Imagine having TOG II and centurion both in same BR, nice line up.
Accidentally gets TOG II at 6.0 because i was too funny.
Oh before you ask, i am using TOG II at 6.3 BR games, here’s my line up.
I would use TOG II over the Crapioteer and Peasantrion Mk.1
Germany main crying about one decent tank of the least overpowered nation when a literal Panther sits at 5.0 LMFAO
Your having a laugh, im a brit main and because of my stats im told i dont know how to play by those who have not played brit. Im now grinding sweden lol
The cent mk1 is basically just a slow, slightly better armored panther with better pen and worse post-pen. Not to mention the highly unstable gun. 6.0 is fine.
You say they were dumb enough to chase you… well that might explain some of your success.
The thing is… it’s not just 1 vs 1 on the battlefield. Tiger’s 80mm side and back armour means it can survive many flank hits the centurion can not.
And the Tiger’s gun is waaaaaaay better for doing post-pen damage. Many tanks can survive one shot from the 17lbr, but hardly any tanks survive a pen from the 88.
Tiger also has 5 crew vs 4 in the Cent.
I’m an American main XD- but the fact that a Panther is at 5.0 is ridiculous I agree.
Panther is NOT 5.0. that’s the VK 3002 baby panther which has only 60mm armour on glacis and a terrible turret rotation.
Firefly gets a 17lbr at BR 4.7 and a waaaaay better turret rotation.
The “baby panther” is way faster than the firefly, has better gun depression, and has way more explosive filler than the 17lber. In many ways it is better than the Panther D. The armor does it’s job well enough. It is not comparable to the Firefly at all.
In which ways is “vk 3002 better than the panther D?”
If your gonna go ahead and discount turret rotation (which is massively different 38.4 vs 9.6) then you obviously are not interested in a true discussion. You can’t cheery-pick some stats and ignore others.
Firefly has a .50 cal mg and ony has to face BR 6.0 tanks when it is not the primary tank in garage. Vk 3002 can and does meet those tanks often. The add-on armour gives the firefly better flank armour than the vk 3002.
It is lighter and faster than the Panther D (at the cost of some UFP armor that doesn’t affect the outcome of most engagements) and sits at a lower BR.
And I’m not “cherry-picking.” For one, the turret rotation speed doesn’t even matter that much when you engage at medium to long ranges where the VK is a monster. At close range the difference between a VK and a Firefly may be more muted, but the Firefly is going to have to shoot more than once in most circumstances and the VK can use it’s superior mobility to turn the turret without solely relying on the turret rotation and doesn’t even have to aim. The .50 cal is nice but I’d much rather be in the VK and absolutely destroy tanks than have a .50 cal to pepper a plane or kill open-top vehicles that I could have killed with my main gun anyway.
What 6.0 tanks are you concerned about? Maybe the Centurion Mk 1? I can’t really think of any other vehicles at 6.0 that the VK might struggle to destroy except for the 75mm Jumbo Shermans, but they have shitty guns too that will struggle against the Panther. That’s more than you can say for most vehicles in full up-tiers.
The Firefly is also a glass cannon. With no APHE so will 99% of it’s BR able to kill it it’s fair there.
That is absolutely untrue. To say that it is just “some” UFP armor is ridiculous.
17 pounder APCBC, Russian 85 mm APHEBC and US 90 mm APCBC cannot go through a normal Panther UFP unless quite literally at point blank.
However, against the VK 30.02 (M)'s UFP, these cannons can penetrate it up to 1400, 1500 and over 2000 meters respectively with the mentioned ammunition types. Even the US 76 mm with APCBC can penetrate up to 200 meters.
Edit: Additionally, the turret armor and mantlet of the VK 30.02 (M) is weaker than a normal Panther’s. The turret front itself is 80 mm, and the mantlet is weaker because:
Here, to better illustrate the 2nd point on the mantlet.
VK 30.02 (M):
Panther D (and other Panthers bar the Panther F):
I do just fine with the VK- I use it in the same line-up with the Panther D- and un-spaded it already is doing better. Also it’s not an armor reduction in a vacuum- it’s greater maneuverability makes it equally survivable to the Panther D.
Game gives D and VK same speed forward and reverse. “some UFP” is 20mm sloped. That is not insignificant. Easily the difference between pen and not pen.
Battles are not fought on a flat empty plain. Even the desert maps have hills. So yes, turret rotation comes into play a lot. Especially in Realitic battles where computer doesn’t show you enemy hiding in foliage 700m away.
With a 50 cal mg the firefly can tear up many SPAAs that would give the Vk 3002 nightmares if they get close. The vk 3002 would never touch them with its ridiculously slow turret.
Vk 3002 has a great gun for it’s BR but has more weaknesses than you are willing to admit. A Challenger at 5.0 can beat the Vk. I know this as I use it regularly and destroy Vks and even 6.0 Panthers by flanking them.
Arcade:
Realistic:
I am curious about what math you ran because they don’t… do that?
Arcade stats: Both tanks have 0.5 KD, approx. 0.45 KB with Panther D having 0.4468 and VK having 0.4528, but Panther D has 60% WR and VK only 49%. VK also has more deaths per battle on average.
Realistic stats: Both tanks have same number of kills, but VK has more deaths. VK also has more battles, and lower WR. This gives the VK a lower KB, a lower KD and a lower WR. Literally the opposite of what you stated.
Nonetheless this is an extremely small amount of battles in either tank. No real argument can be made here unless someone just wants to stat shame which is probably what you wanted to do here (since “git gud”).
Oh, my bad. I’m a bit dyslexic. I’ll remove point two if it makes you feel better.
Standing by point 1 and 3. Call it “stat shaming” if you will- I’m just saying that he should actually play the vehicles more before determining which is better. He’s barely played either of them, and he clearly needs to learn how to play them.
Fair enough.
are yu serious? centurion mk1 good at 6.0? If tiger 88mm flak43 aim carfully , they can destory centurion ,and tiger on 5.7 ,can i say tiger is too good for 5.7?
