What kind of difference in armour do you think there is that being 2.0 helps it very much compared to being 3.7? This is the same reason the Duck is 2.3, it flies so badly that the flight performance is by far the most relevant factor, because if you were to balance based on the gun it would go to 5.0 or something. Further, the worse the flight performance of these planes, the more likely they’re going to be hitting the main hull of a tank, often also at extreme angles, whereas a fighter with an AT gun can afford to shoot through the roof every time if it wants.
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This is the whole reason why the Yak-9K is so good at killing tanks, It is an easy to aim (due to flying straight down, and not needig to account for bullet drop and all that) cannon, that’s mounted on a fighter.
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And there you go. You proved my own point. All those planes can nuke the enemy at their br imagine.
The Yak can do it much easier, while also being much less vulnerable due to being able to attack vertically.
The Yak currently is overpowered, and there is no reason for it to not move up.
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Adding to this, if it is considered more important that it does not move up, then the round needs to be removed. There are precedents for this; I believe the M247 had its AP rounds removed, off the top of my head, and there’s no shortage of tanks that lack shell types they should have on the logic that adding them would increase the BR.
This could be called a pick your poison scenario, the Yak-9k can’t both have the round and stay at the BR.
(To be clear, I’m saying this for onlookers, this is obviously a given for most people in this discussion).
Usually we agree on things. But if you can’t fly your plane that’s on you. I can fly the XA-38 rather fine and enjoy picking on panthers with it
Bit rich to complain about what is essentially a meme plane with a 45mm, when USA has entire BRs where it outclasses USSR/Germany in the CAS department. This isn’t Battlefield. Being balanced doesn’t have to be like-for-like per each class of unit. You’re essentially making a mountain out of a molehill, and given the popularity of nations that have to face this plane at this BR (with plenty of lvl100 people choosing to play this BR by choice and not for the grind), it’s a non-issue.
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Let’s not forget the fact that the me-262-A1 that has a 50mm gets spammed out as it’s the OG supreme tank killer, but it’s a fighter. Guess we better nerf it too eh?
It used to be a meme plane. Now it’s a genuine CAS choice, and should be treated as such. Making a mountain out of a molehill would be saying that this is a huge conspiracy to populate Russian teams and shift the overall balance of GRB, or something. Notably, that’s not the sort of thing we’re saying, we’re discussing the balance of a specific aircraft as compared to similar vehicles.
As to the US CAS, I honestly just don’t notice it enough to discuss it. I know it exists, and that it tends to be a bigger problem than everyone else’s, but it’s not something I pay attention to while playing and thus not something I think about during discussions, except to know, vaguely, that it exists.
In balancing being like-for-like for classes, while that isn’t the hardline method of balancing, it is a good one. If you’re talking about a vehicle’s ability to perform a specific role, it is natural to compare it to another vehicle performing the same role (you would not compare the abilities of a dive bomber and a torpedo bomber in their capacity to take out pillboxes).
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but it’s a fighter
A fighter?
Also, we did nerf it. Its accuracy is worse than it used to be, and I believe the gun has a lower rate of fire and overheats faster than it used to, and it has significantly worse flight performance than almost every other early jet in the game (granted this is due to being a Me 262, not being a gun-CAS).
I’m not sure where you’re getting the idea that we find the idea of a plane with an AT gun inherently offensive or something. We’ve explicitly stated the reasons for why we find other planes with that feature to be more balanced, and why we do not think it is so with the Yak-9k in particular. You’re not even just twisting our words to suit your argument, you’re just changing them to pretend we’re saying something we’re not.
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That’s also 6.3 on a relatively mid platform.
Yes that is a good tank buster, but it’s also at a BR that makes it more balanced, and it faces more capable AA.
It was a meme before it got APHE, now it is a CAS plane that is too good for its current BR.
It needs to go up in BR, and if that doesn’t happen, APHE should be removed. It wouldn’t be the first time gun belts got changed for balance purposes (Ho-229 and Kugelblitz come to mind).
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There’s another aspect to large twin engine fighters:
Ease of SPAA.
Hitting twin-engine strike craft is significantly easier than hitting a tiny air-superiority fighter. Even the P-47 is bigger than the APHE Yak-9
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Oh, so you want this Russian plane to become useless and subpar and hardly used. Gotchya. I really couldn’t think of worse examples for you to bring into this topic, lol.
Ho-229 and Kugelblitz are examples of multiple simultaneous nerfs, which is not what we’re recommending. The Kugelblitz had its shells nerfed (unjustly in that case, I’d say, considering there’s similar SPAA AT capability at similar BRs) and increased in BR, and the Ho 229 had the guns themselves nerfed, the belt nerfed, the guns were then marked as gunpods, nerfing the accuracy even more, the flight model was nerfed, and then I think the BR was increased a bit as well.
What we’re recommending is an either or. Either the shell is removed, which has a lot of precedent in this game, or it goes up in BR.
Something that I don’t think has been mentioned in this topic yet is that the plane doesn’t need to go up in BR as a fighter anymore. Only the Ground Battles BR needs to be changed for this, and if the BR is changed then the Air Battles BR certainly should not be changed.
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“Mid” lmao
Mid is a good term, in the sense that it’s decently balanced. It’s the same gun as on the Me 410, but on a faster plane (notice how that works?). Since armour is better you do actually need to go for the roof a bit more often, but you can afford that due to your speed. It’s not terribly accurate though, and there isn’t too much HE filler, so you have a very good chance to do damage but it’s more 50/50 to outright kill. This is called not being overpowered.
Comparing the Narwhal to the Me 410 is a good benchmark for this discussion, because it’s another case of the same gun on a better plane. Notably, the Yak-9k has the same or similar gun as other ground attack aircraft, but on a significantly better plane, and so, like the Narwhal, it should be a higher BR. If we were to accept your logic for keeping the Yak-9k at the same BR with the APHE round, then that could be seen as grounds for moving the Narwhal down to the same BR as the Me 410.
Now, if you’re talking about the Me 262 as a platform outside of ground attack, then mid is in fact incredibly generous. I’m fairly certain the only thing similar in performance is the Mig-9, but from what I’ve seen that’s still marginally better (and despite being marginally better is frequently complained about by Russian players).
To be clear, Narwhal is a nickname for the 50mm Me 262, and I’ll be using it because it is less cumbersome.
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and what happens when the Tempest meets another plane, do it have machineguns aswell so it can defend itself?
nope.
Now ask the same question with the Yak
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Oh the me410 forgot about that so there’s even more German big cannon planes lol you are dismantling your own argument
Do you have any reasoning for this beyond “more planes doing this thing obviously means they’re just better, nevermind they’re at completely different BRs with completely different performance”?
Not once in this entire argument have we said there’s anything wrong with planes with big cannons. The Me 410 has been cited several times as an example of a large-cannon plane that is balanced, due to being cumbersome and a large target (which the Yak-9k is not, despite similar AT capabilities and a lower BR).
To get it out of the way, there are, to my knowledge, three main German large-cannon planes. The Hs 129 (2.3), which is nearly unflyable before it gets shot; the Me 410 (~4.0), which is a relatively cumbersome 2 engine aircraft; and the 50mm Me 262 (6.3), a 262 (notably inferior to other early jets) with the same gun as the Me 410.
All of these are large twin engine aircraft, two are cumbersome to fly and cannot reliably get actual top-down attacks, and the third is a significantly higher BR and can still be relatively easily run down by contemporary aircraft.
The Yak9k is a large-cannon aircraft with an APHE round. It is single engine, nimble, with good turn rate and flight performance, and can guarantee top-down attacks. It can still defend itself against enemy fighters without sacrificing its AT capabilities. No one had a problem with it being a large-cannon aircraft before it had the APHE round, and multiple solutions to this have been suggested.
Until something new is added to this discussion I won’t be wasting any more time on it. If you want to keep arguing, just read back through the topic; it isn’t as though we haven’t already mentioned everything relevant several times, at this point you can just endlessly reply to what we’ve already written rather than us having to write new posts saying the same things in the vain hope you’ll make an argument that isn’t “Vehicle is Russian, so can’t be nerfed” or “You guys just hate large-cannon aircraft (please don’t mention the many times you’ve talked about them being balanced)”.
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