Ground RB, one spawn only - Game mode suggestion

Tldr: More strategy, less abuse, better map inclusion/more tactics, more suited to the current pace of Ground RB, little draw bags.

❗Disclaimer❗ I dont want this game mode to replace the current Ground RB. Rather, this game mode should be considered as an addition, that works as the annaloug to Air RB. You would then have another combined forces game mode which woule either me the current Ground RB or a variation of it sitting right in between.

There have been a lot of desires and discussions about a ground RB game mode without CAS, as the combined game mode in its current form has quite a lot of issues related to CAS.
Therefor, I would propose a new game mode and that ground only but with a twist: one spawn per match only.

What’s the big difference?

Having only one spawn essentially makes the game mode a team death match. There are surely different ways such a game can be decided, like secondary objectives or simply time running out, in which cases the ticket bleed would decide the outcome of the match, but in most cases the games are decided by which side has in the end players left.

This has been the case for Air RB, pretty much as long as the game mode exists, and there it is way more tricky since not every aircraft is specialist in downing other aircraft. As such, bombers and ground attackers, whose roles it is to focus on secondary objectives, are in a pickle and as a consequence the game mode has struggled with this situation for quite some time. That is the primary much the reason, why we don’t have bombers in higher BR Air RB game but then again, we don’t have this issue with tanks.

Potential draw bags

  • SPAAs: Just like in Air RB, there are types of tanks that aren’t designed to kill other tanks. Most prominently anti-air-vehicles. For them, it would actually be difficult to find a good spot in this game mode. One solution would be the inclusion of helicopters, but this is only viable for higher BR games.
    In lower BR games, SPAAs usually have some capabilities of killing other vehicles. And it would be feasible to add spotting and support mechanics to them. There is also the option for AI CAS


  • Realism: I know this is far stretch, as the setup for tank engagements in game isn’t really realistic in the first place. Nonetheless, actual tank engagements are usually quite short-lived, as there are rarely backup tanks waiting at some magical point until their first comrades get killed.
  • Easier map design: The maps we currently have for Ground RB are largely unsuited. The simple reason is, that they are too small for prolonged engagements. Sooner or later, you are going to face spawn pushing (The type of spawn camping, where you end up at the spawn simply because you couldn’t engage the enemy any differently). This isn’t helped with some map variations, where the capture points are literally inside the enemy’s spawn.
  • No crew lock, no players leaving prematurely: If you can’t respawn, you can’t rage-quit. Teams would lose because they actually play worse and not because people get tilted.
  • No spawn camping: Also pretty self-explanatory but with the added benefit of:
  • More available tactics: With no respawns you not only eliminate spawn camping, rushing and pushing, but you can actually use the map area more effectively. You can drive through the enemies spawn area to ambush them from behind without fearing to get highlighted on the map or be shot yourself from a respawning player. In addition, you can actually effectively flank people in entrenched positions without spawn pushing or the need for CAS.
  • No CAS: The reason for this game mode in the first place. To comment on CAS itself, it per nature unbalanced. Contrary to the common analogy of rock-paper-scissors, you don’t have a perfect engagement triangle. Tanks aren’t only countered by ground-attackers but also other tanks, while aircraft themselves usually face little opposition at all. It would work way better if you’d actually have an entire air match going on, on the same map somewhere else and some pivoting between these two areas of conflict but that’s a topic for a whole another discussion in itself.
    Since it’s not uncommon to have tank engagements IRL that didn’t have the benefit of CAS, it’s not like this game mode couldn’t work because tanks can’t fight without aircraft support.


Why helicopters in a ground only game mode, you might ask. Well, cause I argue that helicopters deployed for tank combat, are the extension of ATGM-cariers. In those cases they play more like tanks as they have to use the environment to be effective, like tree lines, ridges and other obstacles, to not get shot down.
Helicopter rushing wouldn’t work as it’s not an effective tactic to take out the enemy team. Again, you can’t respawn afterward, and you probably get shot down more often than to have a significant effect on your team on the battlefield.

What about long range ATGMs if there’s no AAA? ⇒ long range AI-AAA, that force helicopters to stay low.


Technically, you don’t need it. The only reason why this would be useful, is to give AAA an actual objective. In that case, it could work something like this:
Shoot down air-superiority-fighters so that your team can call in AI-CAS. AI-CAS would have a limited use and couldn’t be used to obliterate the enemy team. More for clearing out some strategic positions.


In contrast to Air RB it would be important to spawn with a lineup simply to pivot between the type of vehicle you are going to spawn based on the map.


No thanks. I appreciate your attempt here but this has been tried previously, and camping becomes a major problem. If you want a tank-only game mode to get away from CAS, petition the devs for a separate tank-only game mode and a CAS-enabled mode: Would you play a tank only mode? How do you feel about CAS in ground battles? [(POLL)] - #9 by Richardguy

When has this been tried previously? I also don’t understand how camping becomes worse.
Just removing CAS from Ground RB will leave a lot of problems remaining, especially these related to camping.
I know this is all theory, but there are enough other shooters that don’t allow respawning, mostly tactical shooters like Rainbow or CS:GO.

This is going back several years but there was a permadeath mode tested at one time; you’ll have to ask a veteran what it was called because I didn’t pay attention.

Sounded good until we got to having helicopters. You lost me there. Helicopters aren’t implemented well, imho. I’ve also seen days where a single helicopter knocked out half a team. I’m already sick of being attacked by a helicopter so distant that it’s just a dot in the sky near the ground, further away than I am even allowed to drive my tank.

On second thought, though, maybe your mode idea could be a replacement for the current “Helicopter only” mode? I haven’t heard anyone singing any praises for that mode.

Back in the day it was pretty much a one spawn thing if you died early unless you were able to get some points, which was a bit annoying when people rushed a spawnzone and denied other people the SP, luckily Gaijin resolved that by wasting everyone’s time when you share a cap now at least.

It’s awful, the original mode where you had to capture airfields was (though also bad) way better. I think the real problem with helicopters is the lack of a real counter. We see with the current war in Ukraine that you can’t be flying high up and killing tanks left and right. Most anti tank helicopter weapons have been designed to be used like ATGM carriers, hide behind cover and shoot at inauspicious targets - when used correctly, very effective but one mistake and you’re dead.
The real problem is, that you don’t have good enough anti-air, and especially it’s play dependent so it’s not necessarily up all the time.

In current Ground RB it’s probably difficult to implement long range AAA, since it would probably be too hard for aircrafts, but since you don’t have aircrafts in this game mode, this could be considered. Something like the patriot system or comparable.

I support everyone who invests time and brainpower trying to change things that bothers him and others.

From my point of view you might think about your proposal from the point of view of your 2 main customers:

A) Your fellow players
B) Gaijin

A. Your fellow players

The position of your fellow players is known for years, some would like to have alternative modes or changes, others not. But more or less all people see changes mainly as a threat as they create the need to adapt – and the majority simply rejects any changes if they have to change their habits.

Your proposal does not include possibilities to switch vehicles in order to react on changing threats or just to use already existing line-ups within the player base - this flexibility is imho the major strength of Ground RB.

So without giving them a chance to use their line-ups by creating a switch area or function which allows them to use these vehicles after a certain score (aka spawn points) you take away their flexibility and the major strength. I mean some guys have played for years to have full line-ups for all BRs with crew levels of 150 - as they are over-represented in this forum you need their support for any changes or new modes.

In addition you should consider that a hell of veterans have adapted to the current mode and have no problems to earn enough spawn points in order to spawn in a plane and bomb the hell out of your team, so your goal for them should be the focus on realism (one game, one life) and to sell this as a challenge for experienced players. I mean it is obvious that you can dominate Ground RB as an experienced pilot whilst being a mediocre tanker…

B. Gaijin

In order to convince gaijin to add a new game mode you need to 2 things:

a) significant player demands
b) a positive business case

So in order to create or address the demand you need to convince your fellow players (as shown above) to express this need and you should create a positive business case.

If you try to see the benefits of the current Ground RB game play, there is no actual need to change anything. The possibility to die multiple times in a single match increases total repair cost, slows down the game progress due to lower net profits and support the sales of op premium vehicles or simply premium time.

So your main strategy should be to convince them that this new mode has no negative impact or at least a non-cannibalism effect vs already implemented modes as they still can sell their stuff.

Therefore you have to add a possibility that players still can use their very expensive CAS premium jets, a certain score/spawn point requirement to switch in a safe zone into a plane is a must-have, otherwise it won’t be even considered - even if you have proven that there is a significant demand in the player base.

Have in mind that their mantra (“Combined Arms belongs to Ground RB”) can also be seen as a simple strawman argument - irl CAS was useless against heavy armor until guided missiles and guided bombs were implented - besides the few exceptions in WW2.

So the current frustration regarding CAS is simply based on the way gaijin decided to make planes usable in a video game and has (at least for dumb bombs, rockets and cannons) nothing to do with a realistic game play.

Sorry for the long text, but this stuff is way more complicated that it looks.

Anyway I wish you and others trying to change anything good luck!

Have a good one!

PS: If you are not bored to death, i created some time ago a post about "“one game, one life” in Ground RB, if you think about an adjustment of your proposal it might be helpful.


I know it is hard trying to think “outside the box” if you guys are used to play Ground RB like it is for ages. But as an interested 3rd party reader of Ground RB stuff for years now - i do not see any progress in this and similar discussions. Basically all major discussions like ODL. TO mode or CAS cover the issue of multiple spawns (and deaths and repair cost), direct or indirect.

Have you guys ever thought about that maybe your game mode “Ground RB” is flawed?

I mean for Arcade modes multiple spawn makes kind of sense, but where is the “realistic” part of your game play if you got multiple times killed?

Basically Ground RB is Arcade+ as you fight a war of attrition until your or the enemy team run out of spawn points. I watched hundreds of vids and replays the last 5 years - and the majority showed similar flaws with imbalanced vehicles, mm, some vehicles buffed and others nerfed, but you always accept the loss of one life in order to spawn a plane or chopper with the hope that you can kill enough enemies in order to afford a “new” spawn. Recently i read that somebody was killed 3 times in a row by the same guy (who died 3 times too). I mean you literally buy your right to use an alternative vehicle with your death and related repair cost…

From my pov (Air RB only player - unbiased view) only 2 parties benefit currently from multiple deaths/spawns only after getting killed:

A) long term above average players able to score and able to gain a net profit even if killed multiple times

B) gaijin - as a war of attrition results in multiple deaths and multiple repair cost for most players - and slows down progress…

So it might be the time to think about alternative modes being more realistic (one life only) but still have a kind of flexibility regarding the possible usage of multiple vehicles in the same match, but simply without dying and/or paying multiple time repair cost.

So before a “Jehova! Jehova!” rain of stones will kill me, just think about alternatives…

Heated debates about points players can’t change are kind of entertaining, but not effective.

Sounds good, but im not sure about AI CAS.

In Assault Arcade (Ground) the AI CAS is very strong, and has 100% accuracy. It would be better if it had less accuraccy, but then it may not work properly, and it will either completly miss by a long shot, or hit directly on you. I dont think that would feel right, so i’m suggesting just to get rid of CAS completly and not replace it with AI CAS, and get rid of SPAA too, since it’d be useles.

Otherwise, pretty good suggestion

I mean, you will always face the issue of how to balance AI, it’s either way too good or misses every shot. That’s the case for most shooters, not just War Thunder. The thing with tossing bombs is quite a different story, though. Most players are quite accurate with them a usually destroy their targets, so it would be logical for the AI to do this too. You would balance it though deployment cost as well as the AI focusing one target per run/deployment.

Just my two cents…

Make a Gamemode for only Ground vehicles… no Planes, no Helis, no Attack-Drones.

I bet gaijin would make many current players happy and also attrackt old and new players that didnt want to play WT as long as they can be raped by planes and helis.

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I don’t think helicopters are a problem, per se. It was quite a good time, the few patches before the KAs got introduced.
Sure it would work, but what do you do with helicopters then. Aircraft have their own game mode, helicopters don’t.

We’ve already got smth like that in Beta - as far as I remember - but it wasn’t fun at all, at least for me.

The main issue with this mode is, there will be a meta tank people will exclusively use at every specific BR range.

There will be a bunch of vehicles, which nobody wont be using anymore.

The Spawn Point System would be obsoleted (no problem with that) but in addition, we would need a complete overhaul regarding the Match Making to even out the vehicle types on either side.

If i take a look at World of Tanks - wich uses exactly this TDM you suggested - even Wargaming didn’t get the right mix of vehicles per game at each side after years of changes.

In addition, World of Tanks is exactly what War Thunder will become, except health- Bars.

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I don´t share your fear, GRB mode would still exist for every player that enjoys it. I just want a extra mode for Ground Vehicles only. I like Combined battles till the point where everything gets stone paper sciccors.

I don´t want to play when i know that if someone wants to kill me, he can. WIthout me doing smt against it. He wants to see me dead… then i will be dead, even if he just suicide bomb/rocket or suicide heli kills me. And i dont like that one bit. Same the other way around, when i sit in my Tu2S or A4E or even higher tier stuff… i know that when no enemy fighter will interrupt me i will kill half the enemy team.

this is already in game, its called 10.0 russia teammates

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I agree with most of your points, I also think an event style of mode that rotates BR’s or vehicle sets could be beneficial, just like tank SB.

I don’t quite see the issue with camping, though. Most camping positions on maps over ways to get to them by the enemy without driving through line of sight. The problem is, that more often than not, you have to spawn push and then there is a high chance of getting killed by a respawning player.

I don’t see camping as an issue per se. Most tanks, especially Western tanks (speaking about Cold War), have been design to be used in a defensive manner, the Challenger is the best example. Those type of tanks suffer in the current, fast paste style game mode. This suggestion on the other hand could lead to a more tactical or strategical use of the maps, which I would highly appreciate. This is obviously only a theory, but without CAS and respawns, it would be possible to just endure the enemies offensive and then push for a counter-attack afterward.
The matches would be much faster, and you wouldn’t have a constant on slaughter with carcasses littering the battlefield everywhere.

I left WOT because it was Counter Strike with tanks. I came to WT explicitly cause it wasn’t counterstrike.

Hard no.

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If you don’t want the massive amounts of respawns try sim battles as for the spawn camping I would suggest having an invisible barrier that enemies can see through or a back line off the map for just the tank spawns and only you are allowed to go into it and not have a return to battlefield countdown as for the air units in a ground battle tough on real war you don’t get to choose if it’s only air or ground you deal with it all so yea there’s that