The sdkfz 234/1 and the 140/1 both have the same mount and are light tanks, so if anything making the 222 a light tank is putting it in line with the others in the tree
They are premiums though, so I’m not sure if they count.
I would say they count, the 222 is an armoured scout car, in the exact same manner as the puma, and the pz38 derivitive. They are not SPAA, the fact the gun can elevate is just a bonus, its the equivilent of calling the bmp-2 an spaa as it too can shoot down planes
I’d say it would count if sdkfz 222 was a premium vehicle, like others.
Or, others were regular tech tree vehicles.
bmp-2 is a post World war 2 vehicle, I wouldn’t really mix it in into our discussion (since it also gets new targets, like helicopters).
From a F2P perspective, someone who does not have access to these premium vehicles, they may as well don’t exist.
Basically, as I said earlier, I’d agree to move it to light tank classification, if the spawn point system was more generous/rational. Otherwise… I’d rather see it as a premium vehicle then, so we wouldn’t have this discussion.
Its a rank one, the respawn points difference is neglible, especially if light vehicles like this should be your first spawn most of the time, in order to set up in positions and cap points in the early game. If anything you should be asking for scouting to be given to rank one light tanks.
I prefer to move it to rank 2, so it gets scouting ability, and also presents a slight improvement to other SPAAs, in terms of armor.
But if its an spaa it wouldent get scouting. It would honestly be better to have light tanks at rank one just get scouting then those locusts and bt-7 roving around at top tier can also scout.
Fair enough.
I think SPAAs should also get scouting, since they are quite defenseless often.
I imagined it going from 2 crewed flakpanzers, which are quite vulnerable, then sdkfz6/2 which is a glass cannon (firepower sacrificing armor), and entering rank 2 you get armored cars and halftracks (balanced approach between firepower and armor). Entering rank 3 are tank conversions into SPAAs (armor improvements), which kind of makes it a somewhat logical progression and a sense of evolution.
Also something i have just mulled, but because who ever did this BR compression did it based on realistic BR doesnt that mean alot of these folders clearly done due to shared brs instead of vehicle capabilities could rapidly become redundant, especially in regards to the aircraft, as it is not uncommon for planes to raise and drop .3 br. so the change as implemented now will get even more disjointed and impractical as time progresses
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Why? They may not be related but at the end of the day it makes grinding easier which seems like the main focus of gaijin with new folders. There isnt any harm to players.
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Vechicles should not be foldered with vehicles these are in no way related to. Having to grind one additional vehicle is not the end of the world Especially if have changed the folder so the difference remains the same.
Can you explain me what is the problem with foldering unrelated vehicles?
They play nothing alike, and in often times are completely unrelated in development e.g that Sherman/t34 folder in the chinese tree, or the pt.76 and comet in sweden. For a combination of neatness, and simple logic they should not be combined together, as already stuff is getting lost in folders. As just from a glance here can you tell me what is in these folders
and then you just have hot messes like this one here:
where a 2 second evaluation would have made you think “yeah i will just make an oilfant and rooikat folder”.
if they really wanted to they could folder that first mig 21 in with the other mig 21s which would make more sense. The thing is you still have to grind out 5 vehicles at that rank, so your going to have to do these anyway, so it doesn’t effect your grind in any meaningful way if the changes suggested here are implemented. The fact its clearly for the most part been done with current RB brs also means its going to get even worse as time goes on, especially in air where up and down .3 brs is a common thing every time they rebalance.
I do get where you are comming from. Seperating these just increases the grind again. But folders should be made based on vehicle type, and not on vehicle BR or just because they happen to be in the same line.
The La-200 and La-15 for example. The La-200 is a twin engine, 3 x 37mm autocannon interceptor. The La-15 is a single engined 23mm armed jet fighter. Foldering these two just makes no sense.
Same goed for the MiG-19 and 21, both the jets are just not the same. The 21 was made after the MiG-19, and it pretty much replaced it. So why folder it with the MiG-19 then where it will be forgotten? It’s an important step in the evolution of Russian Jet development.
Instead what Gaijin should do is invest time in future updates to add new vehicles to existing aircraft and folder those. So they could add a Lavochkin La-168 together with the La-15 in a folder.
And for the MiG-19 and 21’s they could add more exotic versions of them, such as the MiG-19SU High-altitude version (It’s a MiG-19 with a rocket booster under the belly).
So my conclusion is, folders should be used to pair together multible vehicles of the same type. By foldering different vehicle types will just end up making people skip most of them even tho they are important from a ingame line-up point of view, or from a historical development point of view.
Isnt that why gaijin is reducing foldered vehicles research cost? Also having to purchase a vehicle doesnt mean people will play it. I already bought mig21 f13 and havent even crewed it nor i am planing to.
The reduction of RP cost for foldered vehicles will make it more appealing for people to branch of and research more variants of aircraft within folders. It is exactly this that makes it perfect to use folders for more variants of existing aircraft.
In my mind when you progress through the tree you should get progress futher into newer aircraft. MiG-15, MiG-17, MiG-19, MiG-21, etc. And folders should be used to add more aircraft of an existing type. In the long run this will make everything look much more clean, and with any future BR changes these folders will also not fall apart.
If you folder two different aircraft types, like a fighter and interceptor, then the BR’s and playstyles between those are constandly changing. This will make the folder constandly change too. And maybe even at some point the folder won’t even make sense anymore because the BR’s of the two foldered vehicles have spread so far apart by BR changes that it will be required that the Folder get’s seperated anyways.
Folders that only include vehicles of the same type or design are much more reliable and won’t fall apart in the long term.
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Basically this, the folders as is now will disintergate within a year due to aircraft br changes, which already are rather volitile
I have also been ruminating on the rank changes, if this goes into effect as they have presented it, alot of tree vehicles are going to become worse for grinding due to them going down in ranks, along with being straight up worthless for doing events as you need a min of rank III and lots of stuff has dipped under that to rank II now
The poor american Helldiver, no longer of use for specials, good job the french one isnt going down
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The ranks are another issue of their own, and the more i look the more crop up, Gaijin is going to have to change certain things regarding this or alot of line ups for events have no ceased to exist.