Well, it would really be against the Sherman 76, M50, M51, AMX-13 and Centurion Mk3, since those Pz4s (and stug 3s) were used in the Six Days’ War, in static positions in the Golan Heights, due to the fact that they were very outdated.
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Which is why T-34s and AML-90s are not at the same BR in War Thunder; or Pz IV Js and Centurions. It doesn’t matter if and when they faced each other in real life, the capability gap between them is huge, and this is reflected in the game by assigning them to completely different brackets.
The same logic applies to other vehicles that fought each other historically. The Pz38t and the KV-1 will not see one another in WT even if they did in real life.
The logic extends to the opposite scenario as well. Tanks that never fought in real life can absolutely meet in the game if their performance is broadly similar.
It does not, as Aegis has shown you with actual statistics from the performance of the playerbase.
WT is not real life, where one penetration usually ends the fight. We fight at much faster pace than regular combat, with much greater situational awareness, and the absurd post-pen of APHE makes it the meta round in a way that HEAT-FS simply can’t match.
I’ve made this example before in an anecdotal way as well. If I’m playing German 6.7, it’s very rare that I’ll use the M41 as my first vehicle of choice. Only in some very specific situations. And my stats in it are much worse than my stats in the Tiger IIs. Makes you wonder…
And they have an incredibly hard time pushing objectives for that same reason. They have to play as support vehicles most of the time. Which is a big drawback, because in WT if you want something done right you usually have to do it yourself.
Welcome to the War Thunder meta. To win, you need to contest objectives. Even if you’re playing a support flanker/sniper, the nature of the maps is such that you will eventually have to expose yourself in order to achieve anything - whether it’s to avoid planes, or to decap - and even if you don’t, the enemy gets a vote in everything you do. For example, one of my favourite opening strategies with the Tiger II is to play it like an anti-flanker at the beginning of the match. Why? Because I’m forcing the light vehicles in the very kind of frontal engagement they wanted to avoid by flanking, and if I win that engagement, I in turn can then exploit the flank, which thanks to APHE and the good reload of the long 88, can yield spectacular results.
So even if the light tank player wanted to “play correctly” and avoid going toe to toe with a heavy directly, I would be trying to force their hand and not make them engage on their terms.
And that sounds like a small difference to you? That’s exactly what your heavy armour is for. You can push. If you do it in an EBR, you die.
Yep. Survivability onion applies to all tanks. But having that extra layer is forgiving of mistakes for sure.
Pretty much the first requirement to have something similar to historical-oriented BRs in WT would be to nerf APHE into the ground. If that change went through, BRs in the game would look very different. Whether for better or worse I don’t necessarily know.
Honestly, the problem with these asymmetries is that controlling human behaviour is very difficult. Most people won’t bother with anything but the path of least resistance and they’ll just play the stuff that’s good right off the gate.
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which would only make more fun. As now you cant balance heavy tanks to get shotted to weakspots. So all of them move higher, making armor even less valuable.
I feel like it would depend very heavily on the heavy tank in question. Heavies that are penned through “scummy” spots like Tutels or IS-4s, yes, you’re right. Heavies that you can reliably disable even with less post pen like the IS-2 would not go up tho. Especially with their offensive potential getting a nerf.
It would touch ALL of them anyway anyhow. Even tiger 1s which are easilly destroyed with 130 pen munition, when they get downtiered they meet pretty weak opponents which survive basically on sideshots and weakspots.
they were used in mobile warfare in six days, yon kimpur they were used as static positions. also it’s not just that since the Israelis had the early Magachs (m48a1 and m48a2s) and the sho’t meteor is centurion with a 105mm cannon with the only ones with that in game being the 10, kal series, and strv104 and 105. WT also throws all nations in together so M60 would be an opponent with the US having it in 1960, the Russians had the T-62 fielded with it’s prototype the Obj 140 being tested in the late 50s with the T-64, French had the AMX-30, brits would have the cheiftains mk1 and mk2, italy would piggyback off of germany and the US, Japan would have the type 61 series and I’m not sure about China. Your allies at the time period would be leopard 1 and the MBT-70 program of which the US also gets.
I think of it like this.
Sure, it might give you the “lucky” bounce but the armor gives you more options. It allows you to push more tanks than the average medium/light.
Lets say there is a panzer4 holding a corner. You cant push him in your sherman or cromwell. But your t14 or churchill mk7 can.
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In any case, the use of those Pz4s was quite limited, as they were rather obsolete, but of course, when there was nothing else available, they were used. This has happened to countless obsolete vehicles in countries with limited military resources.
Another interesting fact: Iraq used the M36 in the Gulf War (1991). I don’t think that means it will have to face the Challenger 1 and M1A1 in the game.
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This is 100% correct. A lot of fighting in WT eventually comes down to holding corners, because that’s just how the map design works. And usually the person whose team has the objective has less reason to force the opponent’s hand, but just as often you’ll be in a situation where you need to push that corner - because your tickets are being drained, or because you hear another enemy engine on the way, etc. And those situations are what heavies are for.
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More i play the more i see the RNG. The t114 only has HEAT and every shot is a random event.
Solid shot GB made me stop.playing ground for a year… the HEAT rounds are even worse!
Like someone said earlier AP rounds take 2- 3 shots in the same place for it to be a kill. HEAT 1, 2, 3, pick a number.
Meanwhile APHE= 1
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The AML 90, from what I’ve read, was designed in the 50s and entered service in 1961.
Yup, there is a good reason people in the m36 main the APHE amd not the HEATFS
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Indeed
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What?
Because they were used in the 50s by Israel
Syrians used pz 4 and jagpanzer 4 on the six days war
Well “era” isn’t based on when vehicles were last used - out of necessity - even if Gaijin actually adopted an era method instead of balanced method.
99% of the Pz 4s were used in the 1940s, so they would never meet the vehicles you mentioned in an era based format.
Theres 1 good youtuber who has every premium and most reward vics in the game, he only recomends like 3 premiuns throughout and thats it… I should of listened :(
Na, T114 is enjoyable and the 7.7 lineup is nice.
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What you running with it?
I looked at the 7.3s and 7.7s and its just more of the same but with rangfinders