US 90mm M77 AP had
191mm @ 0m penetration at 822m/s
US 90mm T33 APBC is M77 AP with ballistic cap and better propellant giving the penetrator 853m/s muzzle velocity and the ballistic cap helped it to lose less speed over distance. Since it was reheated the penetrator deformed worse than Japanese AP rounds against thick flat armour and only achieved 165mm at 853m/s despite being M77 penetrator at higher velocity.
Despite this the T33 APBC at 55 degrees (angle at which non capped shells don’t deform) achieved penetration of 97mm at 55 degrees.
Using demarre equation…
If 90mm T33 APBC can penetrate 97mm at 55 degrees
75mm Tokku Kou can penetrate 84mm at 55 degrees (15.5% less penetration) but it’s enough to clap panthers 80mm at 55 degrees upper plate
So yes when gaijin fixes AP calculator the Chi-To will clap Panther upper plate at close range and the T33 APBC will clap Panther upper plate just over 1km
Okay, so what?
Just as i said, but it looks like you can not understand it, but penetration is not everything, will you finally understand it, or you have the brain of a wehraboo?
The Chi-To/Nu/Ri have no armor, bad mobility with huge silouette.
Just as i said, things like the Ikv 103, Sturer Emil, Conqueror are all bad/awful, despite them having really high pen/damage at lower BR.
Panzer IV have less armour and worse power to weight ratio and weaker guns compared to Chi-To
They themselves are under tiered and should be 4.0
But here we are asking to have Chi-To at 3.7/4.0 instead of fixing the core issues
Doing this fix wouldn’t just fix Chi-To, Chi-Ri and Chi-Nu II. It would fix all Japanese tanks shooting AP. Heck it would fix all US, UK tanks relying on AP as well.
Do you know how powerful the firefly would be with fixed AP?
You’ll be clapping Panther upper plate from 600m with it
It would buff the British tanks as well which is exactly what their mid tier tanks are desperate for right now as well, equally as Japan
PZ4H literaly have same or better frontal
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Panzer IV H / Chi-To late
50mm flat turret / 75mm turret (+15mm around gun)
80mm flat hull / 75mm hull at 36 degrees
Power to weight:
11.4hp per ton / 13.1hp per ton
Fixed Firepower:
55mm at 60 degrees / 70mm at 60 degrees
[Chi-To has 27.25% more penetration]
Panzer IV H in my opinion should be 4.3
Chi-To, being a better tank at higher BR
Once again people, please focus on the Ho-Ri’s…they’re the reason for this thread, and I want Gaijin to notice this glaring issue.
So good armor.
It is a bit better, yes, but i say like the 34523526267341234216th time, it is a MUCH BIGGER TARGET WITH AMMO IN THE TURRET.
Finally something we agree on.
The only AP that actually suffers are solidshot. Something japan does not use (except stock US tanks)
And the Panther would clap you back from 3km.
Or, they could just, ikd, give it the APDS it had?
The only problem for them is the lack of post pen damage (and you have not talked about that), and the trash APDS shattering mechanic.
When all AP is missing 25% penetration at 60 degrees in this game as well as missing at least 20mm vertical penetration and having higher bounce chance than APCR, that is the true major issue and it affects all AP rounds in this game including Ho-Ri.
Ho-Ri would be clapping T-55 upper plates…
If you shoot panzer IV in turret, he’s gun is gone. A defenceless dead meat with 3 dead crew members. Shooting Chi-To in the turret isn’t the best idea due to the troll cheeks being sloped at very high angle, people always prefer the hull armour shot.
Russians with the 76mm gun have much easier time killing panzer IV than chi-to late
Same can be said to the Panther vs the current Chi-To. But i guess you will invalidate this argument with a good “na-uh”.
It is called “skill issue”. Anything with higher pen than the US 75mm or the russian 76mm just lolpens the Chi-To ANYWHERE, and even the said lower pen guns pen a big chunk of it.
Having to aim at weakspot is more time the enemy has to respond and kill you first.
And yes current Chi-To suffers but I said that it would be fine at 5.0 if it was fixed.
Also as someone with over 3K/D with Chi-To at 4.7
To me anyone struggling with it has skill issue
Still the best thing to do is fix AP calculator.
If correctly performing Chi-To still suffers, sure downtier it but I think it would club after fix, at least I would be spanking seals
Ahm, dafuq.
So for a few very rare times when it can upper plate pen the the Panther, you would still aim for weak spots. You would aim for the EXACT SAME spot 99.9% of the time on 99.9% of the tanks.
I have seen many players with over 10 k/d, and still having skill isses…
So you even say you are a sealclubber. That explains a lot.
Personally tho Panther D should be 5.7 with the A/G at 6.0
I played those things back when T-34-85’s were lower BR than today and Panthers were 6.0/6.3BR
But just like with panzer vi’s, germantardism is an issue
Chi-To is not fucking better.
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Fixed Chi-To is a lot better than Panzer IV H and the fact you don’t understand that is all the more reason why gaijin should fix AP calculator.
They are literally making people believe that Chi-To was this bad in real life as it is in their pathetic Russian bias game
Dude, stop inhaling copium!
Please explain me the “russian bias”. Like really, i am curious.
You still havent prooved your numbers.
Chi-To isnt better. It has worse reload, worse turret traverse, its more cramped.
Well, you just signed yourself into pack of other delusional people
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I bet he sits in front of History Channel all day, and believes that the Tiger 1 was never penetrated frontally, and that it could win an 1v1 against any modern MBT most of the time.
You call yourself a Japanese main and you don’t even know the historical performance of Japanese tank guns.
Like you said yourself as well
Why does a specious Chi-To with lighter 6.6kg shells right in the turret have longer reload than Panzer IV with 6.8kg shells in the hull.
I think its reload should be 5.9 sec just like the rest of the 75-76.2mm armed tanks.
As for Russian bias, you clearly haven’t played top tier. The fact that all AP rounds are underperforming at 60 degrees and have absurd chance of bounce is another indirect buff to make T-34’s, T-44’s and T-54’s better than they should be.
Pfft even 2 pounder little John can penetrate Tiger I
…I cant say that i love pizza if i dont know how to make one?
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