Only if R-27ER had IOG and DL that still allowed it to kill things below 100m with a fair degree of consistancy or if MP even at 100m could be mitigated by firing down onto the target…
Hmm…
but point still stands. ONLY regime something like the Torando F3 might have done well in, is BVR. But do you know what one thing it could never, ever partake in because the R-27ER so totally dominated the meta
sound like excuse to me
have like eight to ten missiles and twin powerful engine figure it out what you should do will ya?
instead go dog fight with light weight canard delta wing fighter.
Once again, 27ER was trivial to defeat with MP, just like all radar missiles.
In order to fire down onto the target you need to be high up, which leaves you vulnerable to enemy SARH. Doesn’t look like a good idea to me though.
You’re the one that needs to tell me that, as you’re the one that claimed you don’t need to dogfight with it.
The issue was that you couldn’t avoid the merge. With mp even currently as it is, you usually can just force a merge and win the dogfight.
He knows that but is unwilling to concede as he’s literally unable to admit anything from RU has ever been anything but brokenly OP.
You can have powerful twin engines but if they’re mounted on a flying brick your cheeks are gonna get clapped 10 seconds after the merge anyways.
to his credit, the r27er was meta defining, mostly while it was easily defeated with mp. It also shifted the meta more into the low deck furball meta because at the time, if you didnt have an er, you just lost every bvr fight. it wasnt meta defining in that it was good, but in that it forced your opponents into a specific situation. the su27 just could never take advantage of the situations it created. having gripens or f16c on your team would usually take the most advantage of the suppression an su27 could create.
So much cope bro, The flanker was good enough and the Aim9M could and can be defeated by pre flaring and was also crap when merged. Gripen was great but that doesn’t mean the Flanker was bad.
Yeah, it forced enemies to play the game that suits their aircraft and not the 27ER carries which is kind of funny when you think about it, as you basically created a “meta” that works against you.
does most Russian pilot don’t have brain to think for themselves or something?
I mean how you beat zero in bf-109? go dog fight?
that skills issue
same things use SU-27 go dog fight Gripen lose and think they are suffered?
The difference is that the gripen can catch the su27 rather easily unlike a bf109/zero also you don’t have to be in gun range. You can try to stay bvr but what do you do when they just abuse mp and force a merge? You die.
You’re the one that claimed something but is now unwilling to explain that.
Flanker was good enough to not fall out of the sky after half of a turn, that’s about it.
It was pretty bad at closer ranges, just like 27SM is now against EFT and Rafale.
I mean, i cant give you “exact” numbers on when the community became widely cognisant of multipathing as a method of defeat for radar missiles, nor can you, so thats not really an argument either of us can pull concrete numbers on.
What I can say however is that the R-27ER was added during update “Apex Predator” (Dec 2022), while earliest mentions of multipath by name are from around summer 2023 on forums/youtube/subreddit.
Flying low as a method of defeat for radar missiles has been mentionned since before then in some videos but does not seem to be commonly brought up til around mid to late 2023, likely becoming “common knowledge” around the same time as the info begins being spread by CC’s.
Even then, the R-27ER has always been considered the best fox 1 in WT by far, and the “overwhelming advantage” of the R-27ER could not be entirely negated by simply flying low, seeing as by using multipathing, all you do is negate a missiles ability to kill you directly in exchange for sacrificing positionning and energy to do so.
Pretending the R-27ER wasnt a problem just because multipath exists ingame is disingenuous, and also wildly off topic at this point.
it can’t if does not bleed speed first it can’t even catch MiG-29
Gripen really don’t have lot of TWR and SU-27 definitely aren’t slow plane.
You are in twin engine heavy fighter with lot of missiles and best long range in front of you are light weight canard delta wing fighter that every good in dog fight with shtty long range missile (skyflash lol) ofc you can’t beat them in dog fight what you going to do?
1.try hard and go dog fight with it anyway?
2.or other way around? use high speed and TWR advantage?
because if you pick first choice then congrat you are fool. (even F-15 a US main know not to do that)
Well you should as you’re the one that claimed it wasn’t used.
I gave you a clear solution to the problem and your only argument against it was that no one knew about it. Unless you find me hard numbers on that, I don’t think you should use it as an argument because it’s a hearsay.
Multipath was added in May 2019 and it’s effect was clearly explained in a devblog.
It wasn’t hard to notice by yourself either, as your radar lock started acting up as soon as the locked target descended through the MP height.
Positioning means nothing when your 27ER slinger is a bus though.
People could abuse MP to merge with you and club you in a dogfight.
It’s not, it’s just a reality some people don’t want to accept.
Just like the fact EFT is the best dogfighter in the game, which you yourself still aren’t accepting.
So how to kill a Gripen if you can’t come close while he’s abusing MP which turns your best long range missiles into a deadweight ?
You can absolutely catch an su27. you’re just making up nonsense now.
when did i say you can’t? you just don’t dog fight with it
if you stay high what he going to do? shoot skyflash at you? (gonna miss anyway if he bothers carrying one)
and in environment of 16VS16
even more chance than what i said above (I done it with MiG-29G before that even less amount of missile than SU-27 two time less)
Yes, and he will kill you. Especially since the su27 has no real recourse aside from notch. He’ll just lock you into notching until he’s close enough for a 9m shot.