicles while related to economy and progression isn’t the main topic of this thread rather the requirements for the suggestions section related to stated topic.

For example, if you made a post describing this high cost and wrote a highly detailed, well written, elaborate suggestion for changing this specific progression related issue it would not be accepted.

This due to not the suggestion being a fundamental change to the economy, at least from my current understanding of the guidelines as explicitly stated.

You would need to format an idea in this way that suggests something fundamental, like removing premium vehicles entirely from the game or changing it so that they only way to access them is to rent them rather than purchase them outright.

This is the burden placed upon economy / progression related issues in the suggestions section.

34

What you are saying is they want us player to do stuff their game designer supposed to do all for free.

From 70 bucks prem now free labour from player.

35

The nonsensical ranty posts that you have become known for. You get Kamikaze bombed in game. You post a rant post about how doing such a thing should be a 2-hour crew lock. You get smacked around by a suggestion moderator because your suggestion wasn’t following the proper format. You create this post. Let’s not forget your rant yesterday about a community helper making a joke and you creating a post ranting about it and how they should follow a higher standard. The list goes on. Now I’m not saying this is a ranting post. But this is what you become known for.

36

I’ve personally given up, If I regain the urge, or gaijin decides to fix the horrible economy, I will come back to war thunder, for now, it’s just the Forum, Fallout 4, and I.

37

Prove anything I said is subjective isn’t. With facts, not feelings or opinions.

Things like spawn camping are because of objectively bad game design, vehicles spawning out in the open being good or bad is not a matter of opinion.

Changes to repair costs, foldering vehicles, lowering total rp costs overall to reach top tier, premium account changes to not lose sl, all changes made to the economy. RP is not at all the same as it was in 2014. It isn’t even the same as when I started playing in late 2022.

The total change of RP requirement was 6% for a normal player, from 7.7 million to 6.8 million RP for the German tree for example.

One month later the added the PSO and in December they added the 2A7V for 410k and 420k RP which meant the total RP reductions were negated in a few months, not even considering the heli RP nonsense.

For China I actually saw my grind increase by 500k after these ‘reforms’.

RP is not at all the same as it was in 2014.

You’re right, it’s not the same, it’s worse.

What 6 kills got me in 2014… 8.2k RP in a 13 minute game, 600 RP/min

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What 6 kills got me 10 years later… 8.7k RP in an 18 minute game 480 RP/min.

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Meanwhile there is an additional 200 million RP to grind which means if RP had adjusted with the increase of requirements you’d need to be making 5-10x the amount of RP.

Again, prove that it is an issue with facts and no opinions.

Like this

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Or this requiring a single kill to spawn.
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Or this

Or this

https://new.reddit.com/r/Warthunder/comments/1cl87du/su25sm3_deserves_to_be_deleted/

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38

RP
The comparison of the games is inaccurate. Not the same amount of assists and hits which grant RP. Plus the vehicles probably aren’t the same in each game, whoch means modifiers are different. The later game gives 14k MORE SL for less rewarded actions. Good try to make a comparison, but you are missing key variables that make the comparison viable to argue correctly. I’m sure tou will try to play it off that the variables I mention don’t matter, but when it comes to comparing numbers like you tried to do these variables can cause massive sways in the information, making it an inaccurate comparison.

They made a 6 percent improvement to RP, which is a positive change. Then they added vehicles that required RP at the end of the trees. Seperate actions completely. Would you rather they never add new vehicles to keep RP costs down? The 6 percent helps everyone that wants to play Germany (since you used that as an example), and the top tier vehicles are new additions so of course they are going to add to it. It didn’t negate the 6% change for the rest of the tree, that still improved.

CAS
I know that an A6 with guided bombs is not a single kill spawn. Approx 480 for airframe and around 170 or so for weapons? 660 SP estimate (I’ll have to check after work with my A10A late as a stand in). Not at all a single kill/cap spawn.

Helicopters with ATGMs do usually require one kill/cap, which isn’t a huge problem (to me, subjective as I described) when SPAA can be spawned for almost no spawn points.

The F-16 clip is an outlyer and not at all the norm of the average player using aircraft. If we balanced off of the the performance of the top 5% then the game would be disasterous. People get upset about incompenent pilots witbout realizing that competent pilots can do much more. Same with the SU-25 clip, competent pilot flexing the ability of his airframe and weapons. Should we make all maps flat so no tanks can utilize the ability to go hull down? Seems unfair if you can’t pen the turret.

I don’t see CAS as a problem as there are counters for everything at every level. I use aircraft to counter aircraft up until 7.7 and radar guided SPAA, then at 9.3 I use my Imp Chaparral to great effect (even though the M247 is better overall, gotta spade em both), and at 10.0 the LAV-AD has been quite enjoyable with missiles for fixed wing and rhe gun for rotary wing aircraft. I’m more excited for the XM-975 with its IRST and SACLOS missiles for longer range heli kills. At 11.3 (premium US) I use my AH-64A with ATAS, AIM9Ls, and gun to counter jets and helicopters.

The “issue” here is the willingness for people to play Warthunder as it is designed instead of blindly focusing on just ground units and expecting greatness in everything. Combined arms game required combined arms tactics. If you don’t want to fly planes or helis, then you better get used to leading unguided gun SPAA and having trouble countering a couple aircraft.

Spawns
No matter what you do spawn killing will happen. Doesn’t matter if you spawn everyone in an open field or in a fortress with shell blocking invisible barriers. If one team overwhelms the other and makes it to the spawn, nothing is going to be fair for either side in that situation. Make the spawning invincible in a certain area and then they just won’t leave because they can kill and not be killed. Make invisible walls that can’t be shot past then people will get killed as soon as they leave that barrier. Push the spawns further back and make them inaccessable, then you increase travel time/distance (slowing the game) and making the attacking team just lie in wait for them to come out. When teams crumble, spawns are exploited. Look at Call of Duty, you can spawn trap teams and amnihilate them if you are coordinated and skilled enough. Comes with the shooter genre.

39

Good try to make a comparison, but you are missing key variables that make the comparison viable to argue correctly

irrelevant, the point is that RP requirements in the game have increased drastically, this is what the TT looked like when you were making the same amount of RP.

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The RP is already in favor of the 2024 match because of the match duration, had the match been 13 minutes the RP would have been even less, yet despite the increased match duration and increase in assists it’s lower.

RP would need to triple, quadruple and it still would not come close to matching the experience from 2014.

The 6 percent helps everyone that wants to play Germany (since you used that as an example), and the top tier vehicles are new additions so of course they are going to add to it. It didn’t negate the 6% change for the rest of the tree, that still improved.

6% is a joke, it lasted a few months before the total amount of RP required was identical to the situation before August… the largest amount of negative reviews any company has ever received and since then only beaten by massive games like Overwatch and now recently Helldivers ll… and all we got was a temporary 6% decrease?

And this isn’t counting the RP added from helicopters which is now a burden for ground forces, that amounts to 1.7m RP, which meant an increase of 15% compared to before.

Stuff like this added 500k RP to my grind, the 6% is only in the case of Germany.

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Not to mention the foldering of vehicles was done in such a way that the newer vehicles were placed in front of the older vehicles, increasing the likelyhood that you could not speed up progression and not benefit from the RP reduction at the same time.

All my TTs have this now, still have to grind out the tree and no RP reduction.

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The F-16 clip is an outlyer and not at all the norm

It can easily be repeated, it shouldn’t be possible to delete half the enemy team in 5 seconds, also that F-16 is flying around 4 minutes after the start of the game, fully loaded, and went on to kill many more than those initial ones.

I don’t see CAS as a problem as there are counters for everything at every level.

There’s isn’t, SPAA is hardly a counter in most cases to begin with, and fighters are not a valid argument.

No matter what you do spawn killing will happen.

So? Which means nothing should be done?
Being spawncamped because the enemy was able to push into your spawn is not the same thing as being spawncamped because you spawn out in a field with zero cover and someone from across the map is able to kill you without having to be near your spawn.

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40

You are aware that you can hop into most light tanks (even some SPAA), scout a bit for that 14% spawn reduction, get a kill and a hit or two (or assists) and you can use virtually ANY cas with a full loadout? Depending on the map and lineup you can get into most cas within ~2 minutes.

41

What is even funnier is that people still keep doing it.

Gaijin is only going to make changes when:
A) It benefits their business and revenue model.
B) They are forced to by mass customer complaint.
And then they still manage to twist it and water B down until it fits into A.