Frankly I don’t see them taking the safety limit for it’s pre-multiplier value. That limit is for the risk of aileron reversals, which don’t exist in game, and is not for the structural limit. But being maneuverable is not a requirement to be in the game. It’s high altitude speed alone is what I want it for, too many zombers to intercept during air events.
The difference being, that F-16 depleted 3 missiles for those flares. If it were an R-73, they spend the same amount of flares, while all the missiles are sitting on the rails waiting until you are out of CMs or risk one being fired and never even having the chance of getting decoyed because you stopped preflaring.
yep, you are right
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Have you ever heard slowing down and reversing your enemy? Guess both F-16 pilots and you didnt.
Won’t that just cause issues with the R-73’s guidance, additionally since you are unlikely to win a drawn-out dogfight, why would you commit and risk that occurrence?
Had you kept flying straight and skated you wouldn’t have gotten into flat scissors in the first place. and getting slow is where the F-16 wants you, so you don’t want to be if you can avoid it.
İts much better then constantly pre flaring and getting into risk where your all countermeasures depleted.
İf someone sits at your six at those distance and you cant get away quickly then your best bet will be try to reverse them.
İf F-16 gets slow and forces you to dogfight then you can either run away or join to him, if you decided to stick in a fight where you use Mig-29 or Su-27 you will most likely loose unless you have massive advantage or F-16 pilots makes huge mistakes.
That’s entirely hoping the enemy pilot isn’t managing their closure properly, the MiG-29 and Su-27 are also just better at dumping speed than the F-16, so if an F-16 reverses one, its purely a skill issue on their part.
If anything, they should be worried the F-16 manages to outrate them and turn a defensive posture into an offensive one by doing so, but this is the exact situation where you’d be stuck pre-flaring a possible R-73 shot.
I don’t see anyone here underestimating the AIM-9M or overestimating the R-73 like you say, each missile has its pros and cons and should be used as such. The R-73’s only real issue is the inconsistency of its TVC control, which is a modeling issue which will likely take time to fix. Curse the soviets for coming up with the first widely used TVC missile.
As some have mentionned as well, due to how the flare resistance of the 9M works, its actually very consistent to flare if you know what you’re doing. The difficulty is more in detecting a launch with its smokeless motor, but thats not an issue in air RB because of the baby mode missile diamond no other game mode has, which btw, favours the R-73 by invalidating an advantage of the 9M.
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Just because you can dump your speed faster then F-16 doesnt mean you’re gonna win instantly, F-16 shits on both planes in dogfight.
İt has nothing to do with skill issue.
You do realize in game F-16 turns as fast as both Mig-29 and Su27 can while having much better sustained fight capabilities right?
İf both pilots have same skill levels then there is not much Mig-29/Su-27 can do in that case.
Same goes for R-73’s as well, if you know how to deal with you can constantly counter R-73 without issues.
This is actually really funny because you either misunderstand what I said, or have no idea what I’m talking about.
A reversal can only happen if the bandit in the offensive position fails to properly manage their closure rate and leaves the control zone. If you manage to fail managing your closure rate in a jet that dumps energy faster than the defensive jet, in this case a MiG-29/Su-27 offensive against an F-16, that is very much a skill issue. You made a mistake, the enemy punished you for it by reversing you.
Assuming the REDFOR pilot actually properly manages their closure rate and remains in the control zone, the only threat to them is the F-16 outrating them, which is what the F-16 is good at, but is also what the R-73 helps counter, and the exact scenario people are referencing when they say you can sit on the F-16’s tail and keep them in a preflaring situation.
Yes, that’s because the F-16 outrates them both… as I’ve already said…
The whole point of the HMD+R-73 in this scenario is to limit the ability of the F-16 to actually to outrate you by threatening a HOBS shot with the R-73 if they continue to sit on their AB and/or stop pre-flaring.
We’re literaly debating a scenario where the MiG-29/Su-27 starts offensive against a defending F-16 right now. If you seriously don’t think you can win a fight where you start offensive in a MiG-29/Su-27 vs an F-16, thats the very definition of a skill issue.
The counter to an R-73 is much less consistent than defeating the AIM-9M seeker, which is countered by flaring and abruptly changing directions to cause the seeker to lose you in the process of blinding itself and continuing inertial guidance for a short period to avoid “seeing” flares. The counter to an R-73 is predominantly positional and lots of flares, as the seeker does not shut itself off, it only shrinks its FoV.
F-16 has same agility that Su-27/Mig-29 has, has better energy retention, better acceleration and sustained turn capabilities. İts whole lot more then just sustained fight.
Yes assuming R73’s will work fine or will not go to single flare dependin on the aspect.
You mean by simply pre flaring one or two times and get into Side aspect? Doesnt sound too much issue tbh, also let me remind you that as long as single flare sits in R-73’s fov missile itself will instantly goes to decoy instead of actual target.
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Stg you must be a brick wall that’s somehow managed to type stuff. You clearly don’t understand what’s being said so this is a waste of time.
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Here,let me give you demonstration buddy.
While i was having dogfight against Mig-29G (which is basically best Mig-29 for dogfight) i was easily able to hold myself together despite having 2 drop tanks and more weight, meanwhile first R-73 that was fired from Mig-29 failed miserably and second one fired from J-11 went for my flares despite bein really slow and keeping my AB on.
Now surely you can give me good explanation for this i believe.
I would also like to hear your opinion on this, especially the part where R-73 failed.
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first missile from the mig-29 spun out completely and didn’t work properly. Second one you pre-flared unless you could tell the j-11 was shooting at you when you weren’t even looking at it.
Exactly, current R73’s are not reliable and will do such bs things as i said before.
Didnt even bother to pre flare J-11 cause i wasnt even paying attention to him until Mig-29 Lost its wing tip, even then when i started flaring as soon as i saw the missile my AB was still on for a good sec.
This is about the worst video you could post to try to make your point.
The first R-73 was dead off the rails because of its TVC failing it, it’s a bug, not a missile shortcoming.
The second is fired close to front aspect, and just outside of ideal range anyway. It’s about the only way an R-73 can be flared without preflaring when fired from within ideal range. It also very obviously was tracking the dead MiG-29, which seems to affect every IR missile, preferring teammates to enemies when both are available.
And neither of those shots demonstrate the usage in a dogfight which is what we are talking about
Denying hard evidence and making excuses i see, not surprised.
What happened to part where R-73 would always find its target in 1km range? Judging those claims it should’ve suppose to try to follow my lead at least.
İt was a clear side aspect shot.
R-73’s can also be flared by side aspect.
Missile changed its direction as soon as saw my flares despite i was afterburning for a couple seconds while in very slow position.
First Shot that was fired from Mig-29 suppose to demonstrate R73’s flare resistance and agility in dogfight, sadly R-73 failed like usually do in those situations.
No. It’s autopilot failed. From there it is impossible to tell whether the missiles tracking would have been good enough to defeat any flaring you did. It’s an autopilot bug that affects ALL TVC missiles, not just the R-73.
And again, the second missile just as likely, was never locked onto you off the rails, as it had a friendly target in the background, which all IR missiles seem to prefer.
You also conveniently posted a video without sensor view enabled. At this point in time, I would consider anything posted as evidence ,in regards to missile function or flight performance, without it enabled worth diddly-squat.
As i mentioned countless times.
R-73’s are not reliable and will do such things as long as those bugs stay stills.
Like how other guy did posted video about defeating Aim-9M missile? Didnt saw any complains from you for that video.
You can deny and claim whatever you want cause i dont care after these reply but i will keep in mind making videos that has sensors on so i can avoid future accusations like this.
Cheers.
F-16 and F-15s have much better flight models than MiG-29 or Su-27.
It’s much faster to kill an Su-27 or MiG-29 just by going slower than it because neither plane is as good at recovering energy. As long as F-16 or F-15 aren’t rear-locked from R-73 at close range then it’s going to be in favor of 16/15.
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