Chances are, they add it to Britain whilst ‘we do not rule it out as a future addition to the German tree, but for now, better options are available soonTM’.
And then go ahead and add either the EMBT or KF-51 to the German tree or the Leo 2A-RC 3.0
For the record I accept Germany has a fair claim here, I also think they’ve got better domestic options without diluting the trees. I also think Rheinmetall selected a Challenger as a way of advertising that there was growth potential in their RBSL design for growth to 130mm relatively easily.
Talking it to death doesn’t fix the problem and I’d wager its better to look at established gaijin additions patterns, which suggest my outcome as more probable than yours to be honest.
It just says Germany is developing a new tank, the Leopard 3, that as of yet doesn’t appear to actually exist and therefore cannot be added. If you’re willing to wait a few years then fair enough, but I imagine your fellow German mains would complain a lot in that time.
At this time, Germany could get the Leopard 2A8, which ingame likely wouldn’t really be much better than the 2A7V or the Leopard 2RC 3.0 which is a French-Germany project.
It just says Germany is developing a new tank, the Leopard 3, that as of yet doesn’t appear to actually exist and therefore cannot be added.
A TD is expected by 2028 :P
which ingame likely wouldn’t really be much better than the 2A7V
Well, LWS, APS, more armor on the sides and in general (as the turret is newly built so it’d have the same armor as hull), maybe finally fixed armor (considering 2A7V already should have much more armor than the 122s xD), MP/4th gen thermals, auto-track, and guess what, 2A8s remove the physical channel that the optics create in the right turret cheek, that gets replaced by a fibre-optic cable connection, so moar turret armor too :P
These are decent additions but they are more quality of life, trophy adds a lot of weight and isn’t really useful at all in tank-tank engagements ingame. A lot of the time it’s just dead weight, and I believe the Leopard 2A8 is pushing 70 tonnes because of it.
More modern shells would be nice, but gaijin seems to be terrified of adding anything better than DM53 and they aren’t exclusive to the 2A8.
I’ve heard this before but I haven’t really seen any evidence that the armour has been upgraded past D tech, I wouldn’t be surprised if it has, but info is very scarce.
KMW themselves states 2A7V has a new armor package in their material for the tank, and D-tech is 1990s, so…
Then there’s the fact 122s don’t even have D-tech, they have C-tech + MEXAS-H add-ons, now, according to a few certain docs, D-tech was capable of providing 650mm RHAe KE, as opposed to C-tech’s 430mm (both along a +/- 30 arc fyi), so y’know, if just this were to get modelled, 2A7Vs armor would still be far superior to 122s :P
and I believe the Leopard 2A8 is pushing 70 tonnes because of it.
It makes sense, but you run into the same issue we will have with the production Challenger 3s, we have no idea what the protection levels of both the 2A8 and CR3s new armour arrays are. I guess gaijin could just make it up, but they may just stick witht the 2A7V values as the armour is visually the same externally.
I’ve seen 69-70 tonnes, with the same top speed 61kph as the 2A7V, only 1kph faster than the Challenger 3. If they modelled the rearranged gearing of the 2A8 it might be ok, but otherwise it may feel a bit sluggish.
That is certainly an area where having trophy is very beneficial, apart from if they fire more than 2 at a time and your launchers are on reload after the first 2. Either way its much better than not having an APS.
We don’t really have an idea about 2A7Vs armor values either tbh, I’m just giving an example of what they’d have been if Gaijin actually took TVM max values and added the 220mm RHAe KE difference between C-tech and D-tech (so y’know, 750mm KE hull + 220mm, ~860mm KE turret + 220mm, you get the point). 2A8s hull values should at the very least be the same as 2A7Vs (if fixed), while turret receives the new improved armor package due to new turrets, and has less weakpoints than previous iterations.
apart from if they fire more than 2 at a time and your launchers are on reload after the first 2.
Tbf, they might also just leave you alone if they see an APS, considering they can use LMURS on easier targets :D
Certain sources do state 600mm KE for D-Tech rather than 650mm KE, but I don’t think its unreasonable to use the 650mm KE as it is stated in places.
Another thing that confuses me is that for the KVT it seems to infer that the D-Tech armour is the armour addons, but then it also says its integrated. The KVT came before the TVM, so perhaps the TVM did have D tech already?
Here is the thing, the KF51 and the Challenger 130, have the same status to germany.
Both a german main developed tank variants, that arent used by anyone.
But whose standard version is in / will be in service of other countries.
Now if we dont “fight” for the Challenger 130, who says gajin isnt just gonna do the same to the KF51 and only give it to italy/hungary and say
a lot of us do not want a repeat of the KF41.
EMBT as well as the Leo 2 ARC 3.0 are good tanks, but they are 120mm versions.
The EMBT 140 ATD is a french gun urgh, and was a mock up, while a life fire version was teased today for eurosatory by KNDS frnace. You can beat your the french gonna fight for that one.
Now here we are Challenger 130 went to Uk, KF51 to italy, EMBT 140 to France.
While germany gets old developed 140mm leopards from last generation, which is not fair.
When germany literaly was the main hand at all those mbts, but we get the crumbs?
So for germany its literaly go bank or bust, a game of survivial.
following the vickers mk 7 it would go to germany alone. KF41 and the boxer are different situations
and leclerc evolution was knds france.
It is specialy differentiated, neither had a hand in the other.
Well partialy leclerc evolution used the co developed embt turret
the reload is quite fast, it has to be cause eurothrophy is only 2 ready to fire
