Ho229 V3 engine thrust and handling issues have not been solved, and now face F86A and mig15? Looks like it's time for me to give up ho229 and give up WT

Machinery of War Discussion Aircraft
47

While that’s true, AFAIK the source for the Ki-43-III Otsu having a 1500hp engine to begin with is Francillion’s book, which is full of errors and is widely regarded as a pretty bad source.

That book itself doesn’t actually claim 1500hp either, it claims it used the Ha-112 but not its power output:

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Which would line up perfectly with the Ha-115-II (that it now has in-game) that added water injection to greatly extend WEP time when compared to earlier Ki-43s.
I believe that’s just a simple typo and everything except the engine name itself says that’s a Ha-115, not the more powerful 112.

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48

That is exactly what I referred to by “untrustworthy secondary source”. These numbers do make sense (that it isn’t what it’s named).

49

Oh, ok. I thought you were saying that the change to the Ha-115 and subsequent engine nerf was what came from an untrustworthy source? Bit of a miscommunication there.

51

I can only think that you have played ho229 a few times, faced a few players who are not familiar with F86 or mig15 and won, it is your luck rather than your skill, so you come to speak. Because you don’t seem to know what ho229 will drop speed, how long it takes to recover speed, and how to deal with F86/mig15 LOOP, if you can’t answer these three questions, please don’t deceive and mislead other people who have not played ho229, otherwise they will only regret after choosing to unlock ho229, thank you. Even though I’ve been playing ho229 for years, I didn’t feel like I could fight back against the F86 and mig15, on the contrary, what you said was so outrageous that I couldn’t believe it. Let me tell you something, when an F86 or mig15 only attacks you, there is no one to help you, most of the time you will only end up destroyed. So please prove that your statement is correct.

52

I haven’t paid attention to this post in a long time because I don’t think gaijin is going to correct their deliberate weakening, like I did when I answered the guy who only asked me to submit a bug report. You know, all he has to do to give advice is talk. However, any player who has played the ho229 should be able to feel the dive situation, the wing acceleration is slower than the ordinary other fighters of the same period, this situation how to submit an error report? Who accelerates faster in a real dive? Who has less resistance? Why does acceleration slow down dramatically or even stop, even in a near-vertical dive with horizontal motion? These are not my personal feelings ho229 is very slow, but in the game ho229 acceleration is really slow, diving situation is also far lower than the same level of jet fighters or propeller fighters, with the eye can see P51 Spitfire F2G and other jet fighters can easily dive quickly to reach the top speed. But the propeller fighter’s low speed segment is very flexible, so how do you submit a report? The purpose of my post is just to try to let gaijin pay attention to this issue and balance this issue. Of course, I also gave up, because I tried to take a screenshot in the test flight mode and reported it, but it didn’t work. It was just unfriendly to other people who like ho229.

Of course, I still welcome other friends who have played ho229 to discuss the current situation of ho229 games, as long as it is objective and true.

53

the 229 is a real plane its a prototype not a fake plane

54

Its not the 229 was never armed and has the wrong engines the plane is fake

55

So the Yak 141 is fake?

56

Uh no because we know what it was meant to be armed with and theres pictures of it carrying weapons it also obviously has a gun unlike the 229
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Until theres a picture of the 229 clearly armed with a 30mm and the engines it had ingame its fake

57

So just like the 229

Weapons that were non functional since it never received a radar to use them

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58

It is very much a real plane, and it isn’t unique in the fact that it didn’t use the armament it has in WT.

The actual V3 prototype still exists too.

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59

Still gonna ignore the engine part huh

Still recieved all of its weapons unlike the 229 which has nothing

60

It did not. It didn’t even receive its radar.

Engines are changed all the time in WT too, but it is still using Junkers 004s.

61

Player stats is public information. https://thunderskill.com/en/stat/RXDimA/vehicles/r
The Ho229 is my most played vehicle.

Maybe every single one of them I encountered is unfamiliar with fighting Hortens. Could be true.

Ever tried a gentle turn?

Try fighting with some alt. Convert alt into speed as needed.

Don’t be in one. Make them fight on YOUR terms, which is a turn fight that bleeds their energy more (hint: you can make it so you don’t have to pull 13g ALL the time).

When one attacks me I either kill it or force a stalemate.

Sure, I’ll play yet more games and post server replay links. An uptier with a sabre/mig15 attacking me from above is a fairly rare occurrence, so it may take a while to find that game (unless a friend uptiers me to 8.x which I take sometimes for fun).

Want another outrageous statement? I was overshooting an F104 once.

62

While it’s much better than a lot of novice ho229 players, your battles are still too few, and you won’t encounter F86 and mig15 every time, and your stats even include periods when you definitely won’t encounter F86/mig15. In addition, you did not directly answer these questions about ho229 that I raised. As I assumed, you are only a phased ho229 player, so it is easy to give the surprising conclusion that the ho229 can counter the two fighters of 8.0. The answer to the question was to treat me as a novice and even tell me not to pull the G limit, you have no idea that I have been playing ho229 for many years.

Let me give you the answer:

First, F86 and mig15 have absolute acceleration and ascent speed as well as better weapon trajectory. Using LOOP on ho229 will force ho229 to slow down every time it avoids downwards. ho229 can lose its due evasive speed within up to three cycles, especially the.50 trajectory of F86A, which is fast. Hit the ho229’s wooden body, which can easily destroy the aerodynamic layout.

Second, ho229 in terms of directivity, as long as the nose is not pointed straight ahead, even in the dive phase, as long as there is a little movement will lose the current speed/acceleration. Any horizontal and vertical maneuver will reduce the speed by 229, and it is not pulling out the limit G that will cause serious deceleration.

Third, the speed recovery time of the ho229 takes a long time, and it is almost impossible to escape the vast majority of fighters higher than their own 500m by accelerating in combat, in the case of flat speed acceleration.

Therefore, based on these, you do not understand why I often encounter F86 and mig15 chasing me, and naturally do not understand the pain of being crushed, which is not your fault, but you said that ho229 has the ability to fight back against F86 and mig15, and still does not have any strong support.

63

I mean, I’ve pretty little experience flying sabres in ASB and I find Hortons the easiest foes to fight in my sabre. You can just… climb away from them as they’re pitifully shooting towards you, stall them out like you were flying a bf109 and fall on top of them.

They’re massive and easy targets.

They’re far more menacing to my F2H-2 Banshee as I cannot just … climb away and drop on them repeatedly, but still not an impossible fight. The F2H-2 banshee is 8.0 in ASB

The Horton, for whatever absurd reason, is 7.7 in ASB.

It is BARELY 0.3 BR lower than the SAGGITARIO 2 which has amazing engine power and mobility on par with mig 15s. It is absurd

Most absurd part imo though remains the fact that the Horton, Banshee, Meteor and Me262, Shooting star in ASB has to fight A.I objectives (needed to win the game and useful to learn gunnery against safer targets) that fly at such speeds that a f86a5 8.7 sabre takes a good 2-3 minutes of chasing at 1080 km/h redline speed to even just barely catch.

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64

I treated you as a novice because you claimed loops are dangerous to a Horten, when they are not because a competent player would simply not follow those loops. There are better options to take in such situations.

The number of years you play something doesn’t necessarily mean you learned everything you could learn.

Why are you dodging downwards? Dodge to the sides.

Don’t get hit. You have the ability to dodge extremely well.

I can maintain decently high speeds with gentle turns, so I disagree. The energy retention is very good in turns below 7G.

Dodge.

I understand fairly well that you don’t know how to efficiently dodge, and how to use the strong points of your plane against enemy plane weaknesses.
With the same principle you can kill 5.x-6.x planes in a Ki-27 or F3F.

Spoiler

Have you ever tried giving just enough hope to someone on your six that they could hit you, but you manipulated your turn circle to be just within their turn circle? That is the main ingredient you need to take down faster, worse turning planes.

Horten’s turn radius is smaller than anything you will face. With that, you can have an enemy sabre/mig follow you while you stay safe. If the opponent is aggressive, you will both bleed speed and end up at a low speed state very close to each other, with overshoots being very common. You then proceed to run down the opponent.

Dodging efficiently: bank 90 degrees, then neg G gently. This will force a chasing opponent to roll 90 degrees the other way to take aiming lead. This results in a 180 degree bank difference between the two planes. At gun solution, if you pitch up, your lead position changes space very drastically, so your opponent needs to readjust aim. Only two options exist: 1) they neg G, but you’re pitching up (to the side), so they will never catch up. 2) they roll and then pitch up (to the side) after you. But the time it takes to roll 180 degrees lets you get a lot of position.

This kind of dodge can be chained into what I described earlier that causes an overshoot into your guns, if the enemy is aggressive, and minimal energy will be spent if they do not continue the attack after the initial dodge.

Try it. Don’t worry, I will get replays for you soon.

They may as well hold J if their objective is to kill themselves.

Yeah the BR numbers are all over the place. I think BRs in sim mode should represent what they would fight IRL in the same time period and not based on player stats.

65

I’m having no luck so far finding an uptier where the sabres/migs don’t suicide taking full commit headons with 262s, and the friend that usually uptiers me to sabreland isn’t playing at the moment. I will eventually get a game with 8.0s attacking me, but you’ll have to be patient. For the time being, take a look at this replay: replay link
It showcases the dodge and bait I described in the spoiler several times in the battle, against opponents starting with a higher energy state. Watch the replay from the perspective of the enemies attacking me.

66

Guy has 5.0 KDR in his 229, a straight up PRO

67

This is ridiculous, you need to look at your own remarks, what does it look like in the eyes of F86/mig15 drivers, your ho229 horizontal dodge 7G action can allow you to avoid F86/mig15 attacks? I can tell you directly that the only F86/mig15 driver you meet doesn’t even know how to shoot, and you probably don’t even know how many G’s the F86/mig15 can pull, which is why you have this illusion.

ho229 moves within 7G at 600km/h, and when it completes 360° rotation, it will drop to 500km/h. You underestimate the flexibility of F86, F84G and F2H fighters, and I have even gradually lost the desire to discuss with you.

The above can let other people see this post to judge for themselves. Finally, let me tell you what playing ho229 for a long time means. It means that I have changed from strange to familiar, then to bored, and then to try various operating methods, tactics and maneuvers. You just think ho229 can fight F86/MIG15, hopefully to make you look better than most players.

And I would like to say that in fact, there are many fighters of the same class that crush ho229, why single F86/mig15 two of them, because their high speed and flexibility is almost perfect, when ho229 avoid consuming speed, in the eyes of F86/mig15, ho229 is almost static (target is large and slow) so there you go, over time other players will understand what I’m talking about.

Stop being funny, okay