I literally own the HO-RI Production, it’s not even close to a real tank, and takes up more grind time to progress through the tree. Yes, it should be removed not only because it’s a pain, but also because it’s a-historical.
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Hidden.
This is a very simple statement to answer->German mains are 99.9% consisting of dumb players. Who cannot learn for life, and 0.1% of good players. Who are often from other nations. Within the smaller trees
Fighting US tanks is harder, since the T-26 and all it’s variant are harder since you can’t pen a Jumbo Perching.
The US does not own a Soviet T-26 light tank, and that would easily be killed by a Ho-Ri. With little to no effort.
T26->Jumbo Pershing. Ho-Ri has no issue engaging and killing.
If you know where to aim, you would have 0 issue.
This is true; it does, however, neglect that many experienced players know that the side cheeks are the weakness.
As someone who plays both the Ho-Ri Production and Ho-Ri Prototype.
At 7.0, it was in a good position. At a lower rating, often people figured out quickly how to combat them.
The Prototype has a worse-performing shell and armor struggles. At a downtier, she is still incredibly good, though she has some vehicles able to easily kill her, while others need to coordinate and hit the weak spots.
So in terms of downtiering.
6.3->Prototype. 7.0->Production.
Gaijin purposely changed their ranking because people kept firing center mass and complained.
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This saw limited service, just not as a full vehicle.
HEAT kills 1-2 crew. APHE can one shot you. You should be immune to nearly every APHE except at close range. When you take that away, you lose most of the advantage your vehicle has. Its obviously a bug, but one that has been in the game for a very long time and we don’t have enough data to detail why its happening. I suspect its due to the number of surfaces penetrated confusing the game to the point it stops running calculations.
Is this TIGER_TANK_1’s alt?
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only advantage I have in the Jagd is the 128
and even that is a trade off, you get better pen for twice as long reload
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LMAO, wverything bounces a lot at extreme angles.
Uncapped = less BS shots, but noticeably bettwr performance with well aimed shots.
Jadg is generally poor. It can barely move and is incredibly prone to problems if losing even 1 crew. Lose a loader and some tanks can repair before you can reload. There is a reason you rarely see one get more than 3 kills. And the MG port renders a lot of the armor meaningless vs any sort of competent player.
while the ho-ri has that weak point in the engine exhaust, most people don’t know it and its not an obvious weak point. LFP hits only have 2 crew to kill and your 5 additional mean you are able to brawl with some of the best of tanks. Your huge engine power means even losing a track isn’t a kill because you can turn so fast with 1 track compared to every other fixed arc td.
How the hell do people complain about japan not being good? You have the sta-1 and 2 which are utterly absurd for their br. They are essentially M26s at 2 brs lower. You have the sub-I-II which is one of the best AA until you get to 7.3. You have the ho-ri giving you the best 7.3 lineup with only the US’s T32 being a contender at that br. And yeah, they have big gaps in their lineups, but thats not unique. Better than the major nations who have 4+ filler vehicles in many br ranges that are nearly unisable, but still needed to research to progress.
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It’s 200mm flat. What tank at 7.3 cannot pen that?
Even down at 6.7 it’s not hard to find tanks in every tree that will go through it.
Worst of all, the transmission armor is flat 120mm.
You can shoot back, you know?
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… then don’t make it flat? You have great gun depression and have a good horizontal traverse. You want to be engaging at distance, meaning you can easily get your armor over a 240mm effective.
Nearly every lfp in this game is a weak point. That transmission has only 2 crew behind it and a huge distance from there to any of the gunning crew, meaning APHE rarely splashes your firing capabiility.
That point you are highlighting has a good chance of killing only 2-3 crew, won’t OHK your tank, doesn’t disable your mobility, and has a chance of not disabling your firing capability. Every tank has weak points, but when your weak points are 2-3 hit kills its not really a great weak point.
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-10 is only when looking forward, near the sides there is significantly less.
just 10 degrees to either side, it is the same as Jagdtiger. And when you angle, the corners of the lower hull become a very easy way to take out the driver and engine.
It completely and immediately immobilizes the tank (unlike an engine or track loss), and since it does not have a turret it is defenseless if you simply move a little.
Jagdtiger LFP is ~240mm against itself.
If you shoot the gunner side, it will disable the ability to fire every time. The rest is typical for almost every vehicle.
Shooting a Tiger II in the turret face, even if you wipe the turret crew, will not kill it. Regardless, it is the most common weakspot being flat 185mm. This is very similar to the Ho-Ri. It is also extremely weak to the various howitzers since Gaijin has decided the engine and crew compartments are the same, causing total loss of the crew. Shells also often bounce from the UFP and hit the barrel, destroying it.
Just because you do not know how and where to shoot it, does not make it OP.
Ho-Ri Prototype is in a much worse situation, as at 6.7 its frontal armor is only 150mm flat at most; the transmission cover is now 75mm and the superstructure 120mm.
You can find similar armor and cannon on the 6.0 SU-100, with the additional advantage of being smaller than a house.
Nah, Ho-ri prod. is fine. Just recently leveled it
What surprises me that Type 99 and Ho-ri at same BR. One is useless carton box and another is armored nuke-farming monster
nearly no fixed arc tank destroyers get 10 degrees without being open topped
if they are shooting your engine and you are shooting them back, you are winning.
Congrats, you have found the weakness of fixed arc design. Do you need any other basic lessons?
200g APHE can reach the hull crew in a KT. Also, you have the MG port on both the KT and JT that are both weaker than the gunner area of the Ho-ri prod and literally everyone up to this point has learned to shoot the MG port if you can’t pen somewhere else reliably.
turns out, gaslighting doesn’t make a good argument. You are the one having a hard time making one of the best vehicles at the BR work, not me. i’m at a 3kdr while driving it rather agressively.
@xStep31 until recently, the type 99 was actually reasonable. It had the highest velocity 155 you could get at 7.3 and was a great AA. I had a game with 7 air kills. They keep adding better and better arty to 6.7 and 7.0 though, which is making it harder and harder to justify 7.3
Just a quick comparison.
Yes, it doesn’t go through in both cases. But Japanese gun does significantly better vs angled so quite a few “sub-optimal” shots may go through thanks to this feature. Problem is, it bleeds penetration quite quickly and at extreme angles it fails earlier.
Which causes some super annoying bounces.
But overal it’s nowhere near as bad as people claim.
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Jagdtiger (+/-10deg), T28/T95 (+10/-11deg), Ferdinand (+/- 14deg), Jagdpanther (+/-11deg), Pz IV/70 (+/-12deg), Tortoise (+/-20deg)
In fact the only two casemates anywhere near the Ho-Ri I could find with worse traverse arcs are the SU-100P and AMX-50 Foch, at +/-8 and 9deg respectively. So you’re just wrong lol
So don’t get shot by the casemate TD with restrictive gun angles? Just like with a Jagdtiger, except you can disable it much more easily? Or you know, just shoot the gunner since he is protected by just 200mm of flat armor.
And it can also reach all the crew in the Ho-Ri’s fighting compartment too.
If the Tiger II is the shooter instead, it won’t reach its own hull crew and must wait for the gunner to be replaced to get the kill, unless it gets a lucky ammo hit. Against the Ho-Ri it will easily take out the Ho-Ri’s gunner and at least one of the loaders, the next shot can immobilize it through the transmission, killing the driver. This leaves it completely immobile, and with a maximum of 3 crew left. A shot to the commander side, if the gunner has not been replaced, will then kill it.
The MG port is incredibly unreliable and won’t disable the gunner reliably.
That’s cute. Here’s mine:
But unlike you, I can recognize that I only get this many kills because people have no idea where to shoot a Ho-Ri, and you can just drive in recklessly knowing they will amost certainly mess up their shots. Regardless of stats it’s not 7.3 material, and the Prototype should be down at 6.0.
So true! We need more copy slop! I love playing the same vehicles! All nations except Germany, USA and USSR should lose all identity!
I agree they should go down, but Japanese pay a heavy BR toll for skill so this won’t happen. Best hope is that they do some serious decompression from WW2 to CW tiers.
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The thing is Japan doesn’t have copy paste vehicles…
I guess it’s not as egregious as some nations, but the late-war options for Japan are a few unless you delve into the prototype territory. Would much rather take unique WW2 tanks than the chaffee or the sherman or CW vehicles.
The air tree past WW2 is pretty bad, though, and they made it even worse by replacing the R2Y2s with a Thai American export.