Major updates should come with all the vehicles necessary for a competitive field, they knew this day was coming 10 years ago, this gap in the German aviation tree was obvious to everyone forever, they had plenty of time to research and prepare an alternative, a 3rd gen Phantom isn’t that.
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Ok, let me rephrase:
| Plane | Updates later | Original Plane |
|---|---|---|
| MiG-29G | 1 | after the SMT |
| MiG-19S | 1 | after the MiG-19PT |
| MiG-29 | 1 | after the MiG-29 |
| Su-22UM3K | 1 | after the Su-22M3 |
| MiG-23MLA | 2 | after the MiG-23ML |
| MiG-23MF | 3 | after the MiG-23M (and as an event vehicle) |
| CL-13 Mk.5 | 2 | after the F-86F-2 or at least 3 after the F-86A-5 |
| Mig-21bis-SAU | 5 | after the Mig-21bis |
| F-86K | 5 | after the French one and 4 after the Italian one |
| Su-22M4 | 5 | after the Su-17M4 |
| Mig-23BN | 5 | after the MiG-27M |
| MiG-15bis | 7+ | after the MiG-15bis |
| F-4F | 6 | after the F-4E |
| F-4F early | 8 | after the F-4C or 5 after the F-4E |
| G.91 R/3 | 11 | after the G.91 R/1 or 2 after the G.91 R/4 |
| CL-13 Mk.6 | 26 | after the F-86F-2 |
| IL-28 | 29 | after the IL-28 |
| Lim-5P | 32 | after the MiG-17 |
No it shouldn’t. They always seem to have the others ready when only the German one is not.
Italy, China, Israel all got their F-16s the same time the US got theirs.
UK got their Gripen the same time, Japan and Israel their F-15s the same time, China the Su-27 the same time, but not Germany. Germany does not get their Top-Tier at the same time.
Tomato, Tomato: same or similar, as I stated before. They might not be 100% the same vehicles, but they are of the same type and very, very similar.
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Should doesn’t mean they will. That statement is also for you @DiamondCraftLP
For a 5 - 18 month vehicle project, having a hiccup during the last month of dev means it can miss that major update and be scheduled for the future one.
That’s why I say 2+ updates after.
Cause 1 update can mean it was finished the day after the previous update went gold or up to the final week before release of the next major update.
However, 2 updates later is a minimum of the time between update went gold for 1.1 and after update went gold for 1.2. [Numbers are a visual guide].
So Mig-23MLA for example took 1 major update + unknown amount of days to finish as shown with @DiamondCraftLP 's updated table.
I appreciate the change, by the way. Thank you, Diamond.
It is still strange that it apparently only happens to the German Aircraft.
And with the new Top-Tiers essentially being copy-paste of each other it is even stranger that they couldn’t finish 1 more copy on time.
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Oh, it happened with many more.
F-16AJ, F-4J, Yak-141, Mirage 2000C, and so on.
I haven’t cataloged every aircraft that came 1, 2, or more updates after their competition.
Just seems they are working way too close to a deadline for literally no reason, you can have things planned way in advance, the fact updates are being promoted and pushed out before vehicles are even completed yet is entirely unnecessary when you can allow yourself a buffer.
And when a vehicle is delayed you don’t have to delay it even further for a next update, the timespan listed in the original post is way beyond reason.
No, that’s not what it means at all.
There is a buffer as well, which further disproves your claim.
if that was the issue, then there wouldnt have been an average of 528 days between germany getting their share of vehicles because, fun fact, they would never have gotten them!
If there was a buffer we would not end up with updates missing vehicles.
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Different context from current days.
At the time, Gaijin had not considered implementing East and West German vehicles in the game, but the CL-13A and German MiG-15bis were implemented because the top tier aircrafts such as Me 163 and Me 262 A-1a vehicles had no chance against the Sabres and MiGs.
For the same reason, the F-86F-30 was implemented in Japan.
G.91R/3 wasn’t implemented until 2018 because top tier games in Germany was really strong at that time and CL-13A ruined almost everythings. If they implemented R/3 in 2018 or 2017, it would be beyond of god tier.
The CL-13B Mk. 6 is by absolutely not equivalent to the F-2 Sabre lmao.
Their counterpart was G.91YS, J32B, Shenyang F-5, Hunter FGA.9, F3H, F-100A.
All of them were implemented after AAM+supersonic patches.
We had 1953 hardcap and no AAMs, supersonics, afterburning jets when MiG-17 was implemented in the game.
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is straight up superior, due to the amount of countermeasures it should be in 11.0 air rb since there it is almost identical to the m4.
funnily we still dont have any mig 17F in the russian TT
who could have thought?
And that is exactly my point. US and USSR both got Korea Jets back in the closed Beta, instead of just the early post WW2 jets these countries produced, which were equivalent to the Me262s. So German Top-Tier, as you said yourself, had no chance.
So Germany got it the same Update the first Phantom and MiG-21s came.
And Germany got their Phantoms and MiG-21s way later, again.
And that warrants a 32 update delay?
It is also not supersonic and doesn’t carry AAMs. It is at best a slightly upgraded MiG-17.
Even China got their J-4 and F-5 14 updates before Germany got their Lim-5P. That was the update China was introduced.
The Russian Squadron Su-22M3 should be able to carry CM-pods, same ones as the UM3K has, but someone is not adding them. There are a lot of pictures of it with them attached.
The Lim-5P is a 17PF.
You won’t get them anyways anymore, because everyone is just crying for the next modern Top-Tier Jets. It would just act as filler, same as the Lim-5P did when it was added.
Also reminds me of the helicopters, the US and USSR got helicopters an update before Germany did, which created a ridiculous situation with US + USSR on the same team spamming helis and Germany on their own having nothing.
I wish germany would get the treatment they get in their naval in air
MiG-21MF was implemented at 1.95 and F-4C/MiG-21F-13/J-7II patch was 1.91 which is just 2 patches.
Yeah it was “way” later.
Reminder when top BR was 9.0, we didn’t have ANY guided missiles until FJ-4B VMF-232 was implemented in the game.
You obviously don’t understand Gaijin’s stance at the time.
Until 2018, the game had Gaijin’s own rule of not implementing any supersonic aircraft or jets having AAMs, afterburners.
We didn’t get the NVA MiG-17 because of balancing. If we gets afterburning MiG-17 or MiG-17A in Germany before 2018, top tier games would have been unplayable except in Germany.
Cutoff was already gone in 2019 so, China gots Shenyang F-5.
The MiG-21MF is one of only 3 aircraft that came at the same time. In this case the SMT came at the same time (Both in 1.95).
Which is a good thing.
You would know this if you read my post.
But not the Phantoms. Both F-4F (Ixwa Strike as Event vehicle; Red Skies) came way way later than the corresponding Phantoms in the American Tree (F-4E came 1.97 Viking Power, F-4C already 1.91), and the 21bis (Ground Breaking) came also way way later than the USSR 21bis (New Power).
One of my points was, that while Russia and USA both got to play with new toys, Germany, which TT consists mostly of US and USSR jets after WW2, had to wait until it got the same jets those two got, only at least 1 update later. Sometimes they got the “old” Top Tier, while the “new” Top Tier was introduced.
As was the case with the 21bis-SAU and the 23MLD. Both came in Update Ground Breaking. The German MLA came only 2 updates later in Winds of Change.
The Lim-5P came in Update Danger Zone, dated 2022.
Same time the F-14 was introduced.
Far away from 2018.
Just to put time into perspective.
so why couldn’t Germany get its Lim-5P back then?
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Because then the US and Russian “aces” wouldn’t have stock GER to pad their stats on. :D
Many ppl left WT over this issue long time ago. This is why GJ still runs laughable online numbers in comparison to the competition. With a time distance, I’d say that GJ much more hates Germans than they love the $.
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That’s because it wasn’t needed since CL-13B Mk.6 was sitting at 9.3/9.7BR.
If the Lim-5P had been implemented right after the supersonic jets were implemented, German jet players would have rioted because jet that could carry AAM in TT was needed except premium at that time.
Also, as a player who has played both, CL-13B is far better than Lim-5P and Shenyang F-5.
One key thing missing here was that when these Phantoms were added, there was a huge question of Armament. I remember the whole ordeal going down, of everyone asking; does a German Phantom mean Aim-9Ls are coming? Will they get Sparrows? Will Gaijin support only a historical armament, or will this be the first case of an Ahistorical one?
Gaijin was hesitant to add them because of the debate around how they should be added. Because Germany purchased them later, they had better offensive weaponry- but they maintained the same Airframe, as we see with the ICE. At the time, there was no precedent for NOT adding historical armaments, nor was there one for Ahistorical armaments. Because of this, and the concern of whether or not better weaponry should come, it took some time to find a solution (which ended up just being Ahistorical armaments for Balance purposes “because it could”, but again, the debate was huge).
I’m not saying that it meant 100% that it was a fair decision by Gaijin or anything; but their needs to be some recognition that Germany was in a unique spot that until then Gaijin hadn’t been in before.
Which to add on is a common reason why Germany didn’t always get things immediately. They sit in this weird spot where they stopped domestic development primarily for aircraft in the 1940s/50s- for a variety of reasons (they were split in two being two of them). Gaijin first had to decide whether or not they should add East/West Germany, and then how they should handle Copy Paste, etc. etc. etc. Because Germany has been constantly in these “new” positions, Gaijin has had to think and collect data on them, hence why some things may not have come as recently as people would have liked.
TLDR: Because there often was no precedent set for the Jets people wanted and one must be created, Gaijin decided to think and spend time making decisions instead of rushing certain German Aircraft into the game
Get life
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