What about a feature like in Naval where in addition to any aircraft in a player’s lineup, there is an option to spawn in a random fighter or attacker. Like in Naval, these random aircraft would be a bit lower BR than the battle and therefore less effective than an aircraft purpose-picked for a lineup (as it should be IMO, to reward players who actually grind air). But that way any player regardless of their experience with air can spawn a cheap fighter with limited CAS capabilities or a more expensive attacker with decent capabilities.
Remember that naval has AA which is AI, which is why it works in first place.
MH4UAstragon had proposed exactly that some time ago–though it was blown up in the upheaval of the forums.
I’m sure many would be open to that…I have no problems with it.
Few people play the game focusing on SP though, you either kill or be killed and however many SP that costs isn’t that relevant, as SP tends to not really be an issue for an average player either as you tend to have more than enough to not be restricted by it unless you spawn more than one plane.
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Your take is not wrong–but what you’re saying is largely unrelated to the point I was making (the winner of the engagement).
If both people die in an engagement, it will be the player who died with the less expensive vehicle who won because of SP costs.
The SP cost is mostly tied to their loadout which is already dropped so the value of the plane was pretty low, whilst the value of SPAA is low in SP cost but a lot more valuable than a plane without a loadout for the match as now the door is open to more CAS being able to operate uncontested.
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480+ SP aircraft versus <160 SP ground vehicle makes for a pretty clear win for the latter in terms of SP costs in a scenario where both die.
As for further SPAAs used, given their 70-120 SP costs I’d say the ‘uncontested’ quip is a bit of a stretch…their low cost makes them quite likely to proliferate.
It’s 480SP because of the loadout they carry, once that is gone they tend to be pretty useless and generally you’re doing the enemy team a favor by shooting them down so they spawn in a tank and actually make themselves useful.
Most people don’t bring multiple SPAA, even having a single good SPAA is challenging enough at times, and playing SPAA tends to be a shitty experience that people would rather not do, it’s way more challenging, way less rewarding and most engagements results in both people dying.
People play to have fun, which means situations like these are way more common than teams full of SPAA.
Ground RB btw.
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480 SP or higher generally, as bombs tend to carry it at least somewhat higher…but I understand your point.
While I’d say it is harsh to say clean fighters/bombers that need to reload are ‘useless’ I do agree that having too many aircraft drags on the team…it makes for a poor mix.
I had meant others’ SPAAs rather subsequent spawns…and as far as personal opinions on SPAAs go, it varies widely as you’d expect. (I have suggested a 400% earnings hike to encourage use myself.)
Nothing untoward to me in those screenshots.
As you said in so many words, players play what they want.
While I’d say it is harsh to say clean fighters/bombers that need to reload are ‘useless’ I do agree that having too many aircraft drags on the team…it makes for a poor mix.
Most of them just float around and spray MGs at targets, and whilst I’m sure Gaijin has nerfed the ability to get assists that way like you used to, it doesn’t do a whole lot unless you can find open top vehicles or you play US who get .50s that can pen some stuff.
I had meant others’ SPAAs rather subsequent spawns…and as far as personal opinions on SPAAs go, it varies widely as you’d expect
As you said in so many words, players play what they want.
People don’t spawn SPAA because SPAA is not fun, people play what they want and what they want is fun, and it’s infinitely more fun to fly a plane around and bomb stuff than it is to sit on the ground trying to spot a pixel.
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Those sentiments are basically correct, though clean fighters’ deterrence value to enemy bombers is appreciable.
The loitering of those players (rather than reloading with useful weaponry) really qualifies more as a player choice issue than a vehicle viability problem. They need to RTB rather than remIn around.
While that is one take (perhaps yours, perhaps not), I understand that…but there are many others too.
As aircraft can be used for the same use (air defense), there isn’t really too much issue to be had between the different takes.
SL incentives can be offered, but nobody can really be forced into anything.
Those sentiments are basically correct, though clean fighters’ deterrence value to enemy bombers is appreciable.
I don’t think that’s significant, unless they see them coming and are able to take them out instantly they usually have a pretty good chance at dropping their payload before being taken down, or in the case of US CAS they have a good chance to fight back anyways.
Which comes back to people playing what is fun, and SPAA isn’t fun so people won’t play it, making SPAA fun or feasible or rewarding would go a long way.
Actually giving SPAA sights that function for example so you’re not in third person being blocked by your own vehicle and blinded by your own muzzle flash.
The ability to scout and mark planes for easier tracking and teamplay, as well as additional rewards and SP when scouted target gets destroyed.
Planes having a damage model that can prevent the use of weaponry in the same way it applies to ground vehicles, as plane weapons never fail even when it exploded and wings blown of, the weapons never fail, meaning the SPAA almost never makes it out alive as it’s unlikely to kill the pilot as the only thing to prevent you from getting killed in retaliation.
Helicopters are especially a joke where they continue to fly around without a tail for 20 seconds just fine, and their damage model is like they’re a flying cardboard box because Gaijin never heard of electronics, hydraulics or anything, surely an APFSDS ripping through the front panel of a Ka-50 results in no damage done, that’s how helicopters work and there’s nothing really of value inside a helicopter.
Fixing radars to stop them from being absolutely trash and detrimental if anything
Actual worthwhile rewards.
Most of the SPAA’s issues are derived from bad game design and not an inherent issue with SPAA.
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I got four fully loaded Air Spawns off of 9 scout kills.
It definitely needs tweaked. As for the Helicopter issue at top tier, that can be solved with more APS systems implemented.
And Rocket helicopters are not that powerful. It’s very easy to counter them.
Please try to get more than one or two kills as a Helicopter with rockets. It’s very difficult to do consistently if you don’t know what you’re doing.
It’s been argued a lot before, I thought it was a bad idea then, still do now. The cost of increasing SP cost for planes is that the players who know what they’re doing will continue on playing as though nothing has happened and the players who are learning/underperforming will get to play them less. You will get less suicide JU87’s, maybe less Pe-8’s, but you will also see less people who can spawn fighters to stop enemy CAS and SPAA will need to play a greater role, which I see a lot of people claiming SPAA is not able to do the work that is already required of it so I’m skeptical about pushing the game this way.
Personally, I think bombs over 2000kg should have dramatically higher SP costs so that they are basically half the cost of a nuke or more, but can be rearmed. Then, remove the SP discount for playing under-tiered planes in a lineup if that plane has bombs, rockets, AGMs, etc. I think this smaller step will do a lot to reduce the most irritating deaths in the game and then the community can come back and talk about CAS after those changes and decide if anything else is too annoying. Blanketed solutions often backfire. Target the problem as closely as you can, refine in increments.
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bump, helicopters shouldn’t be allowed in the 2nd minute of the match. Just increase the air resp to 1000 sp+
Edit-
2 minutes into the game and I was shot by a ka50, is this a joke? -1 crew and complete lack of ammunition
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Will we see a separate mode just for tanks? or increase sp air?
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They want to earn as much on CAS vechicles as possible, so not really as such a mode would make them earn less
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123 fps and Nintendo64 graphics? If you can’t even anticipate a heli rusher with these settings, the heli is not the problem.
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what? XD
Some are just coping