Case study: How LMUR helis win GRB match in 7 minutes

Game Discussion Realistic Battle
1

shot 2025.10.01 14.03.17
shot 2025.10.01 14.03.171415×816 191 KB

So there it is. I played some top tier GRB matches, mostly along russian teams. Sadly, I had mostly nothing to do. Wanted to do an SPAA kill task.

I watchted the empty sky for some minutes, while 2-3 Mi-28 + sometimes KH-38 capable jets cleared the maps in minutes. Top killers nowadays always LMUR users. There seems to be no counter. Enemy AA systems are kind of helpless, it seems. The killfeed never stops.

I’d beg game devs to somehow tackle this issue. Do an emergency hotfix and put LMUR choppers at 13.0 BR, so they face just the higherst possible ground tech. Its just not fun.
For a reason, Ger gets too often matched together with RU. How should I play this game, when the bulk of the enemy team gets usually wiped off the map as soon as Mi-28’s spawns? Whats in for us non-Ru players. We join matches and theres nothing to do!

Its just destructive gameplay and worse than the KH-38 menace before. These Lmur helis can be spawned qickly, far quicker than jets. They hover up and volley their LMURs. Then its done. Maps too small. You have the whole ground map scanned in seconds and pick the targets…then spacebaring starts with no counter to prevent this.

Please, do something. I want to participate in GRB battles as well. It can’t be that its just made for Mi-28 players and most others watch an empty map. Get maybe 1 or 2 left overs to kill. How can it be, that a MMO game allows one specific unit to rack up almost more kills than all ground players combined?

  1. Make LMUR helis spawn much farther out, so they need to get into position before they engage. Right now, they hover up and have everything in strike range. A few secs and the missiles are on their way. The time window is obviously not sufficient to do something against it. This can’t be it. >Airfield spawn.

  2. Raise spawn point requirements for these top modern AGM helis. It looks like you don’t need to do alot to get the spawn points for this.

  3. Currently its just BRed at 12.3. Its needs to get bumped up to 13.0. DIRCM and LMUR, killer at this BR.

  4. Reduce the loadout. Less LMURs please.

(5. You should also consider to not put every tech ingame. These long range heli AGMs simply don’t fit the game mechanic. Maps are too small. Helo ports too close for this one. Many more reasons to just not have this ingame right now. It would be no sign of weakness to maybe just roll this back.)

16 Likes
2

If it weren’t for the stock grind for the oplot, I would have quit top tier. The current state is even worse than the Kh-38 era. If they had any real intention to fix top tier quickly—like when they adjusted the 341’s BR to ease the player’s pain—they would have done it by now.

3

Dont forget they also need to rework LDIRCM to limit how many missiles it can impact at one time and give Helis a radar signature.

Both would massively impact the effectiveness of these new helis as at the moment, they can ignore the new SAMs

2 Likes
4

Thats not much different to the tiger uht that spawns in perfect range at close helipad to start spamming PARS at the battlefield. Though those are way less deadly because of heat warhead, much less tnt equiv and somehow they dont have the insane top attack flightpath like the LMURs, (that are 9 out of 10 times one shot one kill), JAGMs and cm502s but that can be negated by just firing 2 at every mbt, one per light tank and 2 or 3 per aa, land and rearm (which is hilarously quick with experted or aced crew)

The snail wants this game to be a rush in and get enough sp for cas like a headless chicken as quick as possible on cod style maps (for top tier) and this is what it is. Some people like it, some people don’t. For my feeling it gets boring very quickly because thats all that everyone is doing, tactical playing is out the window and if you try to advance more careful into an advantageous position you will realize that 3 enemy players already made it into cas (so now you can’t do anything at the position you worked for but run and smoke for your dear life) and that you forgot that every ground rb match has to end in under 7 minutes.

Their range is 15 km. You would actually have to put them on the airfield. Have fun spawning any other heli there. Well actually that could be good, but with the match durations due to ticket drain that makes using any other heli except one of the three new ones pointless (while you try to cover the distance and get into position using a tiger uht, had or any hellfire slinger 9 out of 10 matches will end before you fired your first missile. Especially because somehow on some maps those climb with an astonishing 2 m/s, a “bug” that feels like it exists as long as helis in wt do)

Yes. As in the past with cas 1 cap one assist, 1 kill one assist is enough to get another (at least) 3 free kills anywhere on the map. Just why?

Does that do anything?

12 seconds reload on far helipad for experted crew. Does it make a big difference if it gets 4 instead of 8 LMURS? Ah64e still has 16 JAGMs with 16 km range and Z10 has 16 cm502s with 25 km range (wtf is the statcard correct about that?) or 12 and still 4 TY90s (funny how that is the same BR like the UHT but has actually dangerous aa ir missiles, a chin mounted turret, ircm and way better atgms)

5

Much more importantly, UHTs are and were killable by SPAA, IR was already struggeling to get locks on helis, now its even harder. Radar is still unrealiable as hell and now the new AGMs outrange most SACLOS missiles. Its a massive powercreep in offense and defense without even a slight BR correction

6

yeah, they need to somehow change how these things doppler return works to account for the longer distances they can shoot at the battlefield and how the new spaas work. as it is now you need to be extremely careless to get hit by any of the new spaas in the new helis.

UHT and the other tiger helis were still the hardest to kill because of how fast they could effectively dive (lower their collective) or roll (because of their much higher rollrate) and because they barely have to expose themselves. But especially the uht was and is almost defenseless vs planes.

7

Absolutely true but thats what i mean. The new Helis can do everything the UHT could but better. They might be less mobile but do you need that with 16km missiles, DIRCM and a chingun?

1 Like
8

Tiger HAD, UHT or any other variation is dangerous, if Gaijin fixes or make HEAT warhead more accurate which I doubt, the EC won’t be any different from Mi-28NM, Z-10ME or AH-64E even without countermeasures, manual guided anti-air systems are not reliable for this target and I think that active homing missiles will struggles depending on the terrain as most of these uses the ‘pop-and-boom’ tactic, requiring little exposure.

9

Helicopter era, just great.

10

this is russian game ,russsian company.you will get nothing to against with The Great Russia.you have to play rus and you will get the best game experience,why dont you do that? a host of player has done this,which can be prove by russia queue number covincingly : )

2 Likes
11

I know that SACLOS is not realiable at all. I just wanted to emphasise that the new helis are better protected against any type of SPAA than the previous helicopters ever were.

12

Welcome to real world combat 101:

Your main objective in ground combat is not actually fighting the enemy, it’s engaging the most threatening and high value target in your combat zone.

Your combat zone should realistically (in war thunder) 3 light air defense system, and at least 2 static short range air defense systems, in our cases, something like the SAMP or SLAMRAAM as you’re probably not gonna have the BUK on your team.

Constantly having a working team of Combat Air Patrol, SAM installation, and ground troops is the only effective way to combat CAS on both teams. Even then, modern tactics with even the most basic of weapons activates a totally different type of warfare.

(Please don’t lock my account or ban me mods, this is just an example, not a political statement about the war) In Ukraine, both Russia and Ukraine operate SU-25 and Mi-24/35 helicopters, they both use the landscape of fields and windbreaks to keep out of line of sight of their enemy, on both sides. They both stay low, use pop up tactics, and strike using CCRP methods. The helicopters have been seen doing low collective pullback maneuvers to launch S-8 rockets at installations, while Su-25 have been using popup tactics with all types of bombs and rockets.

In modern warfare, these long range weapons aren’t used for targets that don’t hold massive strategic importance, singular vehicles or tanks, but focus more on more costly assets like Ships, SAM sites, and bunkers. But in the light of war thunder, it doesn’t work that way.

There are counters, so either encourage your team to counter, or counter at your own discretion.

13

Game should be the one encouraging this.

3 Likes
14

Spike and PARS are very weak. You need several to kill an SPAA truck and MBTs are almost impossible to kill, except you fire 3 or even 4. Sometimes even a BMP hull survives a PARS hit. Its a whole league lower than LMUR. You just have 8 ATGMs and the range requires you often to leave the heliport area. So no quick up and downs to restock and to flood the ground maps with endless ATGM rapid fire. Mi-28 just needs to hoover up and down without even moving off a single meter from their pad.

Pars warhead is too weak and the attack pattern is programmed in a way that they always slam into the side or fron armor. They don’t have this agressive top down of LMUR and others.

I’ve read IRL LMURs use in actual conflicts is restricted to strategic assets. Like there are reports LMUR engaged a bridge in a certain country or buildings. Its likely not used vs single vehicles. Its just not the right choice to include it into a videogame with 1km x 1km maps.

15

I very well know that pars and especially spikes are much less effective vs ground targets than lmurs (which are one hit kill) but

this is literally exactly how pars and spike helis play. You just need 2 per target, sometimes more and you can shoot and be effective from closer to the battlefield because you can dive quicker. how far away from the helipad you are playing is personal preference (safety vs flooding the battlefield) and for me mainly dependant on how many planes/threats are up and how many players are left.

Why not? An aced uht (cant check mine atm can’t access the game) has something like an 8 or 10 second reload? Is that good for gameplay? I dont think so, but using that you can flood the battlefield with f&f atgms the same way the mi28nm and other nations can now for what? 4 years now? And remember: for most of the times is was practically impossible to shoot down incoming f&f atgms.

I think it is off balance in general, the new helis just make it worse. And i love flying all kinds of helis for years now. but now its just spamming f&f ordinance and aa spamming their missiles desparately trying to counter a whole screen of threats (in the new spaa control display)

16

even JAGM doenst loft as high as LMUR despite all evidence showing that it should

it seems that gaijin cant make ATGMs loft properly unless it is a russian missile, because every other countrys missiles that should loft do not do so anywhere near as much as they should

this is particularly noticeable on hellfires because it has time to target of its top attack profile without lofting resulting in a much lower average speed and impact speed which makes the missiles pull very sluggishly

17

shh don’t say that or the fanboys of lmur will showup and say that that is total bs …

Wiping off entire battlefield while all you can do is suck it up becuase of “reasons”

18

So 3 highly skilled players did a good job in a match against an average American team.
I don’t see anything happening because you’re omitting information that could help form a more accurate conclusion.

AH-64E and Z-10ME would have to join the Mi-28NM for any BR changes of course.

19

ah yes, “skilled” I bet at least 2 of them were just flying high above the close heli pad spamming LMURs and rearming

the significantly lower damage on their missiles and unrealistically low lofting make them less oppressive

1 Like
20

It should indeed

1 Like