You are completly right, velocy is important factor. I would be honored if you could remake this post with your own words, to more pleasing form.
Armor can definitely help you survive machine gun fire from ground units.
It simply isn’t.
R3 maxes out at 45/30 while Kugelblitz maxes out at 60/20.
It also has a single 20mm cannon instead of 2x 30mm like you have on Kugelblitz, which means you’ll have to aim way more carefully.
Armour means you don’t just die to a rocket/bomb in your general postcode and you aren’t just a free kill for anything with an mg
Yes for pay to win players you can spend some real money to get aced crew.
Pen is and always was the most important factor. That is why we dont see Flakpanzer 341 in BR 1.0 killing anyking with one shot from any distance on map. Its simple as that.
You don’t need aced crew lol.
It simply isn’t.
You are right, armor can be beneficial when its working. Having ability to survive agance .30 can be very usefull when playing br 1.0 - 2.7.
But unfortunely we are talking about 6.7 BR where heavy 14.5 machinegunes guns are normal, rats with 20mm cannons (mentioned above). Planes with eveything from 20mm to 50mm as standard.
Having a protection agance .30 in br 6.7 for cost of speed is not a good tradeof. This is why its comical to me even mentioning Kugelblitz’s armor. Things would be different if Kugelblitz had armor of KV-220, that would be functional even agance some smaller autocannons and still it should be high as 6.7
Not even KV-220 with real cannon is 6.7
Man am i glad 341 is forever locked away from people like this
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To be fair i dont think that he would do much with the 341 seen how bad he is with spaag
you dont understand. I have 341 more than 7 years. I have Kugelblitz more than 11 years. I am playing with pauses and i am disapointed how is the game evolving, this is why i am creating this post. Germany AA line up seems so wrong because it full of ancient vehicles which was never updated or downtiered.
Its ok if you have different opinion. Thanks you for comment.
i never said i am a good player. My best score is with object 279 just because that tank is great in every aspect. Not like Kugelblitz these days.
To make it short: German SPAAs just have not enough pen. They’re all far behind most of its competitors. The only good SPAAs are the Flakpanzer and Gepard.
Kugel, Ostwinds, Wirbel, Wiesel, etc etc… just compare it to russian ZSU’s or the czech flakbus of doom. Or the US vietnam era ones. They all have much more pen + mobility…partially even at lower BRs. Far lower BRs. Something is not exactly right there.
Will this guy stop crying abouth the Kugel man is a Monster of SPAA you can kill tanks and suffer no damage from planes you don’t get overpressured easily like all the other SPAAs all german SPAAs are very good I like a ton the oswind because 1 hit means plane destroyed It have fast rof for be a 37mm
Just look this KD with the oswind I used It until I got the kugelblitz I ignored the oswind 2
The APCR shell the 37mm Truck, Ostwind, and Ostwind II all lack already exists in the game on the Stuka G1, Stuka G2, HS-129B-2, and Bf-110G-2’s BK 3,7 cannon. Even with WT’s terrible modeling of APCR it still pens 108mm (the real round penned 140mm+).
And due to how the same or very similar projectiles were shared between Flak18 and Naval SK C/30 guns, it’s highly likely the same APCR could have been fired from the Coelian’s Naval-derived Gerat 341 cannons at much higher velocity (a Google conservative estimate is 1297m/s, up from the 1150m/s of the BK 3,7 round), which would give the Coelian easily 140mm pen even with WT’s terrible APCR treatment.
Now if APCR were modeled correctly, the numbers on almost every SPAAGs’ APCR rounds would skyrocket. Including the “Czechbus.”
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The Flakpanzer doesn’t rely on its pen to kill things, anyway. The 80mm pen is more than enough. It relies on its 37mm shells exploding like nuclear bombs inside a vehicle, because of how APHE works in this game.
if anything the higher the BR, the more cold war era light tanks the kugelblitz can pen
All SPAAGs with high pen rounds, even if they are APCR or APDS, simply put enough lead downwind to semi-compensate for the terrible postpen damage. But yes I know that APHE on all autocannons is in a class of its own, yet the people who cry about it today are the same ones who voted “No” to even test realistic APHE postpen out properly.
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There’s no practical difference. Your first take was right. Most important is just pen for AC vehicles. Even if its just a solid shell withpout filler: Autocannons just perforate the target with dozens of shells in mere seconds. It doesn’t really matter whether its Aphe or not. Even a low damage 20mm gun with no spall and no filler will kill any target in no time, as long as it pens.
I completely agree with this. Germany has been left behind for a long time, especially when it comes to the anti-aircraft line. There are still many outdated vehicles sitting at unnecessarily high BRs, while other nations continue to receive newer and much more competitive vehicles.
Honestly, I don’t expect Germany to receive any meaningful additions or proper improvements anytime soon. The situation is already bad, and it seems to be getting worse with every update.
At this point, I have started playing other nations instead, because they simply offer a much better experience. It’s disappointing to say this as someone who invested a lot of time into the German tree, but choosing other nations seems to be the better option right now.
i come to you all with the solution
Coreproblem is that GJ and the community have a very selective bias when it comes to Germany. There was a patch in 2022 I think that basically nerfed every german cannon round up to 30% in pen while it simultanteously buffed any other cannon round. Its one of the main reasons why any german AA suddenly has problems penning tanks from the side. From the early stages of GRB the german 37mm had the 95mm pen APHE which either got removed or nerfed. When you think about it the Ostwind once was at 5.7 (I think) due to its cannon but now sits at 3.7 due to its anemic damage output.
Found the video to it:
Fun fact the same patch buffed all plane cannons bar the german and japanes ones, latter stayed the same while the german ones got nerfed and allied cannons got massively buffed.
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