Cant wait until this thing is 7.3 and terrible because of this change… RIP when it was a good 6.3 spaa
It is not hard to hit weak spots with an extremely high volume of fire.
5 Likes
That dude is who did the YT vid I posted
The only issue I have with this vehicle is the rate it gets kills so fast. Also, if a pretty good player was using it and was doing well I wouldn’t really care but it’s the fact that players who don’t play well are just spamming APHE rounds onto everyone and getting tons of kills. It isn’t even a skill issue on my part if my team gets wiped out from a single Flakpanzer 341 and the match ends in 5-10 minutes because of a single player. Just wanted to state this.
2 year 6.0 ussr player, %99 +0.7or1.0 and %1 +0.3. for 2 days battles f up bad. some battles over in first minutes. this tank (he is in my team) kill 3 m18 in 1 second.
i left the game and go to 5.3, said never play 6.0 until this problem solved.
forgot i always play full uptier and first 2 battles 6.3 and this thing butches everything again.
now i am in 5.0 ussr. tried 9.0 but feels like it becomes like TT. my obj279 died by 1 shot many times and 250kg plane bomb.
this thing butches everything in seconds, my kv220 shell do nothing on it, every heavy dies even T29 T30.
its not about its nonexit or armor or pen or skill or SL or rank or whatever, this thing makes 5.3 +up unplayable.
and dont wait gaijin do about it, german main players are whales for them.
YOU CAN DO, GO PLAY OTHER BRs, and let gaijin see what they made to the game.
Yikes
3 Likes
so looking back at this topic, for some reason now they gave it a even better belt. i think it is time for the entire comunity to boycot gaijin to unlock these removed vehicles for everyone again, because it is way to powerfull now
2 Likes
Define whiner because lot of time “whiners” are just “people that disagree with me”.
Im not even gonna touch Yak-9K as that is entirely separate topic with its own nuances.
What if gaijin does not give any tools to help them; or the issue cannot be solved playerside such as in case of bugs? Are still players to blame?
I am simply not in favor of unnerfing SPAAs and playing against them on current maps. Letting SPAAs continue being bad in anti ground role until maps get fixed still leaves them with anti air duties, ie. they are and will not be useless and it is much preferable approach to me.
so SPAA BR shouldnt reflect both their AA and antiground capabilities or what? Should SPAAs antiground capability have less weight when it comes to BR placement?
for arcade, if they dont already have that feature, sure. for realistic? For me personally, no thanks. It would be akin to having penetration indicator and automatic rangefinding in arcade, ie. training wheels for people that do not want to put effort into learning the game.
Also 1.5km funnily enough coincides with max range of M163 Vulcan tracking radar so one would make the other redundant in this case.
Also I dont know how to write the next part without ofending you, so im just gonna put disclaimer here and ask you to not to take it personally, just something to think about.
You said that that game should approach balancing by giving the player the tools to help themselves instead of nerfing the thing they whine about, yet then you go and ask for automatic lead calculating for SPAA (effectively nerfing CAS at BR ranges without radar equipped SPAA) when you already have tool to determine correct lead for them, that being tracer rounds.
I knew he was coming, thats why I was preaiming at that corner.
Issue was that my round didnt do anything to him (granted it was partly my bad shot placement but latency issues and what not made my shot land just behind the driver and spall did not catch him) and my tank was too slow to react simply due to slow turret rotation etc. to MG his gunners before he zapped past me, which was the point I was trying to ilustrate - that unnerfing SPAAs antiground capabilities without changing their BRs and without any changes to map layouts will make the SPAAs the new meta and will make most tanks obsolete.
Because why bother with playing slow tank with slow reload when I can play fast go cart that not only invalidates the enemy armor; it also doesnt punish if not encourages just taking every possible shot without any thought to shot placement because you have RoF of MAC-10 going full auto, turning entire maps into Detroit, driving around yelling “WEST SIDE” as I brrt down a tank that couldnt react. We already have red and blue teams, so this would be natural evolution.
Its only 0.3 HP/T shy of having same HP/T as Chafee (funnily enough, it uses chafee hull). For 4.0 that is mobile enough.
This one has just 0.3 HP/T less than Puma while sitting 0.7 BR lower.
Others, sure, but these two specific SPAAs are similiar in mobility to BR appropriate light tanks.
Its on Panther hull with similiar HP/T to Panther A. Thats still medium tank mobility. It has better HP/T than Pershing. If Panthers and Pershings can flank with such mobility, so can Coelian. Not to mention people apparently dont know they dont have to shoot the panther hull and can instead go for the 60mm turret.
And imagine BTR-ZD with sabots, for example the FV4202 anecdote I gave. Or the Leo40/70 with sabots, assuming 40mm bofors did have them.
Leo 40/70 especially - that thing already has similiar pen to Freccia, a 9.7 italian IFV, better HP/T but with slower ROF and without enclosed turret or stabiliser (which isnt that much of an issue with rapid firing guns). With sabots and without moving it up in BR, that thing would dominate 6.3, seeing as Freccia faces off against T-72s MBT-70s etc. while Leo 40/70 would face Walker Bulldogs, STAs, Charioteers, M-51s - all tanks much slower to react to threats.
Or, hear me out - This is simply matter of preference. You might find no issues with this, but there are people, me included, that want to play WW2 tanks and not pseudo-IFVs.
not to mention the aforementioned meta shift that would follow, because why would you play a medium when you can be more mobile with much higher RoF that doesnt have to worry about shot placement and similiar pen that invalidates medium tank armor anyway?
Its not just UK tree that has gaps. Sweden, Israel, France, China, Japan, you name it. Im not saying some of the nations dont have AAs that cant be uptiered and do relatively well in AA role but there shouldnt be need to uptier vehicles in the first place.
Up until addition of XM246 I had to play Vulcan in my US 8.7 lineup and let me tell you it wasnt fun - that thing barely stands on its own against 7.7 CAS, let alone 8.7 or when uptiered. So dont even joke about putting that sad little creature into more TTs :D
1 Like
Just transform it’s turret: currently it is modelled as a steel turret, transform it into a wood turret with appropriate weight and armor correction of course.
Problem solved: easy to destroy no more problem of balance just like the falcon or amx 30S dca
Which would be incorrect, as the vehicle in game wasnt even build as a wooden model, we have the 3,7 cm Gerät 341 Flakpanzer V, while the wooden model was made as the 5,5 cm Gerät 58.
7 Likes
I mean we have the panther 2 with a 88 that doesn’t fit in the turret, that doesn’t hurt player (except me) when we emphasize this fact
I know im glazing the pseudo-IFV gameplay for the duration of this entire thread, and I personally dont particually care about what will happen to Coelian beyond my 6.3/6.7 lineups being left without BR appropriate SPAA
but the turret is 60mm. Angled, sure, but it can be lolpenned by US 75mm (the short one) using M61 shell.
Literally do not shoot the Panthers hull UFP.
4 Likes
That’s right, but you’re taking the M61 as example: a shell filled with explosives, if you’re using a PCOT from french you pierce and deal no damage. With wooden turret 12.7 would be enough and you wouldn’t not be force to hunt for people on the turret
Imma keep it real with you chief, ive spent 10 minutes clicking through the french TT trying to find what shell are you refering to, beacause theyre either labelet Obus de Rupture or POT, and im prolly too stupid to find it.
I think he is referring to the PCOT from the AMX-13 and the M4A4(SA50) that doesn’t have as much penetration as other French solid shot and it doesn’t do as much post-penetration damage.
ye, youre right
202mm of pen is more than enough to cut straight through the coelian turret no matter where.
If for some reason turret cant be shot, protection analysis shows it should be theoretically possible to UFP the coelian if looked at directly without any angling. Not like you should be going for the strongest armor plate anyway, but the possibility is there.
As for post pen, by grace of the PCOT being AP round, of course its bad when compared to APHE. Still, shot that lands in the area of right gun will take out the gunner
I was playing around the Coelian in test drive and noticed that most of its ammo is stored in the hull and it isnt until you take circa 130 clips, ie. nearly full ammo load, that the ammo starts being stored in the turret.
Which kinda isnt what I expected, Id imagine the turret racks would fill first so that the loader does not have to reach all the way to the hull to feed the guns.
So id imagine that another possible fix would be changing the load order of the racks so that the turret ones would load first, making it easier to oneshot.
4 Likes
thanks, so by gaijin implementation rules, this Coelian should have never been in the game,… be just grateful it is.
Well technically both the 5,5 cm Gerät 58 and 3,7 cm Gerät 341 were build. Tho not unique to it, and the vehicle is from befor the rule, thats why it was removed.
And giving it a “wooden turret” which is neither based on realism nor what would be, is simply absurd. But purely some players fantasy, because of skill issue while many players spam the vehicle due to current hype.
1 Like
quick question Ghostmaxi, since you seem to be the guy to ask when it comes to german vehicles - shouldnt coelian turret racks fill first, rather than hull racks? Seems logical that loader would want to have as much ammo as possible within arms reach, instead of having to dive down into the hull to retrieve new clip each time he loaded.
Technically yes, just like with every other vehicle?