Have you ever considered the ground battle?
Well, it’s not Ground Battle where all the complaints are coming from, is it? Furthermore, it appears to me that the player-versus-player combat in that game mode are inherently imbalanced. When it comes to a tank lacking AA countermeasures, the weight of the bomb doesn’t make much of a difference; it’s always at a significant disadvantage.
Yes, but Gaijin will consider the ground battle balance, which has impacted the BR of air. The weight of the bomb is one of the most important points for WWII BR, such JU88 takes 4500kg well much better than only taking 4250kg, of course if JU288 could take 22500kg bombs, it will much better than 21800kg bombs
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Two possibilities:
1.) Internally, one bomb behind the other:
2.) Externally, one bomb under each wing on an ETC rack as done on the He 177 A-5. The Ju 288 C should have the identical ETC 2000 wing rack that equipped the He 177 A-5
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We shouldn’t have to, because Gaijin should have separated ground and air RB BRs a long time ago, or figured out another solution.
Planes that wreck havoc killing player tanks in ground RB shouldn’t cause said plane’s BR to increase in air RB!
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I’d be all for the 288 getting 2500kg bombs IF the BR increases.
Even a jump to 6.3 would make 5.0 planes playable again which would be awesome!
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Indeed, we have plenty of aircrafts suffer from this, such as GR7 or mig27k
The 288 has ruined 6.0 Air RB almost single handedly.
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288 was always limited to 4 units. Lack of players caused 6v6.
It’s not lack of players, it’s an overabundance of 288s. The matchmaker has so many to stick into teams that you almost always see the smallest teams allowed (6v6) with 4 288s, sometimes 8 due to being on both teams.
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Its a lack of fighter pilots. Too few play axis fighters around 6.0 +/-… And why would you? Ta’s and late 109’s are absolutly inferior to allied props around that BR. Especially after MG151 is not what it once was, the drag is too high compared to others. All that while you can simply play FW’s and Bf’s one Br step lower without facing op enemy planes. Almost identical planes, but no Super props as opponents.
Players stick to stuff which works and avoid things which don’t work.
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Maybe spawn it on the ground?
Wouldn’t suprise me given games at that BR are usually like 8 v 8 and usually one side has all fighters and the other has four ju 288Cs. RIP Germany at that BR.
Want better win rates? Move the 288 up.
No - the problem is the MM allowing too small lobbies in those matches, the artificial downtiering of US late/post war fighters and the massive increase of clueless players in this BR range.
The Ju 288 was an extremely capable aircraft, able to dogfight to a certain degree, with good speed and firepower.
And back in the old days you could decide matches for the axis team if you were skilled enough to kill 8 moving tanks with 8 SC 250kg drops. Your fighters were either chasing a B-29 at 10 km or simply unable to kill tanks.
But after countless nerfs of the Ju 288 and the decision of gaijin to delete the possibility to kill the enemy airfield there is simply no need for an experienced pilot to use a plane like the Ju 288 as you can’t make the difference by fulfilling bomber tasks.
Basically base bombing of 4 respawning bases is useless regarding the outcome and degrading bombing to a grinding tool. Due to the low skill floor a hell of clueless players use them, and in almost all BRs you see planes with bot scripts - because of the low skill floor.
In addition the MM allowing 6 vs 6 matches with 4 bombers on axis side simply scared away a hell of experienced axis fighters. Those guys were able to defeat undertiered US/UK fighters on equal numbers, but fighting in constant numerical disadvantage is not good for k/d, WR or other stats - and playing 4.7 or 7.3 just skips this disadvantage.
So from my pov the title of this thread is just misleading, the Ju 288 has no BR issue, the BR bracket 5.0 - 7.0 is broken due to the combination of small lobbies, undertiered US fighters and absence of experienced axis pilots (some still fight there, quite successful - just look at the 6.0 Re 2005).
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Small lobbies are the result, not the source of the problem.
Which US planes are under-tiered? The UK has way better selections in that BR range than the US.
Of course US/UK teams are going to win if German teams always have 4 JU 288s. Bombers do not win matches. They never have except on very rare occasion. Fighter players know this and that is why if German pilots want to win they’ll avoid 6.0. On the flip side, everyone on US/UK teams know to play 6.0 fighters if they want to dunk on some JU 288s.
From my perspective, the JU 288 has completely ruined that BR range because it is a really really good SL grinder so a lot of people play it but it is really really bad for whichever team they end up on. They either need to severely nerf its SL so that it’s not a good SL grinder or they need to move it up in order to make it harder for them to outrun fighters.
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Sorry man - i see this completely different and i described the correlation of all factors exactly enough. I played on an old account more than 5.000 matches in the Ju 288 - just for fun as it was a good plane.
The speed of a plane that saw limited service in small numbers in 1944 was in combination with durability and good defensive firepower good enough to compete with allied post WW2 stuff - just look at the old forum.
There were no small 6 vs 6 lobbies with 4 Ju 288s 3 years ago - the plane was a pain to kill if they were flown by experienced pilots - even if the A2D-1 spam came in…
And all of a sudden we had small lobbies guaranteeing the US fighter boys numerical superiority vs axis fighters, leading to an “auto-win” if they were smart.
Arguing that the sales of Ju 288s created 6 vs 6 lobbies is simply not true. There were 3 bases and 4 Ju 288s - so the income was rather limited as killing a base was a race against others and killing the airfield was almost impossible as you needed 10-12 SC 1.800 for that - getting there multiple times was rather difficult.
But after the introduction of 4 respawning bases with increased base health the income was almost guaranteed and on top increased as now all got more income from a single run and the “base destruction” bonus.
That gaijin allowed smaller lobbies increased the sales even more, less enemy fighters means even higher chances to get a base and gain income.
So there is a MM problem and not a Ju 288 problem.
2 solutions:
- Allow 4 Ju 288s on both teams
- Increase the minimum lobby to 8 per team
Last word:
Your proposal to increase its BR in order to kill his design goal high speed as main defense vs contemporary fighters seems strange. This is the same as you would ask to uptier all aircraft with speed advantage. Start with the P-51 C at 3.7, the Wyvern at 4.0, the MB 5 at 5.0 and the P-51 H-5 and put them to more realistic BRs based on actual performance and we can talk about the Ju 288 - not earlier…
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it would make no sense if they were doing their respective jobs… but in WT the slow night bomber is operating in daytime… so a comparison is perfectly reasonable.
There are many other factors that may have contributed, such as BR compression and a completely different-looking top tier, but it is very well-known that the 288C is a grinder. In fact, what you’re saying makes a lot of sense in that the 288 has created a problem because now that bases respawn, people are more incentivized to play bombers. If that wasn’t the case several years ago, it certainly is now. But even three years ago the 288C was one of the most-played aircraft in the game, and easily the most played aircraft at its BR.
Your solutions make no sense.
- Why would you change the entire matchmaker to fix problem created by one plane when you can just put it up in BR or nerf its SL/RP gain?
- That wouldn’t help at all unless it was combined with Solution #1; you would still have one team with 6-8 fighters and one with only 4, and it increases the wait time which is already longer than average.
My solution is to disincentivize players from playing the JU288 either by making all the other bombers equally effective or to make the JU 288 less effective. The latter is just easier. My proposal is to make the JU 288 like every other bomber in the game by making it less effective in terms of play-ability and SL/RP gain.
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Not at all. Many aircraft with speed advantages can actually help you win. Bombers do not. The F-104’s are great and I think most of them are perfectly fine where they are at.
There aren’t matchmaker issues at 3.7 or 4.0 and the win rates are fine. I don’t particularly care if either go up. There are way better options in my mind. I can’t speak for the H-5 since I never play it but since it only has .50 cals and can’t turn worth a damn I think you’re just nit-picking. Clearly you have some deep-seated attachment for the plane given your 5,000 battles in it, so I don’t think you’re seeing things objectively.
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As written somewhere else - i would not play the Ju 288 on this account - even if i would get one for free. Why would i play together with 3 bots and 2 poor guys trying to spade a 5.0 fighter vs 6 US/UK fighters; the later play there explicitly as they expect easy grinding and they can avoid stiff resistance.
It makes zero sense to play a plane that was nerfed (open and hidden) several times just because the average US/UK pilot was simply not smart enough to kill them. Exactly these kind of pilots i see frequently dying to bot Ju 288s as their tactics are limited to headons and ass sniffing.
Your solutions make no sense.
Your opinion.
Why would you change the entire matchmaker to fix problem created by one plane when you can just put it up in BR or nerf its SL/RP gain?
There would be no change of the entire MM - as long as you don’t realize that the 6 vs 6 matches are always set up with the semi-historical MM (so axis vs allies) you simply suck up German/Italian 5.0+ fighters in constant uptier loops. Defining the Ju 288 as neutral with a mixed MM would allocate them to both sides - and subsequently level at least the numbers odds.
That wouldn’t help at all unless it was combined with Solution #1; you would still have one team with 6-8 fighters and one with only 4, and it increases the wait time which is already longer than average.
Based on this comment i am not sure if you have actually played in 6 vs 6 matches with substantial success or played long enough there to see the benefits of 8 vs 8.
Basically US teams are at least in prop BRs marked by masses of highly motivated but also highly inexperienced pilots. A lot of them have realized that they have in this BR range a kind of “petting zoo” to farm SLs more or less unmolested just based on the fact that there are just 2 potential threats (the 2 poor 5.0 guys). Hence you have a waiting time as they are eager to play there.
Even in 2 vs 6 fighter matches it just takes 2 half most decent axis pilots to win matches which should be an auto-win for US/UK just based on numbers. For a few days earlier this year the number of Ju 288s was reduced to 3 - and there were 7 vs 7 matches only - a great relief and it was a pleasure to fly the IT P-47 in such conditions.
An increase to 8 vs 8 as minimum lobby around 6.0 would encourage a lot a axis players to return to this bracket as the odds of 4 vs 6-8 are far better than 2 vs 4-6 - just based on their experience advantage (as they are able to deal with raw performance disadvantages); again, just look at this insane BR increase of the Re 2005, most of the US/UK players are clueless.
The US teams are severely handicapped by the flood of clueless pilots - usually tankers without any know-how how to use them properly - which results in severe undertiering of a hell of planes active in this BR range - despite their planes are objectively undertiered. If you don’t believe me - go to yt and search for vids with the mentioned planes.
My solution is to disincentivize players from playing the JU288 either by making all the other bombers equally effective or to make the JU 288 less effective. The latter is just easier. My proposal is to make the JU 288 like every other bomber in the game by making it less effective in terms of play-ability and SL/RP gain.
Seriously? The main problem i see with this attitude is
A) The plane is a premium, gaijin won’t even think about it
B) You see a bomber as a free kill
The issue is and was as soon it get difficult to fight something seen as an easy kill like a bomber the majority tends to transfer their “you” problem to a “them” problem.
Experienced pilots go for bombers last as they are usually no threat for the outcome. The guys going for bombers first are exactly the reason why planes like the XP-50 stuck for years at 3.7 (now 4.0 since a while) - the majority is either not skilled or patient enough to set up a perfect attack and die due to own mistakes.
Seeing the B-29 at 7.3 in Air RB is following this logic.
Fact is a good flown Ju 288 or the imho best non- premium bomber B-18B are a pain to kill, but they are not decisive for the outcome of the majority of matches - the 6 vs 6 and 16 vs 16 mess neutralized their potential; the B-18 B was killed due to the 60% full uptier ratio to 5.0 (it can’t kill a respawning base) combined with loadout nerf and nerf of manual gunners (accuracy, damage and range).
There aren’t matchmaker issues at 3.7 or 4.0 and the win rates are fine.
Exactly - why? No historical MM like in the Ju 288 “small team black hole” and up to 10 Wyverns on Team A and 5 XP-50s on Team B.
So either create mixed battles (Ju 288s on both teams) or increase the teams to 8 vs 8.
I mean mixed battle implies that there are no axis vs allies anymore.
It is obvious that the historical MM is active across all prop ranks - as soon you have small teams. Try the BP B7A2 and select SA servers - you will get as hell of Jap vs US/UK battles on Iwo Jima, Saipan, New Guinea or Gualdalcanal - or choose the 4.0 SM 92 and you have axis vs allies like in the old days…
Btw the 4 bomber layout works there too, so usually u fly with 3 other B7A2s and 2 A6M2s vs 6 US/UK fighters.
Edit: Multiquote issue…