And Gaijin is laughing all the way to the bank because the hackers buy the premiums again.
I’m suggesting the rules ‘as they exist’ are not strict enough.
That wasn’t my intention, I was merely saying that my attitudes pertaining to certain behaviours in the game has changed with experience, and than yours might too.
I (obviously) dont have any problem with a tank retreating to cover when hit. I also dont have a problem with pilots extending away or climbing away from engagements when they are at a disadvantage, whether that be to give them some time or to get their teammates involved, or to change the dynamics of the engagement in a way that suits them. I also dont really have a problem with players running back to base to repair if they are damaged or need to get more ammo/fuel. That isn’t airfield camping. If said player, for example, refused to take off from the runway until the pursuing aircraft left the area, or perhaps used the AA cover to climb to altitude to equalise with the pursuer, or tried to lure the pursuer towards the AA to potentially get them shot down, then that is a problem for me. This is because the camping player has essentialy nullified any advantage that the pursuing player might have had, without taking any risk themselves.
Airfield camping essentially means that errors one made are not punished. If my positioning is poor and I end up at a disadvantage in a fight, how is it fair to the person who beat me if I can instantly turn around and survive under the aegis of my AA.
Furthermore, im not so sure your parallel with the tank reversing into cover applies here. If the tanker is in a position where they can utilise cover effectively, that is because their understanding of the terrain/positioning was good, they prepared so that they have that defensive option. A parallel in air RB would be if I climbed to gain an altitude advantage before I engaged someone, then I have the luxury of using the energy advantage I gained to climb away when I am in trouble.
Avoiding fighters by climbing to space and extending the game to 25m is kinda bad. I have nothing against people landing and quitting. Problem is, griefers in bombers usually have fun by:
- being useless and thus sabotaging their own team
- climbing to space and thus extending the game and boring everyone to death.
I have only recently started playing GRB and I have never played naval. I do remember the days when battle activity was related to proximity to other players in air RB. A lot of the mechanics you mentioned do seem a lot more problematic than any tactics that are/were available in air RB, and possibly more problematic than the issue of airfield camping. Thanks for helping me understand better what ‘passive behaviour’ entails.
Aside from what gaijin considers ‘passive behaviour’ to be, do you not consider airfield camping or running to the corner of the map to be behaving in a passive manner. I certainly think it is.
Yes! This is something that is misunderstood and you constantly see turnfighters blame BnZ planes for acting in a defensive manner because they believe their behaviour is passive.
There is a fairly important distinction between passiveness and defensiveness - a defensive player might momentarily act passively (extending away etc…) in order to change the circumstances of the engagement to improve their chances of winning. I might drag someone away from their teammates so that I can fight them without getting third-partied, or I might pick up speed so that I can utilise my opponents elevator compression, or I might climb away for a minute to utilise my climb rate etc. A passive player is only concerned with keeping themselves alive.
Eyeroll, I was just complimenting ur pfp. Didnt play the submarine event, I do remember briefly playing the silent thunder april fools event from yonks ago tho.
Yeah, no problem with guys in high performing planes being unkillable. No issue at all i 0 skill reversals. You see, in tanks you retreat into cover. Which is pretty much a normal tank on tank fight thing. The proper analogy is zooming away from slower, more maneuvrable opponent.
Reversing via AF has no analogy in ground RB, because ground RB has no easily reachable death zone that kills the enemies for you and in ground RB you can’t dodge enemy shots after only a few seconds of running away.
They haven’t beaten you, as you’re both still alive. This is a perspective issue, as is very evident by your phrasing.
A good player uses all of the game’s mechanics to their advantage, simple as that. You’re basically complaining about “grenade spam” or “overpowered shotguns” or similar in FPS games; not liking a given mechanic doesn’t make it invalid.
More importantly, it’s irrelevant to a discussion about cheating.
The topic is fair play.
Griefing by AF camping and space climbing, while vastly popular among the toxic (and mostly jnskilled and cowardly) part of the playerbase, is also against fair play. But gaijin tolerates it, because good part of their paying customers are toxic trolls and taking away their toy would end up with hysterical reaction.
All I want is a fair and fun game.
The topic is cheating. Are you actually this literal of a person?
It really is impressive how much toxicity you managed to fit in a post this short.
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As usual, some pathetic insults thrown here and there, because I want to ruin your “fun”.
No toxicity at all. Lying would be toxic. F.e. saying that AF campers are decent people. That would insult even some criminals, because a few of them have higher moral standards than annoying as many people as possible and avoid fair play to maximum extent.
The topic is fair play. It’s literally named Fair Play. Of course Gaijin considers only cheating unfair, while griefing is the fairest of fair plays according to griefers themselves, and the company that benefits off them. But it’s damn far from truth
Okay, sure, I’ll rephrase it as ‘the person who gained a significant enough advantage that it was likely that they would beat me if the fight had continued.’ Personally, I think it was pretty easy to understand what I meant.
Forum discussions such as these are places where we talk about how to improve the game. In this case by ‘improving’ I mean suggesting improvements that make the game reward skill and preparation and punish a lack-thereof accordingly. I hope you can agree that changes that achieve this improve the game. In my opinion, removing the ability to camp the AA does just this. If you think that knowledge of how to get my AA to shoot down enemy aircraft is a skill that should be rewarded, then that is a disagreement we have on what should constitude skill in air RB. I cannot change your opinion on what constitutes skill, all I can say is that it is not fun to play in a game which rewards skills that are so heavily concerned with deterring fights, but of course I cannot change what you think constitudes ‘fun’ either.
I mean, if that mechanic is making the game worse, then I have a case for stating reasons why I dislike it.
This is a discussion about fair play. My entire point has been that airfield camping should not be allowed under fair play (because in isnt fair under any reasonable persons defintion of what constitues skilful play) and that therefore doing it should be considered a breach of fair-play, i.e., cheating.
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I appreciate that you are on my side with this debate, but @BleedingUranium is right, there isnt a place to be toxic. I have strongly expressed how much I detest the act of airfield camping and given reasons for why, but I tried to avoid being toxic. A lot of the people who do it are new (or perhaps even seasoned) players who do not know what to do and have learned that the only way they can beat people is by airfield camping. They are victims of the game design, some of them.
It’s not cheating. It’s literally griefing. Exploiting the game deisgn flaws to cause msximum player annoyance/frustration. The majority of players actually don’t use AF AAA for their benefit. So it’s pretty much the general rule to not camp the AF, because it greatly reduces the fan of everyone involved. But griefer’s fun comes from making other players miserable.
There’s no real satisfaction in AF AAA “reversal” because there’s no skill or teamplay involved. The satisfaction comes from greatly frustrating the player who worked for better position only to get everything denied by magical death bubble.
But that’s details, because it’s simply not fair, and that’s what counts.
This is what counts, yes.
It is hardly griefing tho, it is just poor players trying to not die, the manner in which they do so is bad enough that I think means should be taken to remove it as an option. There might be some bad examples (I definitely know I have seen a few), but even still, try and be civilised.
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Oh boy, have you ever engaged with them in chat? Most of them have fun of their lives. It’s their go-to tactic.
Yeah for some it’s just unfair stat padding.
But majority gets a kick out of annoying everyone else. Same with B18B spaceclimbers. They will even come a bit down, just so they can spray you with their 13mm MG with infinite ammo. And you have like 0 chance of ever catching them unless you have a lot of time and are flying some high-alt monster like P-47…
Imho both of you are wasting time trying to discuss with those 2 guys.
They simply hijack every available thread in order to pray their core message:
- They are surrounded by people unworthy to play a game together with them, either due to lack of skill, know-how, fighting spirit or passion in general.
- Everybody who is not following their way of thinking and has the audacity trying to discuss with them and are showing that they are not willing to play by their rules is “low life” and “toxic”.
They simply forget:
- Arguing with “fair play” and using derogatory language towards others with deviating opinions at the same time is excluding each other - as the core principle of “fair play” is mutual respect.
- So everybody arguing with “fair play” whilst showing a lack of respect in their language towards others is just a hypocrite as they try to use straw men arguments in order to push their agenda.
- Irl you ignore those people, in this forum we have the “ignore” function.
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Yeah, lets respect trolls, griefers etc. it will surely work, because their attitude of space climbing and diving towards AF is SO FULL OF RESPECT. And the Griefers’ Union defending these guys in every thread is a paragon of fair play and good will, not at all space climbing out of spite because they consider enemy team’s victory not earned, because their own team “has failed” (and lets just conveniently omit the fact that they did nothing to help that team win in the 1st place because they were too busy strategically avoiding combat unless at giant advantage).
EDIT: Just met such ace. He ended up with 5 kills, thx to staying close to AF. Unfortunately, his observation skills were sub par so after he scored one of his AF reversals and started chasing a friendly, I dove after him in Sea Fury. He immediately started the dive towards AF, but was too slow.
Seriously, how can anyone defend such behaviour?
What positives does it bring to the game.
Again, the number of decent people benefitting from AF AAA was exactly 0. How surprising.
Honestly, you absolutely hijacked this thread.
All because what you deem to be unfair, isn’t…
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Just to be clear, I was perfectly civil in all my discussions. I hope this isnt directed at me
You never answered me asking you where you suggesting to report something that isn’t reportable was stated as being so…
Even though I still believe War Thunder or Gaijin needs a better anti cheat software , the only good thing when doing mass bans once 6 months or so , is that you don’t let cheaters or the creators of the cheat always updating their software , example if Gaijin was banning all the time instantly cheaters every day by the anti cheat that would only lead the creators of cheats to update their software .
But in my humble opinion , easy anti cheat isn’t that good anti cheat software to be honest . If gaijin is capable of creating their own anti cheat , I believe that will be the best solution for the company to have a clean competitive game and a healthy player base .
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