I hardly find a single jet to be an issue - at least in GRB.
Only good turnfighters (that insantly kill me), IRCCM missile spammers (like the Bison, Mirage 2K or F1C), or maybe the ARH missile slingers that are at 11.7. But I rarely see them for some reason.
The other ones that require boom & zoom tactic hardley works to prevent me from continuing to ground pound.
Since by the time they turned around, I have already turned around and shooting Kh-25ML / Vikhirs at tanks, while being separated by around 6km.
I think the best way to tell is by playing it yourself.
You need to realize that with every zoom he has a clear shot on you and if he plays it decently you can’t reciprocate.
They can see you turning around meaning they’ll turn as well. They don’t even need to go as far as 6km away, as R-73’s effective range is far less than that, especially in all-aspect shots.
The problem isn’t in the maneuverability, it’s in the arcadey controls that are offered. With mouse control and all assists on you can do UFO like moves, drop your altitude almost like a stone in freefall and do loops.
Try all these with realistic controls and you quickly realize that you cannot perform them.
The best fix instead of increasing BR is to tune down assist’s ability to fly like an UFO.
This is big issue. In reality SPAA cannot even always see low flying plane or big drone and in WT it can spot helicopter that is actually covered by trees and shoot it.
I know that rotating rotor has a big radar signature but trees should give a lot interference.
There’s reason why IRL having radar/optics on the top of the helicopter or rotor is advantage. In WT it’s useless feature.
A clear shot while I’m going 900km/h and they have a crappier airframe?
I get the A-10, but the Su-25 is harder to hit if played right.
Though I’m not saying that it’s extremely hard to hit it either.
The Su-25 can bait you into turning in, but cause a head-on situation (which the Su-25 is generally better at dealing it), or wait until the Su-25 completetly turns, which then wastes position for the boom&zoomer.
I have done that quite a few times, and I haven’t really seen anybody find a way around it.
Sure. I’d say 5km is enough, though it’s better to be safe than sorry considering you don’t know the exact distance the Su-25 is behind you.
I can’t show you since it’s a clip from a while back (probably 6 months ago).
Do people even check if they’re right nowadays instead of spewing baseless pretenses?
You can easily check it out for yourself that you can shoot up to 8 at a time in the test drive of either the Ka-50 or Ka-52:
Why should I bother talking to you about balance when you don’t even know the basics of your own helicopter, let alone others?
I’m not quite sure if that’s an issue against all SPAA, but I do know for a fact that the Pantsir’s radar can fairly easily track helicopters through trees.
Hence why I believe the Tiger UHT should be 0.3 BR lower than the other F&Fs helicopters, along with the fact it doesn’t have a gun nor better AAMs.
I’ve slightly over exaggerated that, it’s not that easy but still, you’re a big target and a relatively slow one.
Also, as I said earlier, he doesn’t need to outright split your plane in half, as damage to your control surfaces will make you lose a lot of performance.
He can bait as well.
If you aren’t stalling it’s very hard to die to R-73 beyond 2km, that is if you have a key bound for flares.
Sure though when has that not been the case for other aircraft?
The only way I could think someone could bait is by flying side to side from 4/5km out and wait for me to either keep going for him or turn into the battlefield.
Ultimately, though, I get to choose how to go about it, and the F-4S only is able to respond.
If I choose to keep following him, he’d have to continue running away to avoid the head-on.
If I choose to go to the battlefield, we both probably would’ve turned around near the same time, although the F-4S must respond to me fully commiting to go back.
Then I can immediately start shooting off Kh-25MLs or Vikhirs (as long as I am not outside of 10km from the ground map), whereas the F-4S, for example, needs to get within 1km to effectively shoot me down with his guns.
It could launch its SARH missiles, but won’t really help if the SU-25 uses multipathing, especially on a flat map like Fulda or Maginot Line.
Since the F-4S’s airframe generally lacks more in energy retention than the SU-25, but has much more powerful engines. I’d say it would go from 1200km/h to 1100km/h after the 90 degree turn.
I’ll assume that they both are carrying their full ordnance.
It takes around 20s for a Kh-25ML to hit a target at around 9km when the Su-25 is going around 800km/h (as a result of the turning), so the F-4S must take around <19s to get to <1km (from 4km/5km) of the Su-25 to stop it from ground-pounding unscathed.
I can’t say for sure, as I can’t be bothered to do maths at the moment, and the site for comparing different aircraft to one another doesn’t have that type of feature from what I know of.
But it’s iffy on whether or not it could intercept it consistently, if at all.
I could see that, though from my testing, as long as the Su-25T manages to get behind you (while going at least 900km), and the F-4S is going 1200km/h (a bit slower than his usual on-the-deck top speed due to trying to aim the guns and bleeding speed as a result), then you can expect the R-73 to hit from around 2.3km from initial launch:
Though it’s probably closer to 1.8km/2.1km since it doesn’t account the acceleration of both aircraft (from what I can tell).
The F-4S doesn’t really like going past 1200km/h, so within that ~10s timeframe, it would get to around 1300km/h:
Since R-73 is a missile with narrowing FOV IRCCM, the further a target is, the worse its ability to keep on target. However, for the F-4S to manage to properly shake it off, it needs to get its flares in front of the engine, which requires precise maneuvers, which is not ideal when you need your speed to also bleed out the energy of the missile in case they fail to do so (which I’d say is not that difficult to mess up).
I’d say if you miss your initial boom, and then zoom away, there’s a pretty good chance that the Su-25 can get behind you and launch an R-73 within ~2km of the F-4S.
All aircraft can suffer damage, but some are smaller and/or faster which will help them in that regard.
Some other aircraft don’t need to loiter around the battlefield for half a game just to spend all of their ordnance, which will decrease the chance of getting attacked.
How viable is it to guide a missile while multipathing ?
Lower to the ground you are, the less of an angle you have on ground units, at least on most maps.
How much time does it take for Vikhrs ?
I guess we can’t have a definite answer as the incoming angle of the attacking aircraft plays a big role.
From my experience, I had very mixed results at 2km or above even when our speeds were pretty on par.
Especially when it’s launched from a pretty big angle.
I guess it depends on the angle.
If he attacks from the side he can turn slightly away from you after he shoots while losing minimal speed.
This will make you turn more than just 90 degrees if he just went straight.
Depends on the map, like you and I said, and on whether or not you know where the target is.
If you don’t, you kinda have to guess where they would be and pop up once your missile is about to impact.
If you do know, this task is much easier.
Chaff can help at times, but it’s much less useful when the F-4S is directly behind you, since it has a PD radar.
Around 20s too.
It has slightly worse top speed than the Kh-25ML, but it seems to stay at relatively high speeds in general.
Also, here’s another instance of unaware players against Vikhirs in a head-on:
Note that Vikhirs are mostly smokeless, so it’s quite hard to notice them until it’s either too late, or you have had that happen multiple times before and know what the Su-25 is about to do.
Well, in the initial encounter, sure.
But after that, this situation will happen:
And in that case the angle of attack of the attacking aircraft is almost always right behind the SU-25T, or maybe right in front of it (if it chooses to head-on).
You used the R-73 with the Su-25?
Or are you talking more about other aircraft with the R-73?
Do note that if it’s the latter, the higher tier aircraft have much better acceleration and top speed (on the deck) than the F-4S.
If it were launched from a pretty big angle, I would agree that it would have less energy to hit the aircraft, if the aircraft were at the same place as if it were not shot off-bore.
But if you do that, that simply gives less separation distance for the F-4S, and is probably more like 1.5km instead of 2km, so it would probably hit even more often.
True, though that’s probably only the case in the initial attack, and rarely after.
Head-on is also a big possibility, especially if it’s a SU-39 using its TWS.
If the Su-25T/Su-39 notices you (either by their own Radar or RWR), then they can just align themselves such that they’re in a position to easily reverse the F-4S too.
What are you trying to say here?
I’ve already shown you that you can shoot up to 8 at a time, within a 3s window.
And that’s what the person in the video did.
Seems pretty challenging to me, especially on some maps that aren’t very flat.
Just 10.3 premium things.
I don’t think it has to come from a perfect “behind” angle.
It was the latter yeah, but difference in our speed has been pretty small and we were already going pretty fast to begin with, so I doubt anything will have that much acceleration.
Well, most of the time there’s hit markers on enemies in almost any given time, so finding enemies to kill isn’t usually that hard.
Well, if it wants to chase the Su-25T to prevent it from doing CAS, then it must do it in the least amount of time possible, which is by going perfectly behind him (since he turned a 180 and now is shooting Kh-25MLs / Vikhirs to the ground map, and that’s the shortest path possible).
Fair enough.
But if you are willing to grind for the Su-25T, or already have it but haven’t bothered spading it, then we could play some games if you’d like.
