Little too late for that.
The only way for that is to have TO.
You can’t balance air vs ground, for ground units it will be always unfair as air will always have the upper hand.
As soon as You realize that having just combined gamemode while there is a lot of people who just want to enjoy tank combat results in constant nerfs/buffs, You also understand why TO is the best solution as even teams are going to be more balanced due to having both sides being prepared for combined aspect of the game.
MGs on the roof in most cases have limited angles, maps don’t allow for good cover, moving is not always an option and a good pilot will always wait for good opportunity. Not to mention open tops that can’t deal with clean fighters.
But hey, we can be stuck in the same gamemode that can’t evolve because it tries to make both sides of the argument happy!
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Tbh theres not really a BR now where cas is totally unopposed, top tier used to have the issue cause fhe spaa ranges and systems weren’t as advanced.
Now a though? Most trees have a decent spaa or cap plane per BR.
Top tier especially is now a mission just to get a cas capable plane to tbe front.
Im against TO, i came from over 13 years of WOT ,when you have tanks which can sit in sniper positions completely without contention it leads to huge camp fests.
Without CAS a good few maps would need full overhauls to compete with specific spawns which have inherent advantages.
aight and how many of such positions exist and on which maps?
Sniper position that allows for uncontested dominance of large portion of map, which can be only cleared with CAS?
Again, name them.
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They just change the type of CAS that is abusing at the moment.
If planes are lacking you’re sure helicopters will make up for it. Just looking at current top tier tells you everything.
CAP isn’t available to people that only research Ground tree.
A good few maps would need full overhauls regardless, as they were designed years ago without taking modern machinery into consideration.
I highly doubt CAS was meant to clean out tanks from those “OP” positions, seeing how the thing is completely optional to begin with.
The issue is that someone has to spawn SPAA to deal with CAS and that someone You would like to be on same or better skill level than CAS.
Examples of such positions?
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American desert has 1 in D3 if i remember righlty.
Sands of sinai has a few specifically related one near the C flank.
Abandoned factory also has a one near A where you sit inside a building and tbe only real way to get a player out is through CAS bombing them or completely steam rolling the team.
Thats just 3 off rhe top of my head while Im bed bound.
I never said CAS whole purpose was that.
Im saying the total removal of it will encourage more people to abuse spots which are blatantly one sided.
The current top tier ive experience is relatively ground based.
I struggle to spawn my own CAS , and relegate planes mostly to CAP duty.
As well as that helis still are no where near as prolific as they were 2/3 years ago.
I played over 1 /4 of my game timeas ground only, my biggest learning curve was realising that CAP is essential to grb.
I got air trees bit by bit.
Have you played armoured warfare or WoT?
Have you seen the level of camping that goes on?
Well spaa have been in the game from the get go.
Its why they exist.
Think folks forget WT was actively a plane game to begin with.
So then please explain to me if a person sitting there is able to shoot at You while You can’t shoot at them back or disable their gun and if such position doesn’t allow You to flank them or if that position controls the whole map.
Doesn’t change anything in what I have said.
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Thats completly flat part of the map and its an urban area with multiple approach venues, most if not all providing cover for approaching tank.
This is legitimately the first time im hearing about this location being sniper position that can contest large chunk of map.
Sands of Sinai was always a long range map, but I struggle to remember a single position that would require CAS to clear out and couldnt be cleared without flanking along the middle rocks.
Aight I hoped into custom battle and loaded up abandoned factory. Ive located 7 possible positions you could be talking about that fit your description - sniper position inside a building. All of these offered only higly specific sightlines.
Four in the northern part of the factory basically allowed only for sightlines towards the northern spawn, with most of the view being blocked by the buildings at B5/6, building at C5, and silos at D5, with one of the positions also allowing for sightline towards B.
Out of three in the souther part of the factory, only two actually offered sightlines towards the southern spawn. the one one the right side E6 only allows for sightlines to the left and to the right, but not directly towards the southern spawn.
In precisely one of these locations, ther was enough cover so that the tank didnt sit there exposed.
None of these locations covered all the approach venues towards A.
All of these locations could be cleared by either outsniping the camper, or simply flanking him.
So Im gonna say you made unfounded claim.
I did play WoT for 7 years before migrating over to WT. WoT isnt campfest due to lack of CAS. WoT is campfest due to tanks having HP systems, so one-shots are rare, even on light tanks, and one tank with fast enough reload can hold off several tanks; as well as the terrible spotting system which allowed for tanks like E-25 sitting completly invisible some 150m from your tank while still being able to attack.
WoT gameplay actively discourages aggresive manuevers unlike WT.
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When they had more arty it was less of a camp fest.
I’m well aware.
However my point is TD are far more prominant campers than lights, which results always in a stalemate.
without cas to dislodge a tick which you cannot get out (in WoTs case ARTY) they are allowed more freedome to camp
It never used to , until they nerfed the nuts off of arty and such.
Why does this take me to a duran duran song xD
Warthunder hasn’t had the chance to see what would happen with a tank only outwith one event which was binned due to not being monitarily worth it.
They have stated many times, that they wont implement a TO mode as well.
That is NOT where TF2 went wrong.
Unless Gajin decided to do something actually reasonably fit once a reverted the SP change before rethinking their approach to balancing.
Can you prove that statement please?
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looking at my date of registration on WoT, I played from 2012 to 2017 (so five years, not seven as i initially stated). arty was THE most infuriating part of the campfest - some dude just watching hentai on his second monitor, playing what was essentialy a point-and-click adventure instead of the game, with birds eye view of the battlefield in the real time even with WW2 arty…yeah no thanks. Never again.
Im sorry but you yet have to provide an example of position that can be cleared with CAS only.
Again, I actively played from 2012 to 2017 and most matches were either quintessential trench warfare for the first 10 minutes before someone got lucky with spotting; or corner camping for the first 10 minutes of the match if it was city map before someone finally left the heavy tank/tank destroyer UFC octagon victorious and opened a flanking route.
On rare occasions, there was a map that allowed you to actually push through after initial clash like Sacred Valley temple area (had to google name of this one up, apparently its been long removed lol. im old).
My experience playing WoT was vastly different to warthunder, where aggresive pushing and flanking is the name of the game.
tis a meme.
and we know this how? Clearly theres demand, all gaijin has to do is to provide supply, and they can do at minimal cost when they can just copypaste standard GRB code but remove plane spawns.
Hell, you can currently set up TO only game in customs by deselecting checkbox for allowed
vehicle classes.
Like in the example I provided earlier to pangolin, say you have 1000 players in GRB. 800 of them spend money on the game, remaning 200 are dissatisfied with current state of the game so they wont spend a dime.
Why wouldnt gaijin want these 200 players to spend their money on warthunder if all it takes is to supply them with a game mode with minimal costs? By not meeting their demand, they wont get them to spend money on warthunder; in fact they might lose them entirely to competition. Not catering to demand does not make sense from business standpoint.
As ive read in one naval thread, Gaijin back in 2016/7/8(?) also denied ships like Yamato and Iowa from ever being added due to them supposedly not fitting the warthunder format.
Obviously, market and demand changed over the time, so they adapted with their supply.
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There was advanced game-mode test where CAS costed more than 1000 SP and one team was defending while other was attacking.
There was no issue with “stalemate” even as the mode nature suggested that something like that would happen.
People don’t need CAS.
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None of those need CAS to counter.
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there is no reason why it should be too late for a tank-only gamemode
once again youre showing that you would post anything because youre terrified of having less bugs to squash with your CAS.
and since you love to fail to interpret whats being said, i didnt mean to say that all ground players will migrate to TO and mixed battles will die.
and in case it did happen, it would confirm the obvious, which is that a majority of ground players dont give a shit about CAS or related gameplay features
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Going by that logic . . .
You can theoretically shoot down any WW2 plane with a roof mounted machine gun, so SPAA is unnecessary.
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Oh dont get me wrong.
Im holding a position that CAS can clear a position more effectively and faster than tank, but I doubt that theres single position on all of the maps in game that can be cleared with help of CAS only (or rather, that CAS is neccesary) as An Pigeon claimed.
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I never explicitly stated with cas only.
I stated that several maps would need an overhaul due to inherently over power positions which CAS is used to remove them.
Wording is everything.
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