Is fire-and-eject illegal?

[RunaDacino]

@MotorolaCRO

We’re talking about modes and fighters aren’t the only thing you can spawn.
Seeing whole PvE communities arising in Sim, I doubt rewards are all that bad.

I’ve edited my post to explain why zombing is “worth it” in sim as you were replying.

tl:dr - bombers have a much better chance at prop tiers for survival even despite the bad rewards

and at jet tiers, the bad rewards are ignored to exploit the 2.3x event multiplier even though it actively bleeds SL without premium.

@MotorolaCRO

That’s great.
You still need to spend much, much more RP/SL/time in order to enjoy your mode to the fullest though.
You’re focused on numbers from a single game while ignoring the big picture.

That’s like saying one has it better as he earns 10k RP vs your 7k RP in a game, while not taking into account he needs 10m RP to grind everything out and you need only 4m. (Placeholder numbers)

It’s important to focus because you can legitimately progress through the ground tree without ever taking a plane out.

I’ve got my 8.0 Great Britain vehicles playing solely GRB as britain (I don’t bring my spits in as CAS) and basically self-sustained my progress the whole time.

If I had tried to do that with the U.S, my 7.0 planes couldn’t grind out my 8.0 planes because I’d be dealing with ~1000 SL per 15 minutes (assuming I do not die. if I die, i can easily end a match with -50K SL even with a positive KDR depending on when I die). Assuming you only die once per 30 minutes and get at least 600 score both times, you’re looking at paying 16.5K SL to spawn in once, then 16.5K SL 30 minutes in. For the first 15 minutes we survive and land and earn 1370x0.86x15=17673 SL (we profitted 1.1K!) and then the second 15 minutes we again hit 0.86 reward (max we can get is 0.92) but don’t land as we died - 0.80x0.86x15x1370= 14138.4 SL then we spay 16.5K to respawn again. This is assuming we die immediately at ~30.1 minutes for ease of calculation.

So, we spent 16.5+16.5=33000 SL
We maintained a ~4 kills to 1 death ratio (2 UA cycles with 86% reward, 1 death)
We earned 17.6+14.1=31.6K SL.
We profited a NEGATIVE 1.4K SL.

Getting 10 kills (absurd value, but let’s assume) every 15 minutes and 1 death every 30 minutes doesn’t change the above. It’s a +6% more SL reward (17.6 becomes 18.9k - a whooping 1300 more SL! We actually make 2x1.3-1.4=1200 SL per 30 minutes maxing out our reward potential (which already happened at 3 kills (1050+ = 0.92~0.93 reward, 800 = 0.90 reward, 600 = 0.86 reward. )

We need to earn, from f80a5 to buy the F2H2 (without modifications, experting or anything) 240 000 SL.

We have, over the course of 30 minutes where we earned 4 kills to 1 death, made negative 1.4K SL. If we didn’t die 30.1 minutes in, we’d have earned some 2x17.6-16.5= 18.7K SL in 30 minutes.

[warhead_beast]

The scourge of Air Sim

its really time that gajin does something to ppl like this (he did this every single time over multiple matches)

[MotorolaCRO]

@RunaDacino

and at jet tiers, the bad rewards are ignored to exploit the 2.3x event multiplier even though it actively bleeds SL without premium.

You’re still getting RP/SL while doing close to nothing in those cases. Premium account gives you a massive advantage in terms of progression, so not using it if you’re even a semi-regular player is weird, especially how cheap it can be bought (~3.3 euros per month). If you’re a regular player you can get it basically for free by selling event vehicles.

@RunaDacino

It’s important to focus because you can legitimately progress through the ground tree without ever taking a plane out.

You can progress but you’re hampering your chances for success, especially at tiers where CAS is obnoxiously strong and require CAP to counter it effectively, or your nation doesn’t have any AA options.

GRB allows me to spawn tanks, helicopters and jets, so if I want to follow through I basically have to grind through Heli and Air trees as well, which obviously takes time and RP/SL.

@RunaDacino

I’ve got my 8.0 Great Britain vehicles playing solely GRB as britain (I don’t bring my spits in as CAS) and basically self-sustained my progress the whole time.

I’m not talking about progress, I’m talking about maximizing your lineups and GRB is by far the most demanding in that regard.

[RunaDacino]

@MotorolaCRO

I’m not talking about progress, I’m talking about maximizing your lineups and GRB is by far the most demanding in that regard.

You cannot seriously look at the progress ratio (30 minutes for ~1-3K SL gain when goal is 240K SL without expert (which you absolutely need in ASB due to vignetting out even before losing control making it hard to visually track enemy fighters) or modification cost) and tell me GRB is more demanding.

Especially since there’s a chance to go negative, so we can’t even just assume it takes us 240 x 30 minute segments of 1K SL.

@MotorolaCRO

ou’re still getting RP/SL while doing close to nothing in those cases.

The Useful actions system means you’re barely getting anything. All you’re getting is score.

@MotorolaCRO

If you’re a regular player you can get it basically for free by selling event vehicles.

I don’t play every day or every month. it’s paying money for nothing.

If I could turn my F4U-4, F3H-2, F2H-2 and so forth into a premium plane, I’d be open to paying as those are permanent investments that I’m not wasting by not playing for a month or two.

[MokaMoki]

I feel like easy fix for this is jusy making a J-out be counted as a kill to the closest enemy. If its something that people are doing and possibly abusing, then doing so will effectively make it pointless to do. Just have the little pop-up message say “Maneuver Kill”.

[MotorolaCRO]

@RunaDacino

You cannot seriously look at the progress ratio (30 minutes for ~1-3K SL gain when goal is 240K SL without expert (which you absolutely need in ASB due to vignetting out even before losing control making it hard to visually track enemy fighters) or modification cost) and tell me GRB is more demanding.

As I said, you could earn less rewards per minute but this means nothing without looking at how much rewards in total you need to accrue in order to “finish” something.

Sim only requires Air tree, while GRB requires Ground, Helicopter and Air trees.

@RunaDacino

Especially since there’s a chance to go negative, so we can’t even just assume it takes us 240 x 30 minute segments of 1K SL.

You can go negative everywhere without a premium.

@RunaDacino

I don’t play every day or every month. it’s paying money for nothing.

That’s like not paying for Netflix because you don’t watch it every day.
WT premium costs around 10 cents per day and even if you play every 4th day that comes out at 90 days in a 360 day period.

You’ll pay 40€ for 90 days of playing, which is around 44 cents per day of active playing.
I think it’s a worthwhile investment for anyone that’s playing more than once a week.

[warhead_beast]

@MotorolaCRO

You can go negative everywhere without a premium.

RunaDacino:

Yet in air SB it’s easier than in every other game mode because you pay the repair cost upfront.
Let me show you a few examples of how Fucked the reward system is
i already did an earlier topic on this

With the new reward changes can we pls finally get rid of the useful action system?

The system was already very flawed but now since one of the main reasons for it got nerfed, can we finally go back to the old reward system? Having a timed RP cap is really non sensible especially if you want to hop on for a short round in a match that’s already going for an hour. Exhibit A: [image-4] Half an hour played and the same rewards as I would get for 3 kills and 1.5h of playtime.

(i sadly cant show you more examples today since i cant see the rewards from yesterday anymore, but i will show you more tomorrow when i grind the event again)

[MotorolaCRO]

@warhead_beast

its really time that gajin does something to ppl like this (he did this every single time over multiple matches)

Those that like to do that will just adapt and instead of J-ing out will gracefully crash into the environment, seemingly by mistake.

@MokaMoki

I feel like easy fix for this is jusy making a J-out be counted as a kill to the closest enemy.

@MokaMoki
This might be unfair to a player that launched a missile towards an enemy, just to see his teammate get the reward because he was closer, disregarding the fact it was his missile that made him give up on his life.

@warhead_beast

Let me show you a few examples of how Fucked the reward system is
i already did an earlier topic on this

So you did a 29 minute game with 11 kills and got ~13k RP with ~69k SL (no win bonus). You paid ~8k SL to spawn that plane so total earnings was about ~60k SL. It doesn’t look that bad to be honest.

[warhead_beast]

@MotorolaCRO

You paid ~8k SL to spawn that plane

make that double that

[MotorolaCRO]

@warhead_beast

make that double that

My bad, I was looking at 8k SL because I don’t have it spaded.

Also, how much time did you spent on RTB and going back to the fight ?

[warhead_beast]

@MotorolaCRO

Also, how much time did you spent on RTB and going back to the fight ?

good question, i would guess maybe 1/3rd but i dont know for sure

[RunaDacino]

@MotorolaCRO

That’s like not paying for Netflix because you don’t watch it every day.

Yeah I don’t pay for any subscription services other than my pass for commuting, and even that I often only buy week long or few days’ worth if I am not sure I’ll need to go into the lab frequently enough to warrant it. I dislike paying for stuff when I’m not using it.

I pay my utilities by amount used, reporting in manually each month with occasional check-ups to make sure I’m not lying.

[PercussionCap]

@MotorolaCRO

Get back to me when your sim games have AAs that can counter you without you even noticing

Convoy SIDAMs…

[KatukovM]

@Schindibee

There are no PvE rooms.

@Miraz05

There’s nothing such as “PvE room”.

Then how would you call a session where players complete only PvE tasks?

@Miraz05

Everyone has the right to shoot down enemy jets

Did I say anything against that? I just said that “punishers” going to “PvE rooms” on purpose to ruin other players’ gameplay does not seem to solve any problem.

[warhead_beast]

@KatukovM

Then how would you call a session where players complete only PvE tasks?

Just a normal session. Free for all to do what they want.

[MotorolaCRO]

@warhead_beast

good question, i would guess maybe 1/3rd but i dont know for sure

So like 18-20mins of that were actual gameplay, more or less.
I expected to see lower rewards for that though, but I guess it isn’t that bad.

I’ve had full 25 minute long Battle games net me ~70k SL for 10+ kills in GRB.

[KatukovM]

@warhead_beast

Just a normal session.

Absolutely agree with you.
But some players think that they play the game wrong (or they envy them since they enjoy the game without PvP), so they deliberately come to those sessions and ruin the gameplay on purpose.
They (these “punishers”) even think that they are making the game better by doing this activity.

[MokaMoki]

@MotorolaCRO

This might be unfair to a player that launched a missile towards an enemy, just to see his teammate get the reward because he was closer, disregarding the fact it was his missile that made him give up on his life.

You can’t assume the intent of the teammate though. It becomes a game of “what if” at that point. If you throw out a 7M at 10km but I am 0.60km away going for a gun kill, then whose intent matters? The point and intent of the “Manuever Kill” would be to dissuade the practice of J’ing-out.

[MotorolaCRO]

@MokaMoki

If you throw out a 7M at 10km but I am 0.60km away going for a gun kill, then whose intent matters?

You could also be totally oblivious to the enemy and having no chances of shooting him down, but still getting a kill reward because he crashed while trying to evade a teammate’s ARH fired 10km away.

This isn’t a solution as people responsible for the kill still won’t be rewarded.

[MokaMoki]

But you are assuming your missile will indeed be the killing blow. And you have no certainty of that until the missile connects and you see the confirmation. The “Manuever Kill” mearly takes in the information that someone either crashed or J’ed-out while near an near you or a teammate. This actually solves this issue and someone slamming into the ground trying to get away which happens a lot. Playing devil’s advocate here, it shouldn’t be for the full 100% payout of a reward. 50% makes more sense.