People will need a tutorial to take down the new bombers now…
I don’t want to see any bomber with a 20mm be sent to 9.3 and I don’t think a loading screen tip will help.
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Is there also a list of the bombers that now have enhanced damage models? And does this also affect those bombers that are already annoying anyway, such as the SB2C Helldiver & B7A2 Ryusei?
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Yeah, does it include stuff like P-61s, Do-217 Zs, ki-109 or basically any plane with more than 2 engines?
Did they see at least a small buff?
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What happened to good ole’ FAFO? = )
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Yeah, 25, sorry. What’s the difference? Point is, you need to climb if you want to survive. Bombers needs to be part of the battle, no one wants them to spawn in space.
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Yeah go on, climb
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Since bombers got a change is there a chance other planes also get a change to survivability.
Whilst i appreciate your efforts - i looks like that you try to cure a heavy disease with a new pain medicine without touching the real root cause of (prop) bombers being a pain - similar as trying to spade the P 108 A with the 105 mm cannon in Air RB (i do this currently).
Survivability is way more affected by:
- Artificial spread of manual gunnery (below 20mm) in Q4 2022
- Plain stupid and undeserved “Air defense fighter” spawns at 2 km instead of 1 km - like for 7 twin engine fighters from the UK
- Lack of experienced pilots due to missing game (ticket) impact - and high risk vs low benefit sorties
- Plain stupid bugs on several 3 bases maps which denies the enemy airfield as bombing target - the reports are open for ages
- Change of certain maps to “air spawn for all” which allows even non air spawn fighters to get a co-altitude before you can drop
- Plain stupid “Michal Bay”-effects due to the highly unrealistic possibility to detonate bombs in the bomb bay
All of this is described in detail in the forum - so you just scratch on the surface of a way larger problem.
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With bombers you need to climb and flank
Ensure at least 5km of altitude or 4.5km for lower spawns.
You can’t just walk into the map center and expect to come out alive.
And this is from someone who is spading all bombers currently.
Be interesting to see how Severe Damage kill awards factor in alongside this.
Whether it’ll be harder to get that as well, or it’s just causing total destruction of the bomber that becomes harder.
Some of the BP tasks/challenges will probably want adjusting if it becomes too difficult to be credited with killing a bomber.
I think people might be content if fighters can still severely damage bombers quite readily and be rewarded for it, while the bomber is left in a condition where the pilot is impaired keeping it in the air, level, at altitude and on-course, but able to continue to try and attack the objective and earn something themselves.
Gaijin seem to acknowledge that most bomber losses occurred outside of the time of engagement by enemy fighters, so it’s still somewhat consistent if Severe Damage is awarded as is, and the “kill” award is only rescinded by bombers returning to the airfield.
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Looking forward to this
Correct.
But, you spawn and try to climb a bit to dodge there Intercepter
You drop you load and RTB
You reload and takeoff if you are lucky you can drop again if you could climb enough.
This entire 60 → 25 change was just to much…
Instead of cutting it instant to 25 the snail should have tested it before with 45/35/30
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Very interesting data for sure, also nice to see that you reference the image origins to the point where we can actually look up the documents ourselves, that’s very much appreciated.
For those who do not know where to find them;
https://www.recherche.bar.admin.ch/recherche/#/en/search/advanced
Though there is something that is worth noting imo, especially with the mention of fires etc. being extremely fatal for such aircraft.
Currently, it often feels as if the probability of causing a fire is quite low for certain shells. Particularly anti-aircraft HEI munition (Minensprengbrandgranaten), which often contain high percentages of aluminium additives in the shells’ filler.
One example for this would be HEXAL P30 used (a.o.) in Oerlikon’s 35 mm ammunition.
This explosive filler is made up out of 66% Hexogen (RDX), 30% Aluminium Powder and 4% Polyurethane.
This very high amount of aluminium causes extremely high incendiary effects irl, however, in the game, it’s already quite underwhelming.
As a reference, this is the effect of a singular 35 mm MSD-042 Mine-HEI shell (likely standard target WWW 1600 671)
courtesy of: https://www.small-arms-import.ch/
Probably goes without saying, but the penetrative capability of the shells’ blast-effect is also quite underwhelming.
Oerlikon 35 mm Munition für die Maschinenkanonen Typen KDC, KDB und KDA (1975)
Oerlikon 35mm Field Air Defence Gun GDF-005 with SKYGUARD Fire Control (1988)
I really hope that the effect of HEI / Mine-HEI shills with higher filler-contents than the ADEN/DEFA or HS 831-L are being considered thoroughly for these changes.
Though even the HS-831L HEI shells (UIA) with their comparatively low filler-mass arent exactly harmless either;
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That doesn’t work above BR 2.7/3.0 in Air RB, these days are long gone. See my longer comment for more details…
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Got all of the prop bombers spaded and with most of them you CAN’T climb, no matter what you do
The devs need to have them spawn at their max ceiling height instead of artificially increasing the HP of the modules
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Pretty cool, bombers will be more enjoyable. Though I doubt the large ones can really be viable the way they are in game, irl they were in large formations that could effectively defend themselves while in the game each bomber is a lone target with only a few guns aimed at a target at a given angle
Which is where the flanking part comes in.
Also there are bombers that will actually just climb away
Much like ki-49(late variants), M.b.162, h8k, me-264 and countless others at lower tiers.
Stuff like B-17s don’t fall behind, they have quite the pace above 5km compared to stuff like B-24s
But there are bombers who can’t reach said altitudes like Yer-2s, B-25s and many other too, I won’t deny.
And I don’t like them.
Yes, that’s how bombers works. You expect dogfights? Not sure where are you heading with this.
Vast majority of battles ends much faster than the counter (25min).
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This is in place for ages. On “standard” maps: Air spawn at 4,500m for strategic bombers - all others at 3,500 meters…
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